On 3/24/2020 at 7:14 PM, Blail Blerg said:

I'd like to treat you all to a new sick list I tried.

Captain Nym (48)

Dorsal Turret (3)

Sol Sixxa (46)
Dorsal Turret (3)

Tansarii Point Veteran (29)
Ion Cannon (6)

Dengar (53)
Jamming Beam (0)
Punishing One (5)
R5 Astromech (4)
Total: 197

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

Ion Scyks are sweet (I've been singing their praises for a while), and those Scurrg have a lot of arc coverage for their heft.

I'm inclined to try Autoblasters/Greedo on Dengar instead of the title, but *shrug* all good.

And a bomb seems necessary. Just one should do, so Nym can hold it as long as he likes. Seismic seems best, since you can put it between two rocks, and control more space.

My next iteration is with bombs. Hoping to try Han falcon too. Dengar is a no no.

Hes just not fun fun to play. If he gets headon bouta then great. If not he’s totally a wet noodle.

1 hour ago, Blail Blerg said:

My next iteration is with bombs. Hoping to try Han falcon too. Dengar is a no no.

Why not a Bounty Hunter with Slave 1?

2 hours ago, Cyptor said:

Why not a Bounty Hunter with Slave 1?

BH at init3 does not get much value from Slave1. (although its pasted on at 1 pt). The majority of its value is its pure flight-plan-stat-line (basically nearly equal to its jousting value). Again, a bulk list. Probably a fine list.

--

Here's the main point: Yes, right now generics are VERY good. I suspect a lot of games can be won on sheer bulk + firepower + block. But the assumption here is that an ace trades some generic power for higher flexibility and an ability to win games that you cannot win if you mess up the opening engage with bulk list. You also have to control for risk, as the ace is flimsy for its value compared to bulk + more bulk.

I hope you'll all note: this is a test: I don't know the answer. is an ace worth its value, or are generics and bulk SO aggressively costed that they are 60%+ the better answer? (I'm ok with that lol, makes non-bulk/ace lists a fun challenge). I recommend you all try it and report here, as I've done to share my learnings with you all.

1 minute ago, Blail Blerg said:

BH at init3 does not get much value from Slave1.

They get even less value out of it since they're not I3, they're I2:

Also, get too close to Boba Fenn, and you simply just ask: did I make a better build than boba Fenn?

Whereas: Fenn + bulk is a totally different play style, and has advantages: You have to micromanage the non-Fenn half of the list less (less to think about), it blocks. Its got huge bulk value. I suspect with multiple arcs and the scurrgs ability to take shots, that's it'll be a good list vs boba Fenn as well.

I'm willing to test it head on vs Boba Fenn too.

Lok Revenant (45)
Ion Cannon Turret (5)

Lok Revenant (45)
Dorsal Turret (3)

Cartel Spacer (25)
Ion Cannon (6)

Fenn Rau (68)
Fearless (3)
Total: 200

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

4 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:

BH at init3 does not get much value from Slave1. (although its pasted on at 1 pt). The majority of its value is its pure flight-plan-stat-line (basically nearly equal to its jousting value). Again, a bulk list. Probably a fine list.

--

Here's the main point: Yes, right now generics are VERY good. I suspect a lot of games can be won on sheer bulk + firepower + block. But the assumption here is that an ace trades some generic power for higher flexibility and an ability to win games that you cannot win if you mess up the opening engage with bulk list. You also have to control for risk, as the ace is flimsy for its value compared to bulk + more bulk

That’s fair.

I personally have found that bulk works best, but it has to be a bit fun/unusual. Nobody wants to play against boring beef. I also am of the opinion that FFG have specifically tailored HS to make boring bulk the best, so I’m playing extended right now.

Right now I’m really enjoying this Extended list:

-Scarif Base Pilot (58)

•Darth Vader

•0-0-0

4x TIE bomber with Barrage Rockets (35 each)

It’s a flexible beef list that’s fun and requires decisions.

42 minutes ago, Cyptor said:

That’s fair.

I personally have found that bulk works best, but it has to be a bit fun/unusual. Nobody wants to play against boring beef. I also am of the opinion that FFG have specifically tailored HS to make boring bulk the best, so I’m playing extended right now.

Right now I’m really enjoying this Extended list:

-Scarif Base Pilot (58)

•Darth Vader

•0-0-0

4x TIE bomber with Barrage Rockets (35 each)

It’s a flexible beef list that’s fun and requires decisions.

