2 minutes ago, Sturn said:

Without enclosed armor, Shan should have been knocked on her ****, suffer from the concussion effects (dazed on the ground), even if she was lucky enough to miss some of the fragmentation.

Yeah, that's kinda what I was expecting.

2 minutes ago, Sturn said:

I'm just trying to give a way to hand-wave it, not defending on-screen explosives realism. Hollywood seems to never get explosives right. At least we didn't see huge fireballs, which would never be seen unless you were firing some special and rarer ammo.

The first real frag grenade I tossed was actually kind of a let down IN APPEARANCE. I never doubted it was more deadlier then it appeared. If you toss a frag grenade in the middle of a clean parking lot, you actually aren't going to see much, as opposed to what you see in movies. Just because you don't see it, doesn't mean it isn't deadly. Thus, I was trying to explain that the mortar attack in Mando might not appear as deadly as it was. Perhaps Shan's helmet was good enough to resist much of the concussion and she was very lucky to not get hit much by the fragmentation. My grandfather was a recipient of a Stuka dive bomber attack. The bomb exploded right over his head while he was kneeling in the open picking up his dropped helmet. He only received two small pieces of frag, and I don't recall him saying he was knocked silly for a long while. So perhaps Sham had some of the same luck that allows me to be here typing this?

Fair enough. It'll just be a bit hard to watch...

It seems that explosives are just weaker in the Star Wars galaxy. In this game, the only grenades that seem to work like their real-world analogues are Thermal Detonators, and they are a bit high in damage and Breach, based on my (admittedly limited) understanding. It seems that a range of Medium (Long with appropriate launchers) and a Blast radius of Short would make the most sense, but most would also need a damage buff. It'd rightly discourage use in confined spaces.

I've pumped up my explosives a bit. I've argued that Thermal Detonators, despite their name and the astonished fear when Leia pulled one out, have been turned into simple frag grenades by Star Wars games. I had imagined it to actually be a high-tech extremely small nuke or incendiary grenade that would have easily killed everyone in Jabba's room. A simple grenade wouldn't have killed or even injured everyone in that large room. I think a certain video game had us first tossing Thermal Detonators around with only the effects of a small grenade. In my house rules I've made thermal detonators very scary, more costly, and rarer. Grenades have been pumped up a bit too especially regarding their area affects. But perhaps not the place to go in depth with what I've done to them.

2 minutes ago, Sturn said:

I've pumped up my explosives a bit. I've argued that Thermal Detonators, despite their name and the astonished fear when Leia pulled one out, have been turned into simple frag grenades by Star Wars games. I had imagined it to actually be a high-tech extremely small nuke or incendiary grenade that would have easily killed everyone in Jabba's room. A simple grenade wouldn't have killed or even injured everyone in that large room. I think a certain video game had us first tossing Thermal Detonators around with only the effects of a small grenade. In my house rules I've made thermal detonators very scary, more costly, and rarer. Grenades have been pumped up a bit too especially regarding their area affects. But perhaps not the place to go in depth with what I've done to them.

I'd love to see your ideas in their own thread.

Finally we can lay an enduring issue to rest. Jango is ad Mandalorian as Din Djarin is. So that discussion is finally done with.

Also yay for the Dark Troopers. Ohh, I wonder if we're going to get too see Gideon with implanted force powers in a Dark Trooper exoskeleton with the Dark Sabre fighting with Mando? It also kind of feels like Mando might end up with the funky force powers as well, if they go for that.

17 minutes ago, Darth Revenant said:

...

Ohh, I wonder if we're going to get too see Gideon with implanted force powers in a Dark Trooper exoskeleton with the Dark Sabre fighting with Mando? It also kind of feels like Mando might end up with the funky force powers as well, if they go for that.

I really hope that that does not occur.

21 minutes ago, Darth Revenant said:

Finally we can lay an enduring issue to rest. Jango is ad Mandalorian as Din Djarin is. So that discussion is finally done with.

I like the compromise that Alex from Star Wars Explained put forth in his review of the episode:

We already know that the Children of the Watch are considered a fringe extremist group of zealots. Perhaps “general” Mandalorian society doesn’t see foundlings and other such “adopted” Mandalorians as Mandalorians.

So, both statuses are true...from a certain point of view. (TM)

Just now, Nytwyng said:

I like the compromise that Alex from Star Wars Explained put forth in his review of the episode:

We already know that the Children of the Watch are considered a fringe extremist group of zealots. Perhaps “general” Mandalorian society doesn’t see foundlings and other such “adopted” Mandalorians as Mandalorians.

