4 hours ago, Bellona said:

@EliasWindrider @MrTInce

If Mireska wants to use the Bind basic power on Ker'see, would the opposed part of the check be Mireska's Discipline vs. Ker'see's Resilience (going by the last example given in the sidebar on p. 283 in FaD)? Or the more standard Discipline vs. Discipline?

Target's choice.

1 minute ago, EliasWindrider said:

Target's choice.

Then I'll make it one of Athletics or Resilience as they offer the same difficulty (and a slightly higher one than her Discipline).

5 hours ago, MrTInce said:

Linked costs 2 advantages or a triumph to activate each value. I only had one triumph so could only activate it once despite having 3 ranks of it.

Regarding the two handed thing I figure throwing a weapon with two hands rather than one is stronger (thinking of things like hammer throw or caber toss).

A saber throw is I think most analogous to throwing a boomerang which is one handed. rather than the thrower themselves turning around (combined with arm motion) like in a track & field hammer throw (a track and field hammer is a metal ball on the end of a thick wire/cable with a handle designed for 2 handed throwing, the handle is the large end o a symmetric triangle where the other 2 edges are wire that meet at a bolt or other fastener, and the wire proceeds from that fastener to the ball) the body mechanics are totally different than throwing a 40 cm to 60 cm metal stick, I don't see a way to effectively throw a 40 cm to 60 cm metal stick with 2 hands.

@MrTInce

Mireska's turn ...

Action: Bind basic power vs. Ker'see, using last turn's +1 Boost and +1 upgrade

Spar 1 vs. K: Bind power opposed (Boost, Upgrade) vs. K's Athletics or Resilience : 4eF+3eP+1eB+1eD+1eC 2 successes, 1 threat, 1 Light Side, 3 Dark Side

Result (using only the single LS pip) : Ker'see is Immobilised (no manoeuvres) until the end of Mireska's next turn.

Extra Success: will be used to downgrade a Challenge die to a Difficulty die on Mireska's next turn. (Assuming that I've correctly interpreted that paragraph under Discipline skill in FaD, p. 121.)

Threat will be used to give Mireska +1 Strain?

Manoeuvre: Mireska closes to Engaged range of Ker'see.

It sounds like the 2-handed Sabre Throw will not be a thing, so Mireska's currently at 11/17 Strain suffered (+10 from Ker'see's Sabre Swarm Throw, +1 from the opposed Bind Threat).

I believe that Ker'see is at 3/14 Strain suffered (Sabre Swarm manoevre +1 Strain, second manoeuvre [True Aim] for +2 Strain).

From her position of being bound Ker'see can still take actions and so will lob her blade (just realised that due to being short ranged means its one purple die).

saber throw : 4eP+2eA+3eF+1eD+4eS 6 successes, 1 advantage, 1 Light Side, 2 Dark Side

With bonus success it will be 17 damage. Don't have enough pips to have blade return to me. Advantage to recover strain.

3 hours ago, MrTInce said:

From her position of being bound Ker'see can still take actions and so will lob her blade (just realised that due to being short ranged means its one purple die).

saber throw : 4eP+2eA+3eF+1eD+4eS 6 successes, 1 advantage, 1 Light Side, 2 Dark Side

With bonus success it will be 17 damage. Don't have enough pips to have blade return to me. Advantage to recover strain.

Engaged range, not Short.

So it's possible that you should add +1 Difficulty for using the equivalent of a Ranged (Light) weapon while Engaged. (Going by the rules' underlying intent that making ranged attacks while Engaged is more difficult than when not Engaged.)

7 hours ago, Bellona said:

Engaged range, not Short.

So it's possible that you should add +1 Difficulty for using the equivalent of a Ranged (Light) weapon while Engaged. (Going by the rules' underlying intent that making ranged attacks while Engaged is more difficult than when not Engaged.)

For some reason I thought we were at short range...

One more purple : 1eD 0 successes

It came out to naught...

But it makes an interesting point as it is not a ranged light or heavy which are increased. How does chucking a saber in engaged range work?

42 minutes ago, MrTInce said:

But it makes an interesting point as it is not a ranged light or heavy which are increased. How does chucking a saber in engaged range work?

I've always assumed that it worked like a one-handed ranged attack, the sort that usually requires the Ranged (Light) skill, hence the suggestion of +1 Difficulty. (As per FaD p. 217.)

