Maybe don't spend XP until you get the new pack?

Yep, this is the obvious solution. When you play the last scenario of an expansion, you record your XP. When you buy the next expansion (in that campaign), I would imagine you will be able to buy enough of the new cards to keep the deck new and fresh each time you play.

Plus we need to assess how much experience is gained in between scenarios. If it's 1 or 2 points, then swapping out cards would be problematic, if it's 4 or 5, then affording a new card would be feasible.

Then:

a) if we make some street math of a possible expansion pack, we have 60 cards. Remove 34 (let's say) for the new scenario, 26 remains. Each card comes in 2 copies, so, we have 13 new cards / pack, that are split between 6 spheres (5 proper spheres + 1 neutral), and must cover also the new "levelled up cards". This means each sphere will get 2 new cards / pack, and possibly they will be both stronger versions of existing cards, or they will be one new card and one powered up old card. So, if you really need that single card, you should have the experience to pay for it.

Additionally, scenarios can be played stand alone. And you can introduce the house rule that new 0-level cards coming with exp packs can be swapped in for free when you get that pack and move to the new scenario. It's much better thematically considering the RPG like atmosphere of the game and the idea of campaign play to have rules forbidding players to rebuild entirely the deck from adventure to adventure. It'll also probably mean that scenarios are not built with specific decks in mind, so, we won't be getting a Carrock or Rhosgobel situation in AH LCG

I have my fingers crossed that every scenario will have rules for letting you play it as a one-off instead of as part of a campaign, similar to how the Saga quests work in LotR. Maybe they would include a set XP amount you can use to assemble your decks. I feel like otherwise the deck tinkerers are going to be a little disappointed. It might be wishful thinking though that the game is going to be all things to all types of players.

I have my fingers crossed that every scenario will have rules for letting you play it as a one-off instead of as part of a campaign, similar to how the Saga quests work in LotR. Maybe they would include a set XP amount you can use to assemble your decks. I feel like otherwise the deck tinkerers are going to be a little disappointed. It might be wishful thinking though that the game is going to be all things to all types of players.

I think this is almost inevitable. The first article about the game described campaign as the basic play mode, but also said 'It is easy to enjoy Arkham LCG as a series of standalone adventures.' Without rules for how to set up your deck, the adventure from mythos pack 6 in a cycle won't be properly playable standalone, and the same goes to a lesser extent with each previous adventure, so it seems very likely that there will be standalone setup instructions for every adventure.

Maybe don't spend XP until you get the new pack?

Yep, this is the obvious solution. When you play the last scenario of an expansion, you record your XP. When you buy the next expansion (in that campaign), I would imagine you will be able to buy enough of the new cards to keep the deck new and fresh each time you play.

Plus we need to assess how much experience is gained in between scenarios. If it's 1 or 2 points, then swapping out cards would be problematic, if it's 4 or 5, then affording a new card would be feasible.

Then:

a) if we make some street math of a possible expansion pack, we have 60 cards. Remove 34 (let's say) for the new scenario, 26 remains. Each card comes in 2 copies, so, we have 13 new cards / pack, that are split between 6 spheres (5 proper spheres + 1 neutral), and must cover also the new "levelled up cards". This means each sphere will get 2 new cards / pack, and possibly they will be both stronger versions of existing cards, or they will be one new card and one powered up old card. So, if you really need that single card, you should have the experience to pay for it.

Additionally, scenarios can be played stand alone. And you can introduce the house rule that new 0-level cards coming with exp packs can be swapped in for free when you get that pack and move to the new scenario. It's much better thematically considering the RPG like atmosphere of the game and the idea of campaign play to have rules forbidding players to rebuild entirely the deck from adventure to adventure. It'll also probably mean that scenarios are not built with specific decks in mind, so, we won't be getting a Carrock or Rhosgobel situation in AH LCG

If the mythos pack have more 10 cards that are not player cards then i will stop playing it immediately. I expected that it will only have a few cards for the scenario. All the encounter and location cards should have been in the deluxe set already.

If the mythos pack have more 10 cards that are not player cards then i will stop playing it immediately. I expected that it will only have a few cards for the scenario. All the encounter and location cards should have been in the deluxe set already.