So, what we’ve known before is true...from a certain point of view. (TM)

Or, like I've always argued, Almec was disowning him out of convenience, not out of any legitimate claim. Politicians lie. A lot.

29 minutes ago, Darth Revenant said:

Also yay for the Dark Troopers. Ohh, I wonder if we're going to get too see Gideon with implanted force powers in a Dark Trooper exoskeleton with the Dark Sabre fighting with Mando? It also kind of feels like Mando might end up with the funky force powers as well, if they go for that.

I can't recall why, but once during the episode I went to, "Are they going to give Mando the Force?" I truly hope not. I can't recall what in the episode made me consider that, but you may have picked up on something too?? I don't want Season 4 to end with Mando, with the Force, and the Darksaber, ruling Mandalore. Nope please don't do that. No Force for Mando and give the Darksaber to Bo.

I was kinda hoping that the Dark Troopers were a cyborg mix of robot and old Clone Troopers (a dramatic zoom in reveals the same face of Boba). Then add Force infusion from the Child. I actually didn't hope for that last part. Overkill in my opinion. Way too one-upping like making a new Death Star into an entire planet that can shoot across the Galaxy.

But, I like your idea of Gideon in a Dark Trooper exoskeleton. In the video game an Imperial General created the Dark Troopers and ended up with some power armor at the climax. Add Force infusion (I kinda hope not) from the Child and we have a season ending epic battle involving Mando, Boba, and Shan (and others?). But I would rather the Force experiments be leading to how to give a clone of the Emperor force powers, not how to give it to Gideon. Just my personal preference.

I will bet money on seeing Mando in melee (not shooting them) with the Dark Troopers. He has the Spear of Lugh and he lost his big rifle I assume when the Razor Crest blew up. I want to see Mando with the spear and Boba with his gaderffi stick in a grand melee with the Dark Troopers. Oh, and again I think Boba could die? Slave 1 to Mando as everyone cries.

EDIT: I can never find every typo until I hit post.

9 minutes ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

Or, like I've always argued, Almec was disowning him out of convenience, not out of any legitimate claim. Politicians lie. A lot.

At the risk of reopening the same can of worms that’s been spilled many times before, I’m taking the behind-the-scenes explanation given for including Almec’s line, as well as LFL’s official stance between then and now into account.

Almec may have lied; may have been condescending towards Jango; may have been truthful according to the official Mandalorian perspective at the time (wouldn’t be the first time a society dismissed a certain subset).

Of course, I’ve always agreed that the way it was done allowed wiggle room for the “LFL official” status to change. While it appears it may now have indeed changed (which is fine), I think the information we’ve gotten still allows for wiggle room for both to be true from those Certain Points of View.

Have we seen that Stormtrooper lander before? Is it supposed to date from the Imperial days? Or is that supposed to be a new lander and a step towards what we saw the First Order with in the sequels?

Just now, Sturn said:

Have we seen that Stormtrooper lander before? Is it supposed to date from the Imperial days? Or is that supposed to be a new lander and a step towards what we saw the First Order with in the sequels?

Oh! I forgot to mention it. I thought it was awesome. I'm pretty sure it was added as retroactive worldbuilding for the First Order lander, as I don't remember having seen it before.

I really like it, as I really liked the First Order version since it reminded me so strongly of the landers in WWII (for obvious reasons, and presumably by intent).

35 minutes ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

Or, like I've always argued, Almec was disowning him out of convenience, not out of any legitimate claim. Politicians lie. A lot.

Also, it would be inconvenient for Mandalore to be the source for both a bounty hunter that tried to assassinate a senator, and being the template for the clone troopers ... considering your point about politicians lying - they are also conniving ... so disowning Jango was just a good political decision at that time.

1 hour ago, Darth Revenant said:

Finally we can lay an enduring issue to rest. Jango is ad Mandalorian as Din Djarin is. So that discussion is finally done with.

Also yay for the Dark Troopers. Ohh, I wonder if we're going to get too see Gideon with implanted force powers in a Dark Trooper exoskeleton with the Dark Sabre fighting with Mando? It also kind of feels like Mando might end up with the funky force powers as well, if they go for that.

Told you. 😝

1 hour ago, Nytwyng said:

I like the compromise that Alex from Star Wars Explained put forth in his review of the episode:

We already know that the Children of the Watch are considered a fringe extremist group of zealots. Perhaps “general” Mandalorian society doesn’t see foundlings and other such “adopted” Mandalorians as Mandalorians.

