21 hours ago, Tonbo Karasu said:

It seems such a waste...

With that many successes, I think it's probably worth a good explanation, anyway!

"Shiro Damebarē" literally translates as "no-good valley castle", but whilst "Dame" does means "no-good", it is not a standard Rokugani usage.

It is most commonly used in Go, where it has a more specific definition - describing an empty 'stalemate point' on the board which is of not just zero but negative strategic value, that neither player wishes to be the first to occupy because it will lead to the capture of far more valuable territory by their opponent.

Unless wishing to concede, one player or the other will eventually run out of other options and be forced to place a stone there, but recognising "Dame" spaces early and avoiding this for as long as possible is one mark of a superior player....

That's a pretty awesome name. And maybe if the castle is being called out as being of negative strategic value, the Dragon and Phoenix will be less inclined to want to be the castellan (presuming they're the implied go players).

I think Khenbish would feel a little emboldened by this. I'm jazzed to see where the after-dinner scene takes us!

On 10/26/2020 at 2:12 PM, MonCalamariAgainstDrunkDriving said:

And maybe if the castle is being called out as being of negative strategic value, the Dragon and Phoenix will be less inclined to want to be the castellan (presuming they're the implied go players).

Quite possibly.

On 10/22/2020 at 6:34 PM, MonCalamariAgainstDrunkDriving said:

I think we actually got a lot of information. I haven't processed it all, and I'm not sure what it all means yet, but this feels like a promising start.

Trying to put it all in one post for you!

Stuff the team has found out or been told - and stuff which would be obvious (i.e numbers) which hasn't been explicitly said to date.:

• Shiro Damebare
  • Physically exists as a fortification but was not an Imperal Garrison within living memory.
  • Based in the remote Fubuki no Gake (Snowstorm Valley)
  • Is somehow connected to the (valuable) holding of Chisanryu valley, which is an extremely valuable holding that's currently a political football in the Otosan Uchi courts between Dragon and Phoenix since its (re)discovery by an Imperial Cartographer late last year.
  • Given the allusions of the name, holding the castle somehow decreases a clan's chances of being awarded control of Chisanryu?
  • Is on (or at least very near) both the northern border of the Empire, and on the Dragon/Phoenix clan border - though exact borders in the region are vague at best.
  • Sits on a valley which has in the past been used for Yobanjin raids. These stopped decades ago but have recently restarted.
  • The ronin were told to pack for 'cold, snow, bandits and mountain roads'
  • Yokoi's inclusion means it is expected there will be an ashigaru auxiliary assigned.
  • Yasuki Taka believes there will be issues securing supplies for the garrison.

• Seppun Hirohide
  • Was given the job of assigning command of the garrison by the Emerald and Ruby Champions (both of whom appear to be present in the castle) 'to avoid any conflict of interest'.
  • Is a senior emerald magistrate.
  • Looks to have spent significant amounts of recent time in Crab lands
  • Appears to be a combat veteran, and has faced something other than just generic-opponent-with-sword
  • Is irked with both Dragon and Phoenix factions and feels the garrison 'serves them right'
  • Is pointedly avoiding looking at the Lion/Crab/Scorpion end of the room.
  • Intends to appoint all senior posts personally instead of delegating authority to the castellan (possibly to avoid one faction getting too much control)
  • On 4 strife

• The Factions
  • Dragon/Unicorn
    • Agasha Umeko
    • Shinjo Sayaka
    • Shinjo Khenbish
    • Kitsuki Fuji
      • Appears to be faction leader
      • Respected scout/skirmisher commander
      • Recently lost his son to Yobanjin raiders
    • Mirumoto ???
      • Responsible for hiring the Nanashi ronin
    • One other Dragon ???
    • Chinatsu
      • Nanashi Ronin
      • Friend of Sayaka
    • Two other Nanashi Ronin ???
      • Used when the Dragon want things to be 'unofficial' since they're not legally speaking Dragon Clan members
  • Phoenix/Crane
    • Shiba Rie
      • Appears to be faction leader
      • Bushi but also a trained orator
    • Asako Koharu
      • Courtier
      • Lower status than Bayushi Katsu
    • Nasu no Shiba Masumi
      • Vassal family bushi
      • Knows Tsume Rin
    • Two other Phoenix ???
    • Tsume no Doji Rin
      • Supposedly directly involved in the massacre of the Goseki no Matsu at Toshi Ranbo
      • Trained by Nasu Shimazu
      • Bushi
      • Ferocity disadvantage
    • One other Crane ???
    • Asahina Midori
      • Shujenga
      • Claims concern for casualties if an inexperienced castellan is selected
      • Watched Khenbish riding earlier
  • Lion/Crab/Scorpion
    • Kaiu Hatsune
    • Matsu Tomuko
      • Is either a former member of, related to, or otherwise connected to, the extinct Goseki family and as such would happily hackTsume no Doji Rin into bite-sized chunks whilst humming cheerful kabuki show tunes.
      • Well-disposed to Khenbish
    • Kitsu Harumori
      • Medic, has a feud with Shinjo Barghujin (and hence Khenbish by proxy)
      • Sage/Courtier
      • Feud something to do with the death of Barghujin's son in a landslide at the Seikitsu pass garrison
      • Either Harumori or Khenbish having a position where one is in command over the other may make it socially impossible to issue a challenge.
    • Yokoi
      • Ji-samurai, experienced and respected ashigaru commander
      • Well-disposed to Umeko
    • Bayushi Katsu
      • Has sufficient status to interrupt Asako Koharu
      • Is supporting Khenbish for castellan in return for being made advisor
      • Left the courtyard before the dinner to meet someone
      • Is trying hard not to grin
    • Yasuki ???
      • Sent with 'broad letters of credit' to secure the task of providing supplies
      • Everyone knows this as a rumour was spread to thus effect.
    • Hakane
      • Nanashi Ronin
      • Chinatsu joked she was going to see if anyone would outbid the Dragon's retainer - it looks like someone did.

