#L5RLive

By FFGElena, in Legend of the Five Rings: The Card Game

On 6/28/2017 at 3:07 PM, WHW said:

WOW, Dragon Clan is amazing! I think I found my faction! This article and fiction both bought me all in! Fantastic job!!

DRAGON CLAN / CARD SPECIFIC
Togashi Kazue! Can you use her ability to steal Fate on characters you opponent controls?

ANSWER: Yes

On 6/29/2017 at 4:39 AM, WHW said:

LION - DRAGON / CARD DESIGN QUESTION

I really like Ancestral mechanic, and I was quite surprised when I realized that Guidance of the Ancestors isn't Ancestral, though it functions actually pretty much the same, minus being less vulnerable to attachment hate. What makes GotA special and what is the philosophy behind it being "play from discard pile" versus giving it Ancestral?

ANSWER; To make it better than standard ancestral

On 6/29/2017 at 4:40 AM, WHW said:

MECHANICS QUESTION

What happens when I want to play a Restricted Attachment on a character with 2 Restricted Attachments already attached? Is this impossible, or do I just "bounce" one of the already attached attachments to the discard pile?

ANSWER: One gets discarded (Unsure who chooses), can retrigger Niten Master.

On 6/29/2017 at 8:45 AM, Descent said:

GAME PLAY QUESTION

What is the exact resolution timing for conflict resolution, do you do reactions to winning a ring, then break the province (if applicable), then trigger ring effect, then keywords?

PARTIAL ANSWER: Rings happens before you go home bowed, so you cannot use Water to straighten a character in this conflict.

On 6/29/2017 at 8:48 AM, Descent said:

DESIGN PHILOSOPHY QUESTION

Do you guys feel like removing a copy from a province of a unique character already in play to place a fate on that character might steer people into building decks full of unique characters? What is the design intention behind this mechanic since it seems to reward variance or unique character heavy decks since there's no penalty when a unique character leaves the field (permanent death).

ANSWER: Its in the video, not going to summarize.

On 6/29/2017 at 0:29 PM, phillos said:

"When attached card leaves play."

It's worth asking if "attached card" in this card text refers to the attachment itself or the card the attachment is attached to because that is generating quite a bit of debate and strictly speaking it is ambiguous without seeing more rules definitions for this game. I suspect you are correct but it would be nice to put it to bed. I'll restate it in the established format so it's easier for Elena to pick out of the crowd.

DRAGON CLAN / MECHANICS QUESTION

Please explain the Ancestral keyword. Is "When attached card leaves play." referring to the attachment itself or the card on which it is attached. For example can you use Let Go to return Ancestral Daisho to your hand?

ANSWER: I misheard. Someone else figure it out.

Edited by Mirith
2 minutes ago, Mirith said:

ANSWER: When the attachment leaves play, either from a character being discarded or if you Let it Go! Discarding from hand does not count.

Let Go does discard the attachment. Brad mentions this specifically at around 36:40. Ancestral only triggers if the character leaves play by some means.

MECHANICS/ CRAB CLAN / STOIC GUNSO

Can you sacrifice a character to Stoic Gunso who has Reprieve on it? And if so, does the reprieve prevent the discard? Or does it prevent you from paying the cost for the action?

Mechanics/Crab/Scorpion/Stoic Gunso/Blackmail

Is a character whose been controlled by blackmail considered friendly? And then eligible to be sacrificed by the Stoic Gunso?

WRONG THREAD UH I WILL FILL THIS WITH A COOL QUESTION LATER

OK here is the question:

Specific Cards Question / Design / Crab

Stoic Gunso's name made me think about card naming. "Stoic" isn't one of the first 10 words that come to mind when thinking about Crab Clan, yet after seeing his card, it seems strangely fitting. I think the same thing applies to Obstinate Recruit and Brash Samurai - both of which seem to represent the often forgotten facets of their Clans? Is there any philosophy behind these names? There is a lot of characterization for the Clans in the names overall!

Edited by WHW

During the 6/30 L5RLive Katrina Ostrander mentioned Broken Wave City .

I am happy to hear about a Mantis holding, but I would like to know if Kaigen's Island exist at the start of the LCG?

If it doesn't, where is Broken Wave City located?

Is there an action window between declaring attackers and declaring defenders?

12 hours ago, Sparks Duh said:

FFG has already answered this. You are allowed to declare 1 political and 1 military conflict each turn. If you declare a Military conflict, why would you be able to declare another military conflict?

I'm confused about your response. Are you saying that FFG has said you can declare 1 military and 1 political conflict each turn and thus you assume this is how it works, or are you saying that FFG has already answered specifically how Mori Kuroi (or other effects that change the conflict type) interacts with what type of conflict you will be able to declare for your second conflict?