9 hours ago, MrTInce said:

From her position of being bound Ker'see can still take actions and so will lob her blade (just realised that due to being short ranged means its one purple die).

saber throw : 4eP+2eA+3eF+1eD+4eS 6 successes, 1 advantage, 1 Light Side, 2 Dark Side

With bonus success it will be 17 damage. Don't have enough pips to have blade return to me. Advantage to recover strain.

1 hour ago, MrTInce said:

For some reason I thought we were at short range...

One more purple : 1eD 0 successes

It came out to naught...

17 damage - 4 (Parry 2) - 4 (Soak) - 2 (Resolve 2) = 7 Stun + 3 Strain for the Parry = +10 Strain.

Mireska is now at 21/17 Strain, and probably somewhat dazed from the effort.

Round 1 goes to Ker'see.

We take the time to rest/re-hydrate/regain Strain as per end of encounter ...

Post-encounter/Spar 1 regain of Strain : 2eP+1eA+4eF 2 successes, 2 advantage, 1 Light Side, 3 Dark Side

... Those Force dice have been most uncooperative for this sparring session! ...

Result: 3 Strain recovered, leaving Mireska at 18/17 Strain

... which means that she really over-exerted herself and will concede the second match (and "set") to Ker'see due to the need to go and lie down. She'll stumble back to her quarters and basically drop into her bed for the night. (Theoretically speaking, a good Medicine check could get her back on her feet enough to let her fix herself, but why bother wasting those GAR resources on the results of a friendly sparring match?)

Congratulations to Ker'see! She has successfully trounced the group's Healer!

(Mireska has some ideas if there's a re-match some day.)

@MrTInce : Shall I write it up IC or will you?

@EliasWindrider (or anyone else, really):

... However, this leaves me with a question about post-encounter Strain recovery. It's a form of skill check, despite being Simple difficulty. Doesn't that mean that any Advantage results can be used to recover Strain too?

49 minutes ago, Bellona said:

@MrTInce : Shall I write it up IC or will you?

@EliasWindrider (or anyone else, really):

... However, this leaves me with a question about post-encounter Strain recovery. It's a form of skill check, despite being Simple difficulty. Doesn't that mean that Advantages can be used to recover Strain too?

Happy for you to write up the IC, you really shine in that area.

I run advantages can be used for strain recovery on post combat checks.

Strain Recovery : 2eP+1eA 2 successes, 2 advantage

Between this and rapid recovery she is completely restored.

Other than the bind Ker'see was barely touched. Hopefully it'll mean good things for going against Jango.

2 minutes ago, MrTInce said:

Other than the bind Ker'see was barely touched. Hopefully it'll mean good things for going against Jango.

I suspect that Jango's defensive options are much stronger than Mireska's.

Per RAW, Advantages cannot be used for Strain recovery.

Just now, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

Per RAW, Advantages cannot be used for Strain recovery.

FaD p. 20 could be interpreted to indicate otherwise. Can you point me at a better/more specific rules citation that that, please?

(I'm not being combative, I just need to know for future discussions in home games.)

8 minutes ago, MrTInce said:

Happy for you to write up the IC, you really shine in that area.

I run advantages can be used for strain recovery on post combat checks.

In that case, Mireska would have ended with 16/17 Strain after the post-encounter recovery. But I suspect that she still would have conceded the match.

The IC post will be up in a few hours - RL summons me right now.

2 minutes ago, Bellona said:

FaD p. 20 could be interpreted to indicate otherwise. Can you point me at a better/more specific rules citation that that, please?

(I'm not being combative, I just need to know for future discussions in home games.)

I believe that's the equivalent to page 12 of EotE, where it explains the various sorts of results? You can't activate a Critical Injury when recovering strain either, those were just examples of options for use. On page 220 of the "Recovery and Healing" section of Chapter VI: Conflict and Combat in the EotE CRB, it says: (emphasis mine)

Quote

At the end of an encounter, each player can make a Simple (-) Discipline or Cool check. Each Success recovers one strain . Further more, a good night's rest... <snip>

It makes no mention of Advantage, but in conjunction with the Advantage suggestions under the descriptions for Discipline and Cool which do not mention using them to recover strain, I believe that it is disallowed. Nowhere else is Advantage used in the same manner as Success.

1 hour ago, Bellona said:

17 damage - 4 (Parry 2) - 4 (Soak) - 2 (Resolve 2) = 7 Stun + 3 Strain for the Parry = +10 Strain.