So....this will obviously be another intrigue, but it's not going to start just yet so don't worry about rolling dice - rather, I'm giving you a few days (?) to converse and figure out what your actual objectives are (what posts you either want to go for yourself or try to push a specific person for - or prevent a specific person getting!) and start planning means by which you want to do so, allies who you think might side with you, and so on.

• I would suggest everyone try to figure out one or at most two objectives they want to pursue in the intrigue - more than that is probably a waste of time. Don't forget that you might want to spend actions Assisting, as well - Hirohide-sama has a fairly high vigilance (as you might expect from a veteran magistrate!) and you're now trying to Persuade rather than Endear , so anticipate the check TNs being proportionately higher than the 'get-to-know-you' with the other clans in the courtyard.
• There will be no specific round limit, but it will end when an objective has been completed that defines the occupant of each post (or which hands that decision to a specific individual - you might, for example, want to argue that an officer should pick their own yojimbo) from those listed above, and any other posts you can persuade Hirohide to officially recognise.
• Note that because this is an everyone-in-one-room setting, and decisions are being made now , 'withdrawing' - either physically or just sitting down and shutting up - is a possibility and hence the Discredit objective is available if you're so inclined, which will remove someone from the debate for the scene.
• Also note that initiative will come into play since everyone is speaking in the same forum. Intrigue initiative is a lot more free-form and it largely boils down to interrupting one another; the big driver there is that it costs 1 honour and 1 glory to interrupt someone of higher status.
  • There isn't a huge variation of status in the room, but based on what you'd probably know or can guess without making checks:

Ronin (Chinatsu) < Ji-Samurai (Yokoi) < Vassal Samurai (Tsume Rin) < Clan Samurai (you lot) < Titled Clan Samurai (Kitsuki Fuji)<<<<<Imperial Magistrate (Seppun Hirohide)

Unless another player wants the position, I think Khenbish is going to use the "Appeal to a Person or Group" objective to shoot for Castellan. As I see it, this satisfies just about everything he wants:

• It helps him make sure the Yobanjin can be treated with as much compassion as possible
• It means the castle can be overseen by someone impartial to the Dragon/Phoenix tension
• Personally, it helps him avoid having to duel Kitsu Harumori
• If for no other reason, he would want to bring as much honor and glory to his family as possible

This seems ambitious but not impossible. I would certainly welcome any support from other players. I'm hoping Matsu Tomuko might support this play as well. If another player has their eyes on Castellan, I would also be pretty happy with senior gunso, negotiator, or junior gunso, I think in that order.

Some thoughts related to his secondary objective:

• If another player is looking for any appointment, that's my next priority. Just say the word.
• I want the castle to be staffed by competent people in positions they're qualified for, and I place some value on experience. Yokoi might be a good gunso, for instance.
• That said, Kitsuki Fuji has experience leading troops, but since his son was lost to Yobanjin raiders, I'd be nervous seeing him as senior gunso, at least without getting to know him a little better first.
• Since I'm hoping for an appointment where it would be inappropriate for me to duel Kitsu Harumori, I think the next best thing I can do for my lord back home is to try to prevent Harumori from being promoted to where it would be difficult for someone else to settle her score. I would rather do this by helping someone else get a position he was looking for, rather than by just discrediting him directly.
• For the sake of balancing tension, it would be nice if Dragon and Phoenix had as close to equal levels of power as possible.

Regarding how appointments are made:

• Maybe the Castellan should get to appoint their own advisor? The argument being that it might defeat their purpose if the advisor isn't someone the Castellan will listen to.
• Maybe anyone who gets a yojimbo should get to choose their own yojimbo, in descending order of status? You have to be able to trust your yojimbo, right?
• Maybe the senior gunso gets to choose their junior gunso?

