2 minutes ago, tunewalker said:

I am getting that kind of, I am curious if there was not a way that could have been done without having 3's in some of those stats.... Because the agility can be covered by Enhance, the willpower can just be covered by high discipline technically, and depending on what you need the intellect for with the introduction of the manipulate force power from the sentinel source book you might be able to get it without using anything besides that base power.... but core rulebook wise it would be needed. I am just curious as to what skills were needed and wanted and how dark/ light the character was because depending you could get pretty far I think without having to get higher will or physical abilities or you may be able to take a hit to intellect and physical abilities....

I'm not the maker of the character but when I think scoundrel I think agility (pilot/shooting), cunning, and presence to be typical, and force user adds willpower.

Well what I am understanding was he wanted a subtle force user nothing blatant, beyond that he said no shadow because not what he wanted and he was not interested in optimization. I am saying that optimizing that character a little can be done by taking good cunning and presence and supplementing the agility for the enhance force power and the will power is not needed for more subtle uses of the force such as enhance and sense or foresee or even some uses of influence or misdirect... it really all depends on what you are trying to do. Willpower is only really needed in using the influence power to make someone think falsehoods and move power to throw objects as an attack or if you were going full all-in and getting the 2 and 3 force rating abilities which are really just there for super high level xp stuff. Which at that point you can just pick it up through dedication because if you are spending that much xp already you are probably down to the bottom of a tree somewhere.

5 minutes ago, tunewalker said:

Well what I am understanding was he wanted a subtle force user nothing blatant, beyond that he said no shadow because not what he wanted and he was not interested in optimization. I am saying that optimizing that character a little can be done by taking good cunning and presence and supplementing the agility for the enhance force power and the will power is not needed for more subtle uses of the force such as enhance and sense or foresee or even some uses of influence or misdirect... it really all depends on what you are trying to do. Willpower is only really needed in using the influence power to make someone think falsehoods and move power to throw objects as an attack or if you were going full all-in and getting the 2 and 3 force rating abilities which are really just there for super high level xp stuff.

It takes 4 force die to be able to get at least 2 white pips most of the time, and even then ending up all black is not unheard of. If you want to commit a force die (e.g. sense defense or enhance) and still reliably get 2 white pips you're talking 5 force dice. If you're going to say use black pips, well you need destiny points and strain for that, and high starting willpower is that stat that helps with that.

29 minutes ago, EliasWindrider said:

I'm not the maker of the character but when I think scoundrel I think agility (pilot/shooting), cunning, and presence to be typical, and force user adds willpower.

Basically this. Had 3s in Agility, Willpower, and Cunning. Couldn’t get the 3 in Presence because the GM also said that if you ever want to be force sensitive you’d need to start with fr 1, so that’s what I spent my extra 10 xp from obligation on.

So 90 xp on the thrice rated 3 attributes and the rest on skills and FSE. And, picked up the basic sense power, quick draw and uncanny senses talents after gaining enough xp.

Obviously got some house-ruled limitations and is non-optimised, but still fun.

18 minutes ago, EliasWindrider said:

It takes 4 force die to be able to get at least 2 white pips most of the time, and even then e  nding up all black is not unheard of. If you want to commit a force die (e.g. sense defense or enh  ance) and still  reliably get 2 white pips you're talking 5 force dice. If you're going to say u  se black pips,  well you nee  d destiny points and strain for that, and high starting  willpower is that stat tha  t helps with that.

If your dice are committed what are you rolling force dice for? Also 4 force dice requires force rating of 4 which if you are doing that... that is a lot of xp you can get willpower through dedication at that point. If you are using black pips sure willpower will help out in the strain department, but so will grit which is everywhere. I am talking fairly low Xp levels here like 150 XP knight level play. Getting to 2 force rating which in most cases is only going to cost about 75xp and then getting enhance down the agility line which costs another 35. This results in 110xp spent with another 40 left over for other skills and sense or foresight or what have you and with shadow that also means getting "well rounded" (though you will have 25 less since shadow actually takes 100 to get force rating 2) which can get you 2 skills as career skills such as gunnery and piloting (space). If you are just starting out a character with 0 extra xp, then to optimize you need willpower even less because honestly you are probably not going to start out with any force powers at all and the extra 1 strain is not going to really save you as much as an extra die in either the cunning or the presence or agility. I am not saying hte character is "bad" I am simply stating that an unoptimized starting character is not a good example for why the system is poorly optimized, if that last sentence made any sense. The fact that a player could have fun with their character built that way and still have some of their play fantasies realized just goes to show how flexible the system is.