Mireska is now at 21/17 Strain, and probably somewhat dazed from the effort.

Round 1 goes to Ker'see.

We take the time to rest/re-hydrate/regain Strain as per end of encounter ...

Post-encounter/Spar 1 regain of Strain : 2eP+1eA+4eF 2 successes, 2 advantage, 1 Light Side, 3 Dark Side

... Those Force dice have been most uncooperative for this sparring session! ...

Result: 3 Strain recovered, leaving Mireska at 18/17 Strain

... which means that she really over-exerted herself and will concede the second match (and "set") to Ker'see due to the need to go and lie down. She'll stumble back to her quarters and basically drop into her bed for the night. (Theoretically speaking, a good Medicine check could get her back on her feet enough to let her fix herself, but why bother wasting those GAR resources on the results of a friendly sparring match?)

Congratulations to Ker'see! She has successfully trounced the group's Healer!

(Mireska has some ideas if there's a re-match some day.)

@MrTInce : Shall I write it up IC or will you?

@EliasWindrider (or anyone else, really):

... However, this leaves me with a question about post-encounter Strain recovery. It's a form of skill check, despite being Simple difficulty. Doesn't that mean that Advantages can be used to recover Strain too?

I would say you fell unconscious and needed to be revived by Ker'see and helped back to bed.

When you go against a ataru striker there are 2 ways to win

1) rocket tag: e.g. unmatched ferocity as a 1 off let's you do that, a lot of force dice niman disciple and either deadly accuracy or temple training is a potential way do be a one hit wonder, critical hit builds are another way, and of course another ataru striker. The niman disciple route helps because you'll likely have a good vigilance check and be able to win initiative, a makashi duelist crit build will likely have a good cool check. A warrior:steelhand adept/ niman-disciple with unmatched ferocity actually has really good odds at beating a 2 spec ataru striker build at rocket tag once per session. because draw closer with 3 force dice helps you pull off unmatched ferocity reliably, and you'll likely have a 5 will power. Whereas the ataru striker will likely have paired with a 2 force rating spec, e.g. sage, hermit, etc. Which would probably mean agility 4. Using quick path to power to start as knight, then going ataru striker means you could have fr3 and 5 agility and peerless interception, but niman disciple has a good chance of getting through peerless interception because of extra damage due to draw closer, and if they can activate the concussive quality of either a kimber stone one dragite gem that's game set match.

2) the one actual counter in the game for saber swarm and unmatched ferocity is peerless interception. Going high parry/reflect leaves you vulnerable to passing out from strain. A quick path to power jedi:knight/niman disciple has fr 4 willpower 5, they're probably going first, if they have a dragite gem or kimber stone for concussive that's probably game set match regardless of who goes first because of peerless interception and the free improved reflect and weapon quality activations

Edit: 3rd way, very high soak with cortosis to negate breach. And some parry, and a way to add a lot of failures... so let's say a "hypothetical" non force sensitive character, say a mandalorian with a lightsaber, had gadgeteer/martial artist/and shi-cho knight for relevant specs, high soak, cortosis, 4 defense, adversary 3, and maxed out coordination dodge, and unarmed parry and 6 ranks of parry, and mind over matter (to recover strain) and deadly accuracy for a damage boost. Well coordination dodge means there aren't going to be both a lot of successes and a lot of advantage, so that can largely take linked out of the equation unless the attacker is using hawk bat swoop and got a bunch of white pips (so a very good rolll) in that case your dealing with high soak that works against lightsaber and 6 ranks of parry so your're taking something like 14+ (if 6 soak) off of each lightsaber hit, and thanks to unarmed parry, they're only paying 2 strain per parry. So hypothetically jango wouldn't be a pushover in a lightsaber duel.

Btw: force sensitive/lightsaber/cortosis.... you can choose up to 2 of those in my games, cortosis requires strong narrative justification (like being a mandalorian)

1 hour ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

I believe that's the equivalent to page 12 of EotE, where it explains the various sorts of results? You can't activate a Critical Injury when recovering strain either, those were just examples of options for use.

I'd suggest that recovering or suffering Strain are the most generic uses for those results (Advantage and Threat). It could happen at any time, in any situation, with any skill check. So why not during post-encounter recovery? Otherwise they're just wasted. (Unlike the Advantages rolled for Initiative - those have a specific function.)