I don't have strong feelings about any of this. Also, I don't know why I'm going so crazy with the bulleted lists this post. Hopefully it helps keep things clear.

Zantosa and Tonbo Karasu, I'm excited to hear what you're thinking.

Also, will the modified TNs based on skill be in effect for the Persuade action this scene?

10 hours ago, MonCalamariAgainstDrunkDriving said:

Also, will the modified TNs based on skill be in effect for the Persuade action this scene?

Yes. Which - since the main target will be the high-status Hirohide - means courtesy is your go-to skill.

Given the way the place is named, part of me wants to dump the Castellan position on a Phoenix (possibly a non-bushi at that) and then see about getting one of you two put in as the Senior Gunso. Umeko would feel relatively comfortable in the priest role.

Would that be an interesting approach?

Ha! Bold strategy! The name does seem like a pretty big hint that there's something up. But even if it's a trap, if we're in positions of authority, at least we can help make sure the castle is used in service of the Empire. I'm a little nervous about what the Phoenix would do with it, only because I don't know them yet and don't know all of the relevant history.

I'm definitely willing to back the two of you for Gunso and Priest. May we bring honor and glory to our family!

So...objectives

• Persuade Seppun Hirohide (Agasha Umeko as Priest)
• Persuade Seppun Hirohide (Shinjo Sayaka as Senior Gunso)

and either

• Persuade Seppun Hirohide (Shinjo Khenbish as Castellan)

or

• Persuade Seppun Hirohide ([Senior Phoenix] as Castellan)

(to be agreed)

Doesn't look like anyone has strong feelings about methods, so we can most likely get started once you decide about the castellan post..

I'm guessing @Zantosa is going to wait to see which is the least contested position and then chase that?

Sounds good!

Do you need any rolls?

'initiative' for intrigues is nominally a TN1 sentiment check, though it's fair to say it's more about generating opportunities than it is establishing 'who goes first' due to the aforementioned status/interruption rule.

If everyone makes the check, we'll start.

Water/sentiment: explosive/strife, opportunity, explosive/strife, opportunity.

Keep the two opportunity and one explosive/strife > success/strife. Not keeping.
one success, 2 opportunity, 1 strife.

Will review options for opportunity when work allows, but might just be boring and work on my strife with it

The responsibility of castellan seems fun from a roleplaying standpoint, and I think it's our best shot at having influence over how things play out at Shiro Damebarē. Since it's probably going to be a reach, Khenbish won't go for it without support from his sister and sister-in-law (and I want all players to enjoy our strategy as a group). It sounds like @Zantosa is willing to go either way, so I guess it's up to you @Tonbo Karasu . Do we try to get leadership in the castle, hoping the we can make the castle a success, or do we try to make it someone else's problem, figuring it's doomed to failure?

Water/Sentiment
Original Roll: Ring : / , / , / ; Skill :
Keep:

I'll use the opportunity to reduce strife by 2, which puts Khenbish at 3 strife total.

If you want to go for it, I'll support Khenbish for the Castellan.

Initiative - Earth 3 / Sentiment 0 = [Opportunity/Strife], [Success/Strife]. [Success]. Keep 1 and 3 for 1 Success, 1 Opportunity, 1 Strife.

Um, do I know anyone else's Disadvantages? Because if I can negate one for a scene, it would be really useful, I think.

Since we're all family now, I feel like we all know each other decently well. Khenbish has Gaijin Name, Culture, or Appearance (which, actually, I might try to invert this scene?) and Soft-hearted (which I'm really hoping doesn't come up). While we're at it, his advantages are Paragon of Compassion, Animal Trainer, and Animal Bond. What are Umeko's advantages/disadvantages (that Khenbish would know about)?

As a result of an accident in the forge, Umeko has a Horrible Scar, Maimed Arm and an Addiction to painkillers.

However, she has a Precise Memory and an enviable eye for Fashion.

Shiba Rie is a Loyal Bushi with the Socialite template, and attempts a Water Stance courtesy check (Water 4, Social 3, Seems Trustworthy ) targeting Seppun Hirohide (Base TN4, reduced to TN3 for courtesy checks due to Rie's lower status).

Rolls: Blank, Opportunity x 2, Success/Strife x 2, Explosive Success/Strife, Explosive Success

Rerolls ( Seems Trustworthy 😞 Blank, Success/Strife > Opportunity, Opportunity/Strife

Keeps: Opportunity, Success/Strife, Explosive Success/Strife, Explosive Success

Resolve Explosive Success: Blank, Opportunity/Strife

Resolve Strife: Gains 3 Strife

Resolve Opportunities: Opportunity x 2 - Beware the Smallest Mouse - Reduce Hirohide's vigilance by 1 for future checks by Shiba Rie.