Oh, I’m not using my character to talk crap on the system. Just saying that the lightsaber attribute switching talents aren’t necessarily the huge double dip that they appear to be at first blush.

1 hour ago, AnomalousAuthor said:

Oh, I’m not using my character to talk crap on the system. Just saying that the lightsaber attribute switching talents aren’t necessarily the huge double dip that they appear to be at first blush.

This was my point... except for niman-disciple where it is the double dip. The 4 force die was in response to your @tunewalker

sage makes a good 1 spec obiwan comment.

Just now, EliasWindrider said:

This was my point... except for niman-disciple where it is the double dip.

Yep, I wasn’t disagreeing with you. 🍻

28 minutes ago, EliasWindrider said:

This was my point... except for niman-disciple where it is the double dip. The 4 force die was in response to your @tunewalker

sage makes a good 1 spec obiwan comment.

I will say that the sage makes a good 1 spec obi-wan thing is more a response to the guy saying you can't do what jedi do with this system which I feel is wrong. Yes you MAY have to use dark side from time to time for reliability, but that is fine. With just knight level Xp it really is kind of easy to get fairly close to jedi level abilities. Either way Obi-wan is typically an unfair measuring stick for that anyway as he is an end of career character and mentor npc even within A new Hope. He is a character that should exceed what most can do with knight level XP, but even then if you are ok using the dark side every now and again you can pull off a lot of things with very little XP investment, and Obi-like character would have 4 will and 3 int....

7 minutes ago, tunewalker said:

I will say that the sage makes a good 1 spec obi-wan thing is more a response to the guy saying you can't do what jedi do with this system which I feel is wrong. Yes you MAY have to use dark side from time to time for reliability, but that is fine. With just knight level Xp it really is kind of easy to get fairly close to jedi level abilities. Either way Obi-wan is typically an unfair measuring stick for that anyway as he is an end of career character and mentor npc even within A new Hope. He is a character that should exceed what most can do with knight level XP, but even then if you are ok using the dark side every now and again you can pull off a lot of things with very little XP investment, and Obi-like character would have 4 will and 3 int....

Obiwan as of the prequels has official stats (rise of the separatists I think) and they're really impressive.

5 minutes ago, EliasWindrider said:

Obiwan as of the prequels has official stats (rise of the separatists I think) and they're really impressive.

Oh I know, and I know that he has official old man stats as well. In fact most of the movie characters have stats and they are all high. I think my point was to make a character (not neccisarily obi-wan himself) who can replicate all of the things we see Old Ben do in A New hope. Which force power wise was influence some stormtroopers and misdirect some storm troopers which can all be achieve with just 45 XP being spent on force powers and only really needs a force rating of 2 to achieve which will only take 70xp. Basically the idea that with 150 xp you can make a character that is close in power to your AVERAGE jedi not one of your big main character or master class characters and to prove that I put together a 150 xp spec that could achieve the same tricks ben did in A New Hope and had that as a measure of "average jedi". That is my only point it says "knight level play" can get your character on the cusp of being a jedi and it can, but you are still only on the cusp you still need to use the dark every now and again, but most tricks you think of that a jedi can do you can get your character to do at least a few of those.... you will likely never reach the same capability as the big characters from the movies but that is why they are the big characters.

On 5/18/2019 at 9:48 PM, Decorus said:

Temple Guardian

Jedi Consular

Jedi Guardian

jedi Sentinel

Jedi Commander

and Jedi General since a Jedi Commander was a Padawan.

On 5/24/2019 at 7:54 PM, EliasWindrider said:

We *get*

I've read the details of The Collapse of the Republic on the Star wars FFG site that goes into details of all the new careers and specializations and no where does it mentions Jedi Master and Jedi General.

https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2019/3/8/collapse-of-the-republic/

Where is the link to this information that people are saying its in the book? Because the star wars FFG sales site does not mention it.