If all the encounter and location cards are in the deluxe set, then either cards are waiting unused in the core set, or adventures in Mythos packs contain nothing not already encountered in deluxe set adventures. Why is that good?

I don't get why cards waiting unused is bad. The deluxe set have 156 cards. 92 of which will be scenario cards. I don't think we will use all of it with only 2 mission. Chances are the encounter packs there and those in the core sets will be reused throughout the campaign. Thats why the encounters are modular. The mythos pack will just need to have the scenario and some special cards in them to maintain the suspense.

I prefer to see more cards that i can use. Even with a 50 player card mythos pack, we would only get maybe 4 new cards per class.

you can introduce the house rule that new 0-level cards coming with exp packs can be swapped in for free when you get that pack and move to the new scenario. It's much better thematically considering the RPG like atmosphere of the game and the idea of campaign play to have rules forbidding players to rebuild entirely the deck from adventure to adventure. It'll also probably mean that scenarios are not built with specific decks in mind, so, we won't be getting a Carrock or Rhosgobel situation in AH LCG

There might even be an official rule for this, something similar to in the LotR Saga campaign that let you swap out heroes at the start of each expansion without incurring the penalty.

If the mythos pack have more 10 cards that are not player cards then i will stop playing it immediately. I expected that it will only have a few cards for the scenario. All the encounter and location cards should have been in the deluxe set already.

You might be disappointed then. I find it hard to imagine decent, narrative scenarios comprising of only 10 cards. I also agree that having unused cards in the deluxe boxes is a bad idea, I'd rather pay for cards I use, and not buy an expansion that then requires additional purchases to use many of the cards.

Maybe don't spend XP until you get the new pack?

Yep, this is the obvious solution. When you play the last scenario of an expansion, you record your XP. When you buy the next expansion (in that campaign), I would imagine you will be able to buy enough of the new cards to keep the deck new and fresh each time you play.

No, this is a terrible solution. It requires i adjust my play times to the schedule of releases. Lol thats ridiculous.

It seems really, really odd to me that as players we have to adjust our play times/exp spending strategies based on when cards are released. Ive literally never heard of such a thing before. ever. its really, really weird. All of this just kind of continues to enforce that 1 cost level 0 cards is kind of bogus.

Reason for that, is really simple - it's because you're gearing up for campaign not the current scenario. For example, if you already knew scenario in which you need to protect one location from waves of enemies you could build all of your deck around that.

First, this is going to happen after the first run through of a campaign anyway. You are going to know whats coming and are going to build your deck accordingly. And the flip side to that is you arent going to have any clue at all as to whats coming the first time so how can you know what to add and what to take out aside form what simply looks cool.

Second, there shouldnt be anything wrong with side decking in cards to your deck for a scenario you know you are going to have to encounter. Thats kind of the point of card games... you adjust your deck to handle situations. In LotR you pretty much had to redo your entire deck, which was overkill. This game it seems you should only need to swap out a handful of cards. My question is, why the weakest level cards have a cost. It muddies the water when you run into situations like new cards being released etc.

No, this is a terrible solution. It requires i adjust my play times to the schedule of releases. Lol thats ridiculous.

New player cards and scenarios come out at the same time, in a single pack.

You play a scenario. You gain some experience. You gain nothing by spending it right away, because you can't play the next scenario until the next pack comes out. You could swap in older cards, of course, but you can still do that if you wait.

So wait until the pack comes out to spend your XP.

I mean why would you spend XP before the next scenario's even available?

No, this is a terrible solution. It requires i adjust my play times to the schedule of releases. Lol thats ridiculous.

New player cards and scenarios come out at the same time, in a single pack.

You play a scenario. You gain some experience. You gain nothing by spending it right away, because you can't play the next scenario until the next pack comes out. You could swap in older cards, of course, but you can still do that if you wait.

So wait until the pack comes out to spend your XP.

I mean why would you spend XP before the next scenario's even available?

not everyone that plays this game is going to be right up there waiting on the next release fresh. what about people that start 6 months from now? 2 years? what if i stop playing and then come back a year later or im in the middle of a campaign when new scenarios are released etc. What if i have 3 new cards i want to use but a new set gets released that has something id rather use instead but oh i already spent my experience.

again, i can just say 'whatever' to the rule and sub in my new purchase immediately instead of the 3 cards so why even have the rule.