Whereas there's no point in trying to activate a Critical Injury on a recovery roll, because there's no attack involved. Ditto for a weapon's special quality. As for the last example given (an extra free manoeuvre), as far as I know neither Cool nor Discipline offer that option with extra Advantages. Recovering Strain is the only reasonable use for those Advantages.

4 minutes ago, Bellona said:

I'd suggest that recovering or suffering Strain are the most generic uses for those results (Advantage and Threat). It could happen at any time, in any situation, with any skill check. So why not during post-encounter recovery? Otherwise they're just wasted. (Unlike the Advantages rolled for Initiative - those have a specific function.)

Discipline and Cool have specific ways of spending Advantage, and the talent Hard Boiled allows you to spend Advantage equal to ranks to recover an equal amount of wounds on a strain recovery roll.

Further, in this case it would allow you to "succeed" on a failed roll because Advantage would have the same effect as Success, so on a result of 0 success, 5 Advantage, you recover 5 strain instead of 0. You could even theoretically "succeed" on a roll with net failure.

I've never heard of the Hard Boiled talent, but I assume that it's from somewhere in the EotE line. If that's in the game, then I agree that granting everyone the equivalent of unlimited Hard Boiled ranks would not be correct.

(As for the 0 Success, 5 Advantage argument ... that wouldn't have convinced me. A result like that would just recover fewer Strain than otherwise. And there is already one precedent for Advantages still giving a beneficial result on a failed roll: Blast weapon quality.)

41 minutes ago, Bellona said:

I've never heard of the Hard Boiled talent, but I assume that it's from somewhere in the EotE line. If that's in the game, then I agree that granting everyone the equivalent of unlimited Hard Boiled ranks would not be correct.

Yes, Skip Tracer (Bounty Hunter) and I believe Marshall (Colonist).

42 minutes ago, Bellona said:

(As for the 0 Success, 5 Advantage argument ... that wouldn't have convinced me. A result like that would just recover fewer Strain than otherwise. And there is already one precedent for Advantages still giving a beneficial result on a failed roll: Blast weapon quality.)

Why would it recover fewer strain? You were suggesting 1 Advantage=1 Strain, weren't you? And with Blast, it deals less damage because of the lack of success and costs more to activate than it would on a successful attack.

3 hours ago, Bellona said:

I'd suggest that recovering or suffering Strain are the most generic uses for those results (Advantage and Threat). It could happen at any time, in any situation, with any skill check. So why not during post-encounter recovery? Otherwise they're just wasted. (Unlike the Advantages rolled for Initiative - those have a specific function.)

Whereas there's no point in trying to activate a Critical Injury on a recovery roll, because there's no attack involved. Ditto for a weapon's special quality. As for the last example given (an extra free manoeuvre), as far as I know neither Cool nor Discipline offer that option with extra Advantages. Recovering Strain is the only reasonable use for those Advantages.

Advantage for strain recovery is only suggested for during combat encounters. After the combat encounter ends (i.e. before you roll to recover strain) recovering strain stops being a suggested use for advantage.

@P-47 Thunderbolt we've waited long enough for @ShockHelix , why don't you narrate out the end of 5he encounter, including that one of the droids in the ship shoot condor, rendering him unconscious.... when you get bvb back to the garage garrison, condor can be narrated as having to soak in a bacta tank for several days so we don't have to worry about waiting for him to take a turn.

29 minutes ago, EliasWindrider said:

when you get bvb back to the garage garrison,

What's "bvb"?

And what counts as the end of the encounter? After we've done the job with the lander and are ready to jet?

Wanting to make sure we're clear so I don't mess anything up.

56 minutes ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

What's "bvb"?

And what counts as the end of the encounter? After we've done the job with the lander and are ready to jet?

Wanting to make sure we're clear so I don't mess anything up.

Phone being finicky... I pressed a b and space with the same thumb press and it autocomplete spell miscorrected adding "vb b"

Yeah you've done the job with the lander and no lost clones although consor counts as a casualty because he was injured.

Just now, EliasWindrider said:

Phone being finicky... I pressed a b and space with the same thumb press and it autocomplete spell miscorrected adding "vb b"

Yeah you've done the job with the lander and no lost clones although consor counts as a casualty because he was injured.

Okay, didn't know if it was a relevant acronym.

It'll be a while (lot to write out), but I'll get the post up ASAP.