Resolve Success: 3 Successes vs Difficulty 3 - succeeds with no bonus successes.

• Persuade Seppun Hirohide (Kitsuki Fuji as Castellan) - 1/5 momentum

This is so intriguing! Seems Rie was thinking along similar lines to Umeko (just in reverse).

If Fuji (just realized that's a good name for a character from the part of Rokugan with volcanoes) is holding off, does that mean we should go next?

something like, "what a great idea, I have extensive knowledge of the gaijin [invert gaijin name disad.]"

BTW, did we ever decide which Disad I was to cancel at initiative?

I think Sayaka has Ferocity and Benten's Curse. I don't think either is super likely to come up, but who knows (I mean, Magnus, probably...)? I'm not sure if my Gaijin Name, Culture, or Appearance adversity will be in play here, but if so, I would certainly welcome not having to worry about it.

@Magnus Grendel , if when I plead my case, I lean hard into familiarity with gaijin, can I spend a Void point to "leverage a disadvantage" (as per page 101 of the core rulebook). I've never had occasion to leverage a disadvantage before, so I'm kind of excited to try it out.

Also, I think this vying for a position of authority during the US elections has really ramped up the intensity for me.

10 hours ago, MonCalamariAgainstDrunkDriving said:

I think Sayaka has Ferocity and Benten's Curse. I don't think either is super likely to come up, but who knows

The latter, probably not - if she'd attempted to seduce someone during the previous scene, or had a previous romantic connection to someone you knew was here, maybe, but I can't see it applying in what is essentially now a formal court debate.

Ferocity...maybe. Her reputation may precede her, which might be good or bad if someone makes an issue of it during discussion over the post of Gunso. Ferocity in itself is no bad thing but an excess of it implies a lack of self-control not desirable in a field commander facing opponents with a track record of ambush and asymmetric warfare.

10 hours ago, MonCalamariAgainstDrunkDriving said:

I'm not sure if my Gaijin Name, Culture, or Appearance adversity will be in play here, but if so, I would certainly welcome not having to worry about it.

@Magnus Grendel , if when I plead my case, I lean hard into familiarity with gaijin, can I spend a Void point to "leverage a disadvantage" (as per page 101 of the core rulebook). I've never had occasion to leverage a disadvantage before, so I'm kind of excited to try it out.

The gaijin appearance can always be a pain when dealing with 'high society'. Hirohide seems enough of a pragmatist - and based on Umeko's assessment may have dealings with the also-totally-not-accepting-gaijin Mantis, but if you plan on garnering support from across the hall from the more traditionalist clans - Phoenix, crane, scorpion - it will come up.

More importantly, though, if you cancel a disadvantage for a scene, it's not there to invert! Your suggestion for Khenbish's argument is a pretty sensible one but depends on him still having that adversity.

10 hours ago, MonCalamariAgainstDrunkDriving said:

Also, I think this vying for a position of authority during the US elections has really ramped up the intensity for me.

And - as ever - the rules by which you pick the candidate are as important as the support they can muster. "Its not who votes that counts, its who counts the votes" and all that ( a painfully prescient quote at the moment).

I should also point out one important difference - rather than a representative electoral college, this intrigue is a true "one man, one vote" democracy, with a clear, simple majority delivering an immediate winner.

Seppun Hirohide-sama is, of course, the "one man" with the "one vote"....

In that case, I think I'd just as soon keep the disadvantage. From a roleplaying standpoint, I definitely think I would be playing up my connection with gaijin.

Are we waiting for any other NPCs to go first?

6 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

Seppun Hirohide-sama is, of course, the "one man" with the "one vote"....

😆

It's an intrigue:

• There is no fixed turn order.
• You still only get one 'go' per turn.
• You can in theory go whenever you want, but a higher status individual can interrupt and take their turn before you can, if they choose to. Fuji and Hirohide are the only other high status individuals you know of - but that doesn't mean there isn't someone elsewhere in the room you've not met who's not spoken up yet.

Fire/Courtesy to Persuade Seppun Hirohide, spending a Void point to leverage a disadvantage :
(Base TN4, reduced to TN3 for courtesy checks due to Khenbish's lower status)
Original Roll: Ring : / , / , ; Skill : , /
Rerolls: >
Keep: Ring : / , / , Skill : ,
Resolves Explosions: Ring : blank; Skill : /
Resolve Strife: 3 strife puts Khenbish at 6 total.
Resolve Opportunity: Alas, no opportunity.
Resolve Successes: Four successes vs. TN3 is one bonus success, plus three more from strife in Fire Stance is four bonus successes. One momentum for every two bonus successes should put me at 3/5 momentum towards Appeal to Seppun Hirohide (Shinjo Khenbish as Castellan)!