Yeah. Though, even in Extended, there's certain beefs that are REALLY good. Like Tier1 good.

That's a pretty cool list too. How's it flying so far?

11 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:

Yeah. Though, even in Extended, there's certain beefs that are REALLY good. Like Tier1 good.

That's a pretty cool list too. How's it flying so far?

Pretty good. It doesn’t have a great endgame, but almost always goes to time with a favorable result.

The bombers get off the rockets less than you might think, but it doesn’t affect them very much, and they’re really tanky. Usually one dies, the sbp dies, and a bomber goes to half-health, or two and a half bombers die.

Usually I leave the bombers in a tight 2x2 formation, and flank with Sbp. Vader is really good about pushing damage on, especially with the jam action on sbp. And 000 does his annoying thing.

I haven’t played against any pure ace lists yet though, like Vader or Soontir, so we’ll see how that goes.

It also is a horrid matchup vs. Wedge.

But fun regardless:)

I tried the next iteration. Han also hit like a wet noodle. No, it didn't help I got blocked by a block of ties, but still, a block of ties, a bit hard to avoid. Your milage may vary: This list is probably better against lower number of ships, like an aces list. It has an uphill time vs FO ties or imp ties / bulk. Nym was simply taken out in 2 turns, for meager damage in return (this lists' damage output is quite low)

Even with Nym and the bombs, I never got off a bomb on my opponent and ended up doing a ton of damage to myself. The list is definitely clumsy, with 2 medium bases and a large base. You're playing 4D tetris while playing 4D chess. No greedo. The scyk can arguably go down to auto blasters, but the 3 die attack at R3 was sometimes useful.

I think this is a list that wants to just slow roll and joust thru some rocks.

Captain Nym (48)
Greedo (1)
Bomblet Generator (5)

Sol Sixxa (46)
Seismic Charges (3)

Cartel Spacer (25)
Ion Cannon (6)

Han Solo (54)
Trick Shot (4)
0-0-0 (5)
Lando’s Millennium Falcon (3)
Total: 200

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

Version 5:

Lok Revenant (45)
Dorsal Turret (3)
Bomblet Generator (5)

Sol Sixxa (46)
Dorsal Turret (3)
Seismic Charges (3)

Cartel Spacer (25)
Ion Cannon (6)

Han Solo (54)
0-0-0 (5)
4-LOM (2)
Lando’s Millennium Falcon (3)
Total: 200

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

There might be a case for abandoning the ace altogether at this point and making a nasty multi arc, multi bomb list.

11 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

Also, get too close to Boba Fenn, and you simply just ask: did I make a better build than boba Fenn?

Notsomuch, I think. Boba/Fenn is a strong list against anything. If you go different route, you may be looking at a more match up variance, but have better answers to certain other things. Like maybe answers to Boba/Fenn that aren't bid more .

Bounty Hunters are massively good. They don't gain a lot from Slave 1, but it's 1pt, you don't need a bid, so whatever. If it comes up, it's great and it can also help with Systems phase shenanigans at any Init.

Personally not used it on them, for reasons, but still, there's no great argument against it.

2x BH is a real deal. I've run them with 3 Spacers/ 2x PerCo, CC + 1 Outmanouevre Skull in recent months, both absolutely solid lists. Not better than Boba/Fenn, but more than capable of kicking it's teeth in.

1x BH, I've not run in a while, but picking 1 or more from PerCo/0-0-0/CC/S1 gives you a very good ship at very reasonable price.

Any new lists you been trying?

I'm getting rather tired of the generic spam + 1 ace meta.

I'm also missing the 2 ace + support archetype, as this is pretty dead right now vs generics + ace because of the 9 turn damage race.

----

@KCDodger , I tried your 5 Ion list! Its rather good, but I wasn't able to pull the win vs aces. Obviously, it had a good plan: Proton Bomb took Direct Hit on Soontir on the 3rd turn, but I wasn't able to seal the deal until much later, and the rest of his list largely avoided my damage.

I set up in a corner, with a near fortress starting move. Then turned in half so they were all going the same direction.

I wonder if something else would be better. The bombs are good damage.

I also think if this list is place extremely slowly, nearly like fortress style it would help it, but I'm a bit tired of the 2 arc, slow-go lists.

