1 hour ago, 5050Saint said:

Predictive Shot always seems lackluster since the enemy needs to be in your bullseye, and you need to spend the force before you roll attack dice. Against a TIE Defender with Focus + Evade, if you only get 1 hit, they will take 0 damage 100% of the time. If you get 2 hits, they will take 0 damage 86% of the time. And if you get 3 hits, they get full agility, and you have wasted the force that you spent.

True, but my attack dice rolling is usually bad. 😆

41 minutes ago, Cuz05 said:

I love that Obi works with N-1akin. Theme. Meme. Anakin, focus! Makes me want to give him APT. But ProTorps are solid and happen twice.

APT would seem to make more sense when using new Obi-Wan, as his ability requires Anakin have enemy ships at range 1. Thus you want to be going for the standard line of dive, Passive, then either block & Intimidate or pump an APT into someone.

1 hour ago, reqent said:

Well I'm trying to get to 4 (range 1 and bullseye). Its pretty much an Anakin upgrade.

Outmaneuver only works with front arc V attacks, and not bullseye || attacks.

And that text is tiny. Well, the point stands.

https://xwing-miniatures-second-edition.fandom.com/wiki/Outmaneuver

9 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

Outmaneuver only works with front arc V attacks, and not bullseye || attacks.

And that text is tiny. Well, the point stands.

https://xwing-miniatures-second-edition.fandom.com/wiki/Outmaneuver

Thanks for clarifying.

Does that stop the autoblasters as well? The attack still shows the arc and the bonus die isn't a separate attack profile on the card?

20 minutes ago, reqent said:

Does that stop the autoblasters as well? The attack still shows the arc and the bonus die isn't a separate attack profile on the card?

It doesn't stop it, no. As you say, the Autoblaster is a V attack with a special effect if you also have the enemy in bullseye.

But if you're running the Autoblaster, then you're already going for unpreventable damage (and, presumably, you've brought R7-A7 to guarantee it) and Outmaneuver would seem to be a fair amount of overkill.

I played a triple ETA list exclusively lately and did batreps about 3 of my games.

- you have lots of loadout options which is great. Therefore I think it works well in different list archetypes. (Autoblaster, Ion, Juke, Predator, and so on)
- IC is absolutely amazing. It makes the ETA one of the best disengaging platforms in the game. At the same time you can stay in the fight forever if you want to. You can also block lower initiative ships with it.
- the purple tallon roll is really strong. I am happy spending a force for it because I can take an action afterwards
- The most important upgrade for this ship is sense imo (you can see some examples of it in my batreps). It works so well with IC: Setting up blocks, avoiding blocks, find the right corridor to engage or disengage
- Predator is an amazing upgrade becasue it combos well with the 3 dice bullseye and gets around the fact that the lock action is purple (and it's cheap)
- I found Stealth Device as important as Sense. I usually take an evade action. Having 4 green dice backed up by 2-3 force is absolutely amazing.
- I am also using Brilliant Evasion...It saved the Jedi 3 times since I used it and kept the SD active. It also combos great with Aaylas ability.
- Aayla is great because she's an I5. Her ability is pretty good because it also works for friendly ships and Aayla doesn't has to spend a force to use it.
- Obi + Ani are an awesome team. Their abilities are working even if they bump. Staying togehter means that both of them can get rid of stress and even locks while they can end up with a focus+evade next to an enemy ship.
(- Shaak Ti is great with Juke)

I never played ships that defensive. And I think this is necessary to keep them alive because they're pretty expensive for only 3 hp.

With 3 ETA aces I never killed more than 1-2 enemy ships because the damage output is pretty low and because of my defensive playstyle. On the other hand I never took more than 1 damage total . I fell in love with this chassis.

Here's some math on Brilliant Evasion:

Lets say your opponent rolls 3 hits at r2. Aayla is defending having an evade token (as usual), 1 force and her SD active.

Without Brilliant Evasion you suffer 0.251 damage (77% chance of taking 0 damage)

With Brilliant Evasion you suffer 0.171 damage (85% chance of taking 0 damage)

Thats huge imo.

Hull or Stealth?

Seems like Predator is a great choice.

Does R2-D2's repair a damage card mean you can just yeet away a facedown card? What happens when its face-up?

I think the ETA force power choice really depends on who you are flying. Anakin with Extreme Maneuvers will be an insanely agile knife fighter. Obi-Wan with Sense seems like a no-brainer, thanks to his three Force. If you take Aayla, Brilliant Evasion is great on any other Jedi, especially since it dropped in points. Shaak Ti seems like a Patience support ship.

Also... Shield Upgrade < Stealth Device on any Force user. Stealth Device can save you from multiple hits by rolling that additional Defence Die. Shield will save you from one. Especially with Aayla I would always pick Stealth Device. Hull Upgrade doesn't raise your half points threshold, so I am reluctant about it.

Ithink ETA might want to run Afterburners especially on Ani with Extreme Maneuvers. It's a bit of a Vader issue of lots of points on a chassis vulnerable to blanks, with even less HP. Sense might mitigate it. But I really think having that option of additional boost will be big.