I guess what im really asking here is.. is there a REASON swapping in level 0 cards cost 1 experience? and if so, what is it? because i don't really feel like swapping out 0 cost cards for free between missions because a new set came is really being a big deal. especially on a first run through of a campaign if you havent ever played it before (so you dont really know whats coming and think some new cards will syngerize better). And if swapping new ones in that just released shouldnt be a big deal. why is it a deal at all?

Dat Hot Streak alone makes me want to build a rogue deck or possibly include it in any deck that can fit it. Hell, even that amulet of Wendy's looks like a blast in the right deck.

Amen to that. Costs a bit of XP, but 3 resources to 10 resources, yes please.

not everyone that plays this game is going to be right up there waiting on the next release fresh. what about people that start 6 months from now? 2 years? what if i stop playing and then come back a year later or im in the middle of a campaign when new scenarios are released etc. What if i have 3 new cards i want to use but a new set gets released that has something id rather use instead but oh i already spent my experience.

If you're going to have a 6 month break, just starting the campaign over or playing the scenarios as standalones seems like the way to go to me. That aside, spending XP before you start really does solve a lot of this. No, you won't be able to swap in 20 new cards of your 30 card deck or whatever, but you'll be able to make a few specific swaps.

The point of the rule is twofold: Narrative continuity and play balance.

For narrative, it should be fairly apparent why playing a deck that evolves over the course of the campaign creates a sense of story, and how limiting swaps contributes to that. XP is the mechanic FFG's chosen for that purpose.

In terms of play balance, being able to freely swap cards in and out lets you take advantage of synergies and lets you ignore some opportunity costs. For example, at the start of a campaign, you have zero xp, so you can't build with level 1+ cards. But there's a zero level card that combos really well with a particular level 2 card. So do you take that level zero card now, even if its utility is diminished without that combo? Or do you plan to spend the extra XP later to make the 0 level swap after you have access to the level 2 card, and begin the campaign with something else that's more useful in the meantime?

Not to mention that the ability to tailor your deck specifically to each specific scenario by freely swapping out cards is pretty powerful in its own right. I would imagine some of the difficulty of campaigns comes from needing to build a deck flexible enough to be piloted through many different scenarios, with limited adjustment.

But you know, your game. So do what you and your playgroup want!

Alright, lets look at the core set. I'm going to make generalizations, but yeah, stay with me. Let's assume the first scenario is majority of investigation. The second is about fleeing or catching, and the third is majority combat. The idea behind the xp system is that sure, you can go in to the first scenario with a deck that makes the investigation check really easy, and you'll breeze through no problem once so ever. However, with the xp system, now you can only change a couple of cards for the next scenario, and the one after that, making your long term game terribly unprepared and inadequate. It feels like the entire system is based on how well prepared you can be by making a generally prepared deck, and making the correct tweaks for what's ahead. With a 30 card deck, i feel if you could totally change it for each scenario, you'll be breezing through the game, as it seems if you want to keep the scenarios in line with the deck size, I feel that they will focus on a specific thing, because lets face it, you'll see a big chunk of your deck if you want to.

Did that make sense? Maybe not, it's all speculation anyway..

I mean, thematically, you're spending that 1xp from a 0 to a 0 to either learn a new skill, or learn how to use a new item. You're not just adding that item to your inventory, you're dedicating time to gain some skill with it, hence the xp cost. The investigators add to their skill set what will suit them for the upcoming challenge, and get rid of a skill that they deem unnecessary. They properly teach them how to use a skill or item, pushing to the side information they once had.

This makes sense to me anyway, as we're using xp to also level up items and skills. you're not getting better equipment, you're dedicating more time and effort into the skill of using whatever it is you're upgrading.

If the mythos pack have more 10 cards that are not player cards then i will stop playing it immediately. I expected that it will only have a few cards for the scenario. All the encounter and location cards should have been in the deluxe set already.

You might be disappointed then. I find it hard to imagine decent, narrative scenarios comprising of only 10 cards. I also agree that having unused cards in the deluxe boxes is a bad idea, I'd rather pay for cards I use, and not buy an expansion that then requires additional purchases to use many of the cards.