Not sure if it's already been covered, but I've been running up against this list locally in extended since we moved to online play temporarily. It's been a pretty versatile beast to deal with: pretty mobile, fairly durable, hits like a truck fairly consistently. Cast a net to torp an ace, block up and joust vs basically anything else with all that ordinance, and it can still initiative kill vs many swarms. And it doesn't really fall into the most common swarm + ace, aces + support, or huge generics swarm archetypes. Maybe give it a shot and see what you think.

Nu Squadron Pilot (32)
Passive Sensors (3)
Proton Torpedoes (13)
Xg-1 Assault Configuration (0)
Autoblasters (3)

Nu Squadron Pilot (32)
Passive Sensors (3)
Proton Torpedoes (13)
Xg-1 Assault Configuration (0)
Autoblasters (3)

Nu Squadron Pilot (32)
Passive Sensors (3)
Proton Torpedoes (13)
Xg-1 Assault Configuration (0)
Autoblasters (3)

Nu Squadron Pilot (32)
Passive Sensors (3)
Concussion Missiles (6)
Xg-1 Assault Configuration (0)
Autoblasters (3)
Total: 197

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

Since picking up a second Servants of Strife pack, I've managed to fly this a couple times. Once versus some jank Guri/Moralo and once versus a Scum Salad. Won both games pretty strongly. I want to see how it does against real Aces, but it's got legs against beefy stuff, apparently. (First iteration was with Wat and no Relay - and that hit pretty hard once or twice - but this second iteration with the FOA feels much stronger.)

General Grievous (44)
Outmaneuver (6)
Impervium Plating (4)
Soulless One (6)
Ship total: 60 Half Points: 30 Threshold: 4

Feethan Ottraw Autopilot (35)
TV-94 (5)
Ship total: 40 Half Points: 20 Threshold: 3

Trade Federation Drone (19)
Grappling Struts (1)
Ship total: 20 Half Points: 10 Threshold: 2

Trade Federation Drone (19)
Grappling Struts (1)
Ship total: 20 Half Points: 10 Threshold: 2

Trade Federation Drone (19)
Grappling Struts (1)
Ship total: 20 Half Points: 10 Threshold: 2

Trade Federation Drone (19)
Grappling Struts (1)
Ship total: 20 Half Points: 10 Threshold: 2

Trade Federation Drone (19)
Grappling Struts (1)
Ship total: 20 Half Points: 10 Threshold: 2

Total: 200

Forces opponent to either try to shut down flanking Grievous and take a flight of droids uncontested, or let Grievous have his dirty, filthy way with their list while they engage the droids. I really do fear that Trade Fed Drones are maybe a little too good for their cost.

I have been bouncing bqck and forth between 4 X wings and 2 E wings + something. The E wings are rouges with R3, FCS. I have tried them with proton torpedoes and Norra in the ARC.

Then swapped norra for wedge.

Then dropped the protons and wedge for Lando. I think the thirs iteration is the best one so far. The falcon keeps norras beef but doesnt lose as much offense.

4 X wings has been my new favorite list. I am running selfless red, Biggs, thane, wedge. It is my new favorite list to fly. This season I am stepping out of my B wing and Y wing comfort zone and this list has been a blast for me.

3 hours ago, Kleeg005 said:

Since picking up a second Servants of Strife pack, I've managed to fly this a couple times. Once versus some jank Guri/Moralo and once versus a Scum Salad. Won both games pretty strongly. I want to see how it does against real Aces, but it's got legs against beefy stuff, apparently. (First iteration was with Wat and no Relay - and that hit pretty hard once or twice - but this second iteration with the FOA feels much stronger.)

General Grievous (44)
Outmaneuver (6)
Impervium Plating (4)
Soulless One (6)
Ship total: 60 Half Points: 30 Threshold: 4

Feethan Ottraw Autopilot (35)
TV-94 (5)
Ship total: 40 Half Points: 20 Threshold: 3

Trade Federation Drone (19)
Grappling Struts (1)
Ship total: 20 Half Points: 10 Threshold: 2

Trade Federation Drone (19)
Grappling Struts (1)
Ship total: 20 Half Points: 10 Threshold: 2

Trade Federation Drone (19)
Grappling Struts (1)
Ship total: 20 Half Points: 10 Threshold: 2

Trade Federation Drone (19)
Grappling Struts (1)
Ship total: 20 Half Points: 10 Threshold: 2

Trade Federation Drone (19)
Grappling Struts (1)
Ship total: 20 Half Points: 10 Threshold: 2

Total: 200

Forces opponent to either try to shut down flanking Grievous and take a flight of droids uncontested, or let Grievous have his dirty, filthy way with their list while they engage the droids. I really do fear that Trade Fed Drones are maybe a little too good for their cost.