Edited by Suzume Tomonori
3 hours ago, Suzume Tomonori said:

I'm confused about your response. Are you saying that FFG has said you can declare 1 military and 1 political conflict each turn and thus you assume this is how it works, or are you saying that FFG has already answered specifically how Mori Kuroi (or other effects that change the conflict type) interacts with what type of conflict you will be able to declare for your second conflict?

If it's like other LCGs, then declaring your conflict has nothing to do with what the conflict turns into via game effects. You can declare 1 Military and 1 Political conflict per turn, period. If your Military conflict gets turned into a Political one, you still declared a Military conflict. Your last remaining conflict will have to be declared as a Political one.

On 6/29/2017 at 2:57 PM, phillos said:

Gaffa are you really arguing that an assumption isn't an assumption? I thought you were better than that.

It's an "assumption" only insofar as it's the same ruling for the same effect they've had in other games (in particular, both versions of Game of Thrones). Since every other mechanic that L5R has shared with other LCGs so far has turned out to share the same rules as the other LCGs (not surprising, since they're not only from the same company but also the same designers), presuming that Ancestral will work just like the default attachments in Game of Thrones is hardly going out on a limb. Again, we'd be more surprised if they made a special rule just for one game that went against the rest of their games.

On 6/29/2017 at 6:11 PM, phillos said:

You are making an educated guess. An educated guess is still a guess.

No, we're not. We're looking at the same mechanic (only the name has changed) used in other games from the same designer in the same company. So far in all the parallels L5R has had with the other LCGs, they've shared the same same rule structure (which is not surprising, they like having a general unified rules set beneath all their games).

It's not a guess. A guess has no data to back it up, no real reason to expect it to be correct beyond your own gut feeling. Yes, it's possible that L5R will get a unique rule for the same effect that other LCGs have used exactly the same as each other. Given how FFG manages their rules between their games, it's very unlikely it will happen. That's not a guess. That's coming to a reasonable conclusion based on years of data.

17 hours ago, Eu8L1ch said:

RULES QUESTIONS

If I have Togashi Yokuni in play, can I copy an ability printed on a character with Cloud the Mind attached to it?

You can't copy an ability that is not there, because Cloud the Mind causes that character to lose everything in their text box except for Traits (which is how every other text-blanking card has worked in LCGs so far).

15 hours ago, Mirith said:

MECHANICS/ CRAB CLAN / STOIC GUNSO

Can you sacrifice a character to Stoic Gunso who has Reprieve on it? And if so, does the reprieve prevent the discard? Or does it prevent you from paying the cost for the action?

In every other LCG, sacrificing a card to pay a cost cannot be prevented. So in this case, the character could be sacrificed, and Reprieve would do nothing (it would be exactly like sacrificing a duplicated character in Thrones, for instance, which doesn't stop the sacrifice either).

5 hours ago, Suzume Tomonori said:

I'm confused about your response. Are you saying that FFG has said you can declare 1 military and 1 political conflict each turn and thus you assume this is how it works, or are you saying that FFG has already answered specifically how Mori Kuroi (or other effects that change the conflict type) interacts with what type of conflict you will be able to declare for your second conflict?

Sparks pointed out that FFG already answered the question, so we're certain that's how it works.

2 hours ago, Gaffa said:

If it's like other LCGs, then declaring your conflict has nothing to do with what the conflict turns into via game effects. You can declare 1 Military and 1 Political conflict per turn, period. If your Military conflict gets turned into a Political one, you still declared a Military conflict. Your last remaining conflict will have to be declared as a Political one.

In my mind my question made sense since I misremembered it as a Reaction (thus I could see an argument being made for it influencing the conflict type you declared). After double-checking however I see it actually is an Action, so there is no reason why it should change the type of conflict you declared - thus it is indeed a very punishing card for a Clan like Lion.

2 hours ago, Gaffa said:

You can't copy an ability that is not there, because Cloud the Mind causes that character to lose everything in their text box except for Traits (which is how every other text-blanking card has worked in LCGs so far).

That seems the most reasonable answer, and if you say it works like that in other games I am more than willing to accept it.

However, the rationale for my question derives from the fact that they treat "printed" as an absolute: IIRC, it is defined as what is on the card regardless of other cards' abilties. Thus, even if you are to treat the printed text box as blank as per Cloud the Mind's effect, the printed text box itself does not change (because it ignores the changes applied to it by other cards' effects), so effects referencing it could bypass Cloud the Mind's effect. The answer to this question depends on how they decide "referencing" works in this case: if referencing deals with in-game effects, then the text box is blank for that purpose, so it can't be copied (since it has no in-game effect); if referencing works at a more "fundamental" level (i.e. with printed as it is defined in the rulebook, not for its current in-game effect) then the ability can be copied: it has no effect on the game state but it is actually there in a meta-game sense. Choosing to reference abilities for their in-game effects seems more intuitive, but it messes with the way you define "printed" from a logical point of view (because the same word will have two different meanings in the context of the rules and in the context of the game, thus not being well-defined).