20 minutes ago, Metalghost said:

I've read the details of The Collapse of the Republic on the Star wars FFG site that goes into details of all the new careers and specializations and no where does it mentions Jedi Master and Jedi General.

https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2019/3/8/collapse-of-the-republic/

Where is the link to this information that people are saying its in the book? Because the star wars FFG sales site does not mention it.

Second Preview.

The first 2 rows of the Jedi: General, Jedi: Master, and 2 Universals Senator & Seperatist Commander.

The previous article showcased the Death Watch Warrior.

29 minutes ago, Jareth Valar said:

Second Preview.

The first 2 rows of the Jedi: General, Jedi: Master, and 2 Universals Senator & Seperatist Commander.

The previous article showcased the Death Watch Warrior.

Sweet don't understand why their article didn't put those in there in the first place. But I play a mandalorian so wont be using that material anytime soon since our campaign is between Star wars a new hope and Empire strikes back. I was given the option to remake my character and I probably could have remade him as a Jedi that survived that long but it didn't feel right. Also I love the direction my mandalorian is going. He uses a lightsaber, and is a tank type of character with 4 force die. Doesn't care though with the Jedi ways or that old religion he only cares about his mandalorian heritage and culture. Now I'm trying to add in extra specializations that round him out more like a piloting spec. Also going down the enhancement tree to boost his agility since he is a intelligence type of character. Once I do both of those his agility should be 3 and can boost it to 5. It will give him more flexibility when it comes to weapons and also will help him be a decent pilot. Trying to use force powers to support his fighting style instead of being a space wizard using the force to cause damage like move and stuff. Also we need to lay low with the empire hunting down force sensitives and if I'm running around using force powers that will attract to much attention. Though we have been using lightsabers lol so that should make us stand out anyways.

Might check out the deathwatch career, don't know if I will go that route, since my character is not a bounty hunter/assassin, though he tries to pretend he is one to keep the empire off his back with some of the restricted gear he uses. after I do the starfighter ace spec he will need to go into a second lightsaber spec to balance himself out. Either Shien or Niman, right now he is only Soretsu. After that he will be pretty well rounded with a decent force to help protect himself, throw a lightsaber, and use force jump that should always succeed even with I have 2 force dedicated to sense. Even though doing that will have him attract attention so I need to be carefull how I use him.

21 minutes ago, Metalghost said:

Sweet don't understand why their article didn't put those in there in the first place. But I play a mandalorian so wont be using that material anytime soon since our campaign is between Star wars a new hope and Empire strikes back. I was given the option to remake my character and I probably could have remade him as a Jedi that survived that long but it didn't feel right. Also I love the direction my mandalorian is going. He uses a lightsaber, and is a tank type of character with 4 force die. Doesn't care though with the Jedi ways or that old religion he only cares about his mandalorian heritage and culture. Now I'm trying to add in extra specializations that round him out more like a piloting spec. Also going down the enhancement tree to boost his agility since he is a intelligence type of character. Once I do both of those his agility should be 3 and can boost it to 5. It will give him more flexibility when it comes to weapons and also will help him be a decent pilot. Trying to use force powers to support his fighting style instead of being a space wizard using the force to cause damage like move and stuff. Also we need to lay low with the empire hunting down force sensitives and if I'm running around using force powers that will attract to much attention. Though we have been using lightsabers lol so that should make us stand out anyways.

Might check out the deathwatch career, don't know if I will go that route, since my character is not a bounty hunter/assassin, though he tries to pretend he is one to keep the empire off his back with some of the restricted gear he uses. after I do the starfighter ace spec he will need to go into a second lightsaber spec to balance himself out. Either Shien or Niman, right now he is only Soretsu.

Sounds like you are having fun. 😎

Glad I could help point those out. Not sure why they weren't linked in the article you posted. *shrug*

6 minutes ago, Jareth Valar said:

Sounds like you are having fun. 😎

Glad I could help point those out. Not sure why they weren't linked in the article you posted. *shrug*

Ya the article you posted is a different article than the main one that talks about the book, its why I didnt see it. It is actually located on the right called on the front lines so you can click on it. Its why I missed it.