The System Phase reposition makes it an amazing cloud hugger, that's for sure.

2 hours ago, Ryuneke said:

I played a triple ETA list exclusively lately and did batreps about 3 of my games.

- you have lots of loadout options which is great. Therefore I think it works well in different list archetypes. (Autoblaster, Ion, Juke, Predator, and so on)
- IC is absolutely amazing. It makes the ETA one of the best disengaging platforms in the game. At the same time you can stay in the fight forever if you want to. You can also block lower initiative ships with it.
- the purple tallon roll is really strong. I am happy spending a force for it because I can take an action afterwards
- The most important upgrade for this ship is sense imo (you can see some examples of it in my batreps). It works so well with IC: Setting up blocks, avoiding blocks, find the right corridor to engage or disengage
- Predator is an amazing upgrade becasue it combos well with the 3 dice bullseye and gets around the fact that the lock action is purple (and it's cheap)
- I found Stealth Device as important as Sense. I usually take an evade action. Having 4 green dice backed up by 2-3 force is absolutely amazing.
- I am also using Brilliant Evasion...It saved the Jedi 3 times since I used it and kept the SD active. It also combos great with Aaylas ability.
- Aayla is great because she's an I5. Her ability is pretty good because it also works for friendly ships and Aayla doesn't has to spend a force to use it.
- Obi + Ani are an awesome team. Their abilities are working even if they bump. Staying togehter means that both of them can get rid of stress and even locks while they can end up with a focus+evade next to an enemy ship.
(- Shaak Ti is great with Juke)

I never played ships that defensive. And I think this is necessary to keep them alive because they're pretty expensive for only 3 hp.

With 3 ETA aces I never killed more than 1-2 enemy ships because the damage output is pretty low and because of my defensive playstyle. On the other hand I never took more than 1 damage total . I fell in love with this chassis.

Here's some math on Brilliant Evasion:

Lets say your opponent rolls 3 hits at r2. Aayla is defending having an evade token (as usual), 1 force and her SD active.

Without Brilliant Evasion you suffer 0.251 damage (77% chance of taking 0 damage)

With Brilliant Evasion you suffer 0.171 damage (85% chance of taking 0 damage)

Thats huge imo.

Brilliant Evasion was quietly a bit better than anyone thought all along, it just didn't have many ships it made good sense on. I mathed it for Kylo Ren and it was similar defensively to Hate.

20 minutes ago, Stay OT Leader said:

Brilliant Evasion was quietly a bit better than anyone thought all along, it just didn't have many ships it made good sense on. I mathed it for Kylo Ren and it was similar defensively to Hate.

It was just overpriced for what I does. I think it’s in a Good spot for 2 points. 1 point might be a bit cheap

5 hours ago, Stay OT Leader said:

Brilliant Evasion was quietly a bit better than anyone thought all along, it just didn't have many ships it made good sense on. I mathed it for Kylo Ren and it was similar defensively to Hate.

I felt this way. Before 5th Brother pilot came out, I flew GI and 7th Sister with Brilliant Evasion, and unless they took focus fire from multiple shots, they were essentially unhittable. White evade + two force is silly good. I imagine the white evade + three force + stealth device is even wilder.

6 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

Does R2-D2's repair a damage card mean you can just yeet away a facedown card? What happens when its face-up?

Repair a face-down removes it.

Repair a face-up turns it face-down. Not as useful in general, but it gains an action and there are still a few damage cards that don't have repair actions on them.

Shaak Ti is absolutly broken. I flew against a list with Shaak Ti and Yoda, and it is insane. Shaak Ti and Yoda can each spend 1 force during the end phase to save an evade, which means they can come in battle with 2 evades and 3 force. This combined with stealth device makes them basically impossible to hit without good luck. I was running a imperial bomber list with 4 bombers and 2 interceptors. I got 6 3 dice shots on Yoda and he only ended up taking 1 damage (and that was with decent luck). My opponent did the math and it turns out that against 4 3 dice shots, yoda takes no damage 90% of the time. That means triple ace lists or 4 ship rebel beef lists get pretty much hard countered by Shaak Ti/Yoda lists.

In summary, Shaak Ti needs to go up at least half a dozen points and possibly even more.

1 hour ago, nopedz said:

I flew against a list with Shaak Ti and Yoda, and it is insane.

What was the rest of the list?

I'm hyped for Shaak Ti. The early bonus she can provide is immense. But my 1st thought on the list was that it would need to do a lot of damage in the 1st couple of engages.

1 hour ago, nopedz said:

That means triple ace lists or 4 ship rebel beef lists get pretty much hard countered by Shaak Ti/Yoda lists.

Amusing counter list-

Fenn Rau (68)
Fearless (3)

Ship total: 71 Half Points: 36 Threshold: 2

Old Teroch (56)
Fearless (3)

Ship total: 59 Half Points: 30 Threshold: 2

Palob Godalhi (40)
Ship total: 40 Half Points: 20 Threshold: 3

Captain Seevor (30)
Ship total: 30 Half Points: 15 Threshold: 2


Total: 200

Probably not competitive, but a pain to fight.