How are you finding TV-94? Straight-up adding a hit is good, but I've found that it doesn't trigger that often (missed bullseye), or that I've already spent the calculate defending by the time the opportunity rolls around. Is there a particular flight pattern that makes it more effective?

On 5/29/2020 at 10:01 AM, QQMoore said:

How are you finding TV-94? Straight-up adding a hit is good, but I've found that it doesn't trigger that often (missed bullseye), or that I've already spent the calculate defending by the time the opportunity rolls around. Is there a particular flight pattern that makes it more effective?

In the three or four games I've used TV-94, I reckon I've had benefit maybe...nine times? I think of it this way: it's Advanced Optics, but for an entire squad. An entire squad of cheap cannon fodder that can share tokens. Or perhaps a better comparison, think about Captain Sear - the Sear Swarm was *EVERYWHERE* for a while, and it too hinges upon getting a bullseye. Like I say, I haven't had a ton of experience yet using TV-94, and I never really bought into the Sear Swarm as I didn't have the necessary mass of Drones at the time. They use very similar attack patterns, though, so you could probably watch some of the old videos for better instruction than I could ever give, ha ha. But in my mind, the key to maximizing that bulls-eye coverage is to not necessarily fly in formation. The more "random" angles you can set up, the more coverage you get, right? Of course, a *LOT* of that depends on what your opponent brings and how they fly it.

8 hours ago, JonB2 said:

Not sure if it's already been covered, but I've been running up against this list locally in extended since we moved to online play temporarily. It's been a pretty versatile beast to deal with: pretty mobile, fairly durable, hits like a truck fairly consistently. Cast a net to torp an ace, block up and joust vs basically anything else with all that ordinance, and it can still initiative kill vs many swarms. And it doesn't really fall into the most common swarm + ace, aces + support, or huge generics swarm archetypes. Maybe give it a shot and see what you think.

Nu Squadron Pilot (32)
Passive Sensors (3)
Proton Torpedoes (13)
Xg-1 Assault Configuration (0)
Autoblasters (3)

Nu Squadron Pilot (32)
Passive Sensors (3)
Proton Torpedoes (13)
Xg-1 Assault Configuration (0)
Autoblasters (3)

Nu Squadron Pilot (32)
Passive Sensors (3)
Proton Torpedoes (13)
Xg-1 Assault Configuration (0)
Autoblasters (3)

Nu Squadron Pilot (32)
Passive Sensors (3)
Concussion Missiles (6)
Xg-1 Assault Configuration (0)
Autoblasters (3)
Total: 197

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

Rather exciting.

could you talk a bit more about how it works?

4 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:

Rather exciting.

could you talk a bit more about how it works?

Well, from the games I've seen and played against it, normally it tries to slow roll in at first to get a good range band for the ordinance with passive sensors. If need be it can spread out very quickly with a round of slams to make a net to catch aces too. If it gets caught in bumps or needs to slam it still has the autoblasters and with the wide range of maneuvers you can pull with slam getting the auto-hit crits through is more likely and a nice bonus.

After the first pass, any ships that get a chance to break away can take a turn to reload before charging back in so the squad is consistently pelting ordinance so you can't really rely on outlasting the torp charges. The only downside is that the gunboat usually only gets single modded shots but with the torps and the volume of them being shot it's generally enough. If you don't disengage you can still get 3-4 dice autoblaster shots if you're in close or finish unloading ordinance so either way it's a pretty punchy squad.

Pinning them down can be trickier with a wide open dial, no innate actions and only 1 maneuver that causes stress leaving a slamming gunboat very mobile so getting multiple arcs on one is a bit harder than normal and they're just as sturdy as a resistance X-Wing so it winds up being pretty beefy.

It works like a jack-of-all-trades with good speed, good beef, good punch, middling ship count. The best player locally with it plays it mixing things up with slugging in close or doing strafing torp runs as needs must to keep from taking too many shots at a time on any one ship and just lobbing torps at every opportunity and will happily switch back and forth.

Ion should work well if you can tag one and then pounce, and they have limited blue moves if you can induce stress. We just don't see over much of those locally and if you only bring a little bit expect it to be a high target priority for the first volley of torps.