My mandalorian uses two lightsabers, I think it looks cool. I like having a character that can eventually and consistently force jump into a crowd of bad guys while duel wielding lightsabers. It will also attract the attention on me since I'm the tank of the group.

8 hours ago, Metalghost said:

Sweet don't understand why their article didn't put those in there in the first place. But I play a mandalorian so wont be using that material anytime soon since our campaign is between Star wars a new hope and Empire strikes back. I was given the option to remake my character and I probably could have remade him as a Jedi that survived that long but it didn't feel right. Also I love the direction my mandalorian is going. He uses a lightsaber, and is a tank type of character with 4 force die. Doesn't care though with the Jedi ways or that old religion he only cares about his mandalorian heritage and culture. Now I'm trying to add in extra specializations that round him out more like a piloting spec. Also going down the enhancement tree to boost his agility since he is a intelligence type of character. Once I do both of those his agility should be 3 and can boost it to 5. It will give him more flexibility when it comes to weapons and also will help him be a decent pilot. Trying to use force powers to support his fighting style instead of being a space wizard using the force to cause damage like move and stuff. Also we need to lay low with the empire hunting down force sensitives and if I'm running around using force powers that will attract to much attention. Though we have been using lightsabers lol so that should make us stand out anyways.

Might check out the deathwatch career, don't know if I will go that route, since my character is not a bounty hunter/assassin, though he tries to pretend he is one to keep the empire off his back with some of the restricted gear he uses. after I do the starfighter ace spec he will need to go into a second lightsaber spec to balance himself out. Either Shien or Niman, right now he is only Soretsu. After that he will be pretty well rounded with a decent force to help protect himself, throw a lightsaber, and use force jump that should always succeed even with I have 2 force dedicated to sense. Even though doing that will have him attract attention so I need to be carefull how I use him.

Then you probanly should check out the 1st preview that covers the deathwatch tree

7 hours ago, Daeglan said:

Then you probanly should check out the 1st preview that covers the deathwatch tree

I'll probably look into it.

Given Jedi are supposed to be diplomats, yet most of the social skills aren't in-class: Jedi Mediator?

3 minutes ago, NanashiAnon said:

Given Jedi are supposed to be diplomats, yet most of the social skills aren't in-class: Jedi Mediator?

Knight has Cool (repeated from Jedi career), Leadership, and Negotiation. Those, along with Lightsaber, pretty much make up the Jedi set of diplomacy skills. They are unlikely to use Charm, Coercion, or Deception as a mainstay of their diplomacy.

16 minutes ago, HappyDaze said:

Knight has Cool (repeated from Jedi career), Leadership, and Negotiation. Those, along with Lightsaber, pretty much make up the Jedi set of diplomacy skills. They are unlikely to use Charm, Coercion, or Deception as a mainstay of their diplomacy.

Master has charm. So i could see mediator having negotiation...knowledge outer rim under world.

Then jedi healer could be an option.

Medicine, xenology,

14 minutes ago, Daeglan said:

Master has charm. So i could see mediator having negotiation...knowledge outer rim under world.

Then jedi healer could be an option.

Medicine, xenology,

So basically just "Jedi x" where x is almost any FaD spec? Seems unnecessary to me, but if FFG really wants to milk it, maybe...

3 minutes ago, HappyDaze said:

So basically just "Jedi x" where x is almost any FaD spec? Seems unnecessary to me, but if FFG really wants to milk it, maybe...

Well we have 4 careers and pondering what the 2 additional careers might be.

1 hour ago, Daeglan said:

Well we have 4 careers and pondering what the 2 additional careers might be.

If they decide to give Jedi the usual number of specializations. They already started with only 2 and have announced 2. This makes it different from the usual 3 plus 3 set-up. If they had given us Master in RotS (perhaps in place of FS Outcast which could have gone into CotR), then I would be more convinced that they are intending to follow their usual pattern. At the moment, I would not be surprised if Jedi only has the 2 plus 2 specs that we know about. It also wouldn't bother me at all, since just about every Jedi spec that people are proposing are just variants of FaD specs we already have, and it's better IMO to use what's there rather than reinventing the wheel.