2 hours ago, nopedz said:

Shaak Ti and Yoda can each spend 1 force during the end phase to save an evade, which means they can come in battle with 2 evades and 3 force.

Shaak Ti only has two Force.

While the timings involved here and the fact that Yoda can keep topping her up means you can probably pull this off for a couple of turns, eventually you're going to run out of Force. And if they're spending all this Force defensively, they're not spending it on attack. Stealth Device puts them at over the half the list already. If they're evading, they're not barrel rolling and so bullseye is less likely. If they're spending all this Force defensively, they're not spending it on pre-movement positioning with the ship ability or on purple tallon rolls. In other words, all the other tricks on the ship go out the window. They're also only I3 and and I4.

You're basically running two very hard to kill TIE Fighters for over half your list. With the bullseye attack bonus, it's a lot like running Scourge and Mauler at double the cost and lower I, even if they are, granted, almost impossible to kill for a couple of turns.

It sounds frustrating to play against, but I'm not show how that list starts winning.

If the other player does anything to make up for those shortcomings, like using purple tallon rolls are pre-maneuver boosts, or rocks Predator and barrel rolls to line up bullseye and spends Force tokens on eye results on attack, then the Force battery for Shaak Ti's ability empties and she becomes another Jedi General. HLC, Ion Cannon, Autoblaster, R7-A7, R5, R2-D2, Brilliant Evasion, Patience... anything that might address these problems just takes more points that could be going on an offensive piece.

I'd love to see what ProTorp Wedge does to these ships....

14 minutes ago, GuacCousteau said:

I'd love to see what ProTorp Wedge does to these ships....

That is if he can catch them xD. ProTorp Wedge is I6 but repositioning is not his strength. These guys can end up anywhere.

In the Shaak Ti + Yoda list you could use the ability for the 1st engagement and then run them as regular "aces". They are not as initiative dependent as the delta, since their ability is system phase. A pity Yoda can't have predator tho.

7 minutes ago, xanatos135 said:

These guys can end up anywhere.

Only by burning Force though, which is okay because it stops the ability shenanigans.

8 minutes ago, xanatos135 said:

In the Shaak Ti + Yoda list you could use the ability for the 1st engagement and then run them as regular "aces".

Sure, but is that first engagement damage sponge really worth it over other Eta aces who might actually be able to kill stuff?

I think Shaak Ti is potentially great too, but this self reinforcing tank with Yoda is only a list that looks horrible but doesn't actually do much. Shaak Ti plus CLT Delta 7 Obi-Wan and Aayla scares me a lot more.

17 minutes ago, GuacCousteau said:

Sure, but is that first engagement damage sponge really worth it over other Eta aces who might actually be able to kill stuff?

Well, I really prefer the other 3 pilots for initiative and talent availability, but it looks like an alternative way to use Yoda rather than supporting other jedi. Worth a try.

Just pointing out that ETAs don't have to take an evade when they arc dodge everyone.

Also the comparison to Soontir is really obvious. Reposition before or after maneuver is different, but both are strong.

If 3 hull were that fragile then so was Soontir

48 minutes ago, GuacCousteau said:

You're basically running two very hard to kill TIE Fighters for over half your list.

This is what keeps going through my head.

These ETA can do ****ing anything. Tokens, movement, tricks and shenanigans, access to unpreventable damage, some of the best green-dice-tankiness in the game. Their capacity is absurdly high.

But they're also only TIE Fighters.

That's probably going to make them a balance nightmare. Right now, they seem perhaps underpriced for their flexibility and the upper limit potential, as well as overpriced for their squishiness and those times they get caught out. Kylo is way easier to balance, since dude's ship is just a beast of a ship, and the Force adds mostly dice mods (except Supernatural Reflexes, which he pays HIGH for).

More than Soontir, this has potential to be broken or utter trash, depending on the players involved. I'm not exactly happy about that, in either direction.

Naked, I have a hard time believing in most of them. Include a few upgrades and it seems like some could be the most slippery aces in the game. I haven't played any yet to develop a real opinion, but plan to. Those MFers get BB-8 built in. SO MAD.

12 minutes ago, gennataos said:

Naked, I have a hard time believing in most of them. Include a few upgrades and it seems like some could be the most slippery aces in the game. I haven't played any yet to develop a real opinion, but plan to. Those MFers get BB-8 built in. SO MAD.

I think that just means BB-8 ought to be a lot cheaper.

33 minutes ago, Cpt ObVus said:

I think that just means BB-8 ought to be a lot cheaper.

If BB-8 had the R4 ability built in, I'd be happy as a clam. But, yeah.

5 hours ago, Bravo Null said:

Amusing counter list-

Fenn Rau (68)
Fearless (3)

Ship total: 71 Half Points: 36 Threshold: 2

Old Teroch (56)
Fearless (3)

Ship total: 59 Half Points: 30 Threshold: 2

Palob Godalhi (40)
Ship total: 40 Half Points: 20 Threshold: 3

Captain Seevor (30)
Ship total: 30 Half Points: 15 Threshold: 2


Total: 200

Probably not competitive, but a pain to fight.

Swap Seevor for a quadjumper. Action tractor token helps a lot against very defensive ships.