I'm expecting encounter sets that are used in multiple scenarios will be in the deluxe. Scenario specific encounter sets will be in the pack.

We'll get 2x 20 player cards in a pack.

10 scenario act cards (5 investigator and 5 mythos) and a 10 card encounter set.

There will also be a scenario rules card, which may not be part of the 60 card limit.

personally i find the 1 experience for level 0 card kind of dumb.

As someone else pointed out in another thread.. what happens when im in the middle of a campaign and a new expansion comes out with some cool cards i want to try. What, i'm suppose to play an entire mission first without my new cards to get more experience before i can swap in my new cards that i just bought and want to use right away? thats kind of bogus.

Now yes i know i can just swap them in and be damned with the requirement but if thats the case.. why have the 1 cost requirement for 0 cards at all? i just don't understand the reason.

I mean the idea is 0 cost cards could of been in the deck from the beginning anyway right?

Exactly. I feel, when a rule goes beyond the game, in this case, impacting my purchasing decision, I feel it's not a good rule to begin with. If I buy a new pack of cards, why do I have to spend precious resources to try out those new cards? Feels like a punishment for not waiting for all the cards to be released before starting a campaign or not starting over a new campaign.

If those 0-level cards can be included in your deck for free at the start of the campaign, then I will continue that trend mid-campaign. It feels very arbitrary otherwise.

Well we don't even know how much experience we could get after each mission. With each new pack only giving each class a few cards maybe it wouldn't really be an issue if you spend them on the new ones if you wanted to if you used them sparingly. The limitation might only prevent a player from wilfully changing up half his deck each time.

Everybody's arguing about having to spend xp to swap in 0 level cards when a new Mythos pack comes out, but we don't even know if 0 level cards will BE in Mythos packs. It's entirely possible that the 0 level cards will only be in the core and the deluxe expansions, and Mythos packs will contain only leveled investigator cards. If the deluxe expansions start the campaign that the Mythos packs continue, there's probably an assumption that you'll have xp going into the Mythos pack scenarios.

And once a campaign is in progress, there doesn't seem to be any functional difference between a card being level 0 or level 1 anyway.

I like the idea of having a cost to swap level 0 cards. You can have players who would like to spend XP to buy level 1 or higher cards because they want more powerful cards, while other players will focus their XP on flexibility. I can imagine a player using a big part of his XP to swap cards so that he can be well prepared for whatever scenario while another one will spend XP onto powerful combo cards.

Did we receive any information that in mythos packs we will receive 0 lvl cards? Maybe it's all about cards from deluxe expansions, and in mythos packs will be only upgraded ones from the base (CS or deluxe expansion) related to this campaign?

I think we can all agree one thing, the sooner the rules are posted the better. Get some clarity.

I think we can all agree one thing, the sooner the rules are posted the better. Get some clarity.

But we already know the rule that's being debated. People are just arguing about whether it's a good rule or not. (And I think knowing the distribution of cards in mythos packs might be useful, but that's a question about the cards, rather than the rules.)

No, this is a terrible solution. It requires i adjust my play times to the schedule of releases. Lol thats ridiculous.

If you reach the end of a scenario in a campaign, and the next part of the story is is the net expansion. You literally have nothing to lose by waiting to spend your XP. And to a degree, play times will be dictated by release schedules - you can't play the next installment until it is released. Also, you can't use the new cards until they are released anyway, so I don't understand where you are coming from on this?

Everybody's arguing about having to spend xp to swap in 0 level cards when a new Mythos pack comes out, but we don't even know if 0 level cards will BE in Mythos packs. It's entirely possible that the 0 level cards will only be in the core and the deluxe expansions, and Mythos packs will contain only leveled investigator cards. If the deluxe expansions start the campaign that the Mythos packs continue, there's probably an assumption that you'll have xp going into the Mythos pack scenarios.

And once a campaign is in progress, there doesn't seem to be any functional difference between a card being level 0 or level 1 anyway.

I was wondering if this would be the case. Or at least if the Mythos packs lean more towards higher level cards, with most of the level 0 cards being in the deluxe expansion. It would make sense to do it this way, especially since they have stated that the game is primarily aimed at campaign play.