Kinda rambling, but that's what I've got, hope it helps.

2 hours ago, JonB2 said:

Well, from the games I've seen and played against it, normally it tries to slow roll in at first to get a good range band for the ordinance with passive sensors. If need be it can spread out very quickly with a round of slams to make a net to catch aces too. If it gets caught in bumps or needs to slam it still has the autoblasters and with the wide range of maneuvers you can pull with slam getting the auto-hit crits through is more likely and a nice bonus.

After the first pass, any ships that get a chance to break away can take a turn to reload before charging back in so the squad is consistently pelting ordinance so you can't really rely on outlasting the torp charges. The only downside is that the gunboat usually only gets single modded shots but with the torps and the volume of them being shot it's generally enough. If you don't disengage you can still get 3-4 dice autoblaster shots if you're in close or finish unloading ordinance so either way it's a pretty punchy squad.

Pinning them down can be trickier with a wide open dial, no innate actions and only 1 maneuver that causes stress leaving a slamming gunboat very mobile so getting multiple arcs on one is a bit harder than normal and they're just as sturdy as a resistance X-Wing so it winds up being pretty beefy.

It works like a jack-of-all-trades with good speed, good beef, good punch, middling ship count. The best player locally with it plays it mixing things up with slugging in close or doing strafing torp runs as needs must to keep from taking too many shots at a time on any one ship and just lobbing torps at every opportunity and will happily switch back and forth.

Ion should work well if you can tag one and then pounce, and they have limited blue moves if you can induce stress. We just don't see over much of those locally and if you only bring a little bit expect it to be a high target priority for the first volley of torps.

Kinda rambling, but that's what I've got, hope it helps.

Def does.

What's the success level of this list? T1 Meta-predator? T2 Strong? Or T3 jank?

13 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:

Def does.

What's the success level of this list? T1 Meta-predator? T2 Strong? Or T3 jank?

I'll leave that up to those with more tournament experience than I, but I can say I've not seen it lose a game yet locally from the handful I've been there for and it is a lot of fun to play against as it makes for a pretty dynamic game. Though we have been wondering why this hasn't been a thing before and if we're all just missing something or if the models are just too hard / expensive to get right now.

11 minutes ago, JonB2 said:

I'll leave that up to those with more tournament experience than I, but I can say I've not seen it lose a game yet locally from the handful I've been there for and it is a lot of fun to play against as it makes for a pretty dynamic game. Though we have been wondering why this hasn't been a thing before and if we're all just missing something or if the models are just too hard / expensive to get right now.

I have only 3 opened gunboats, and a still packaged 1.0 gunboat. So I would have trouble

1 minute ago, Blail Blerg said:

I have only 3 opened gunboats, and a still packaged 1.0 gunboat. So I would have trouble

Hence why it only showed up for us online during shelter-in-place orders. We would struggle to field 4 gunboats of any kind between the lot of us.

Try this Blail:

Demolition Derby

(48) Captain Nym [Scurrg H-6 bomber]
(6) Proximity Mines
(2) Skilled Bombardier
(3) Intimidation
Points: 59

(46) Sol Sixxa [Scurrg H-6 bomber]
(6) Proximity Mines
(3) Seismic Charges
(2) Skilled Bombardier
(3) Intimidation
Points: 60

(41) Cartel Executioner [M12-L Kimogila Fighter]
(3) Intimidation
Points: 44

(30) Unkar Plutt [Quadrijet Transfer Spacetug]
(6) Proximity Mines
Points: 36

Total points: 199

1 hour ago, Cerebrawl said:

Try this Blail:

Demolition Derby

(48) Captain Nym [Scurrg H-6 bomber]
(6) Proximity Mines
(2) Skilled Bombardier
(3) Intimidation
Points: 59

(46) Sol Sixxa [Scurrg H-6 bomber]
(6) Proximity Mines
(3) Seismic Charges
(2) Skilled Bombardier
(3) Intimidation
Points: 60

(41) Cartel Executioner [M12-L Kimogila Fighter]
(3) Intimidation
Points: 44

(30) Unkar Plutt [Quadrijet Transfer Spacetug]
(6) Proximity Mines
Points: 36

Total points: 199

Ho ho ho. A poster after my heart.
ive been playing with scurggs a lot. And this seems like it can drop some sick bombs.

what is unkar plutt good at?
Also what’s the strategy and wincon overall?

a nice addition to my collectionnnnn