Edited by Eu8L1ch
6 hours ago, Gaffa said:

It's an "assumption" only insofar as it's the same ruling for the same effect they've had in other games (in particular, both versions of Game of Thrones). Since every other mechanic that L5R has shared with other LCGs so far has turned out to share the same rules as the other LCGs (not surprising, since they're not only from the same company but also the same designers), presuming that Ancestral will work just like the default attachments in Game of Thrones is hardly going out on a limb. Again, we'd be more surprised if they made a special rule just for one game that went against the rest of their games.

It was an assumption period. If you didn't know the answer you need to make an assumption to come to a conclusion. There is no logical proof here that definitively points to the answer based on information released about L5R. I like you, but I'm seeing this a lot in the L5R forum. It's really getting my goat. Just because they did something one way in an LCG or two in the past does not mean they will do it the same way here. We've seen plenty of evidence in the past to confirm just that. To present your conclusions as definitive answers is misleading. Dangerously so (well relatively speaking) if it causes people to form an incorrect impression of the game rules. Just be careful is all I'm saying.

Edited by phillos

RULES QUESTION

During the card draw/bidding stage, are you required to draw the full number of cards equal to the dial?

For example: Player 1 sets dial to 1, Player 2 sets dial to 5. Player 2 pays 4 honor to Player 1. Can Player 1 choose not to draw? Can Player 2 draw any number of cards between 1-5? Or are players required to draw the amount bid?

On 7/1/2017 at 4:22 AM, Gaffa said:

You can't copy an ability that is not there, because Cloud the Mind causes that character to lose everything in their text box except for Traits (which is how every other text-blanking card has worked in LCGs so far).

Cloud the Mind does not affect the text printed on the card though. It treats the card as if it does not have the text.

"T reat attached character as if its printed text box were blank (except for Traits )."

So the text box isn't blank. The character's just being treated as if its text box were blank. The text box is still very much there, but the character does not have access to it.

Yokuni's text reads " Action: Choose a triggered ability printed on another character – this character gains that ability until the end of the phase. (Max 1 per round.)"

So even if Cloud the Mind did literally blank the text box (which it doesn't), the word "Printed" in Game of Thrones has always meant "what it was before any other cards manipulate it." For example, if you had a character with a printed strength of 3 and a +2 strength attachment, their printed strength is still 3. If a character had the theoretical ability to copy the strength "printed on another character" (or the printed strength of a character) that character would copy 3 strength, not 5.

That is, of course, just an interpretation, but I feel it to be much more intuitive and in line both with the wording on the cards and the past treatment of the word "printed" in other FFG LCGs.

Edited by Joe From Cincinnati
31 minutes ago, Joe From Cincinnati said:

"T reat attached character as if its printed text box were blank (except for Traits )."

So the text box isn't blank. The character's just being treated as if its text box were blank. The text box is still very much there, but the character does not have access to it.

Neither do you - you're treating it as if blank.

20 minutes ago, BitRunr said:

Neither do you - you're treating it as if blank.

I think FFG should rule on this. I am just presenting the other well reasoned stance of this question. I'm not willing to concede this point without confirmation from FFG, as I see "treating" something as blank as being very different from it being blank. Especially since Yokuni copies "printed" text rather than current game state text. Printed text cannot change. It's literally printed on the card. Treating it as blank doesn't mean it's no longer printed there, which should give Yokuni access to it, as printed text.

36 minutes ago, Joe From Cincinnati said:

I think FFG should rule on this.

As do I, but I don't see how you can copy something when, for all intents and purposes other than Traits, which Yokuni's ability is not explicitly exempt from, you are required to treat the printed text block as blank.

My biggest questions are the Favor

I know I cannot attack without a character, but if I do and he goes home, they have no-one to defend, do I win?
What if they have someone but bowed? Is having a Character "worth more" even though it is still 0-1?
On the defense, do I get the favor bonus if no one blocks for me? If I send them home and again 1-0, do I win despite no one there?
And again, what if their guy is bowed and 1-0 again but I have no one there?

I....just don't know how to think about the Favor in these cases.

Wasn't it clarified that you need at least one character for your side to gain the +1F from the Favor?

4 minutes ago, Ser Nakata said:

Wasn't it clarified that you need at least one character for your side to gain the +1F from the Favor?

I know you cannot declare an attack without a character. But I am unsure about the favor.

5 hours ago, BitRunr said:

As do I, but I don't see how you can copy something when, for all intents and purposes other than Traits, which Yokuni's ability is not explicitly exempt from, you are required to treat the printed text block as blank.

See above - the conundrum remains because of how "printed" is defined in the rules.

Edited by Eu8L1ch