So, both statuses are true...from a certain point of view. (TM)

1 hour ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

Or, like I've always argued, Almec was disowning him out of convenience, not out of any legitimate claim. Politicians lie. A lot.

I’ve been saying that from the beginning, but would anyone believe me? Nooooo. 😝

29 minutes ago, Jegergryte said:

Also, it would be inconvenient for Mandalore to be the source for both a bounty hunter that tried to assassinate a senator, and being the template for the clone troopers ... considering your point about politicians lying - they are also conniving ... so disowning Jango was just a good political decision at that time.

🤔 😝

20 minutes ago, Jegergryte said:

Also, it would be inconvenient for Mandalore to be the source for both a bounty hunter that tried to assassinate a senator, and being the template for the clone troopers ... considering your point about politicians lying - they are also conniving ... so disowning Jango was just a good political decision at that time.

Politicians also parse things carefully to their benefit while remaining technically true. If the prevailing Mandalorian philosophy of the time wouldn’t have accepted Jango (or Din) as “Mandalorian,” why lie when the truth, devoid of context, will do? 😁

Full disclosure, I really like the “certain point of view” compromise mainly because it allows room for interpretation. Lucas’ insistence that Jango not being Mandalorian can exist right alongside others’ belief that he was. It doesn’t invalidate any possible contradictions that came before, when they can just as easily be chalked up to perspective. It allows both the narrative and any fans who are particularly fond of one view or the other to have that view be correct. If Favreau and company’s decisions are meant to do this intentionally, I think it’s a brilliant way to do it. If it’s not intentional, it’s a happy accident, and they should take credit for doing it on purpose. 😁

4 minutes ago, Tramp Graphics said:

I’ve been saying that from the beginning, but would anyone believe me? Nooooo. 😝

In point of fact, most of us here said it was certainly possible, but not backed up by the BTS reason the line was included, nor LFL’s official stance at the time.

26 minutes ago, Nytwyng said:

In point of fact, most of us here said it was certainly possible, but not backed up by the BTS reason the line was included, nor LFL’s official stance at the time.

😝

Let's please stop.

4 hours ago, Eoen said:

Aren’t imperial capital ship turbolasers green?

When you're the Imperial Leftovers, you use whatever colour of turbolaser you can get your hands on, I guess?

7 hours ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

One last thing: They buffed Beskar way too much for the show in my opinion. It's far too powerful compared to what we see of the armor in Clone Wars and Rebels, and makes me question how the Mandalorians on Nevarro could have been wiped out by anything less than a carpet bombing campaign, especially when they've got home-turf advantage. Without massive amounts of collateral damage, I have to presume that the Imps pretty much only used blasters. Actually, I suppose most of the Mandos probably didn't have beskar since Mando didn't at first, so I can drop that point to a certain extent, but in Rebels we see (based on The Duchess) that Beskar seemed pretty ubiquitous, and not quite that invulnerable. Hmm... I needz the informationz.

As in the image below you'll see that the large bulk of the armor that the Armorer is breaking down are the helmets and shoulder pauldrons. There are a couple of what appear to be chest pieces in there, but certainly not enough to imply that all the Mandalorians were equipped with them.

That being the case, then it stands to reason that most of the Mandalorians in the Navarro culvert didn't have suits of beskar like Din has. From everything in the series I've been able to spot so far, the only beskar that Mandalorians start with is the helmet, which as we know from Din's "donation" is collected from scraps left over from other builds and from extra gathered beyond the what is needed. Presumably, this is crafted into their first piece and marks the start of their journey in The Way. From what we can see above, between beskar's rarity and the skill and opportunity afforded most Mandalorians completing their armor will take all of their life, and in many cases they will never complete their armor at all, passing it down to their inheritor to continue the task. After all, in all the time that Din was operating, he didn't complete his armor nor even make any appreciable progress in doing so until a freak happenstance involving the Client and Grogu. I would imaging the overwhelming firepower (especially a single E-Web at the end of the culvert to create a killzone) of most likely a legion of Stormtroopers would wear them down. Tracked to the culvert, and trapped inside basically a "kill box" would make explosives, flamethrowers and repeating blasters fell death for them. Look at the Mando aboard the Gozanti in episode 4, his armor was able to resist the repeating blaster than pinned down the others, but it still knocked him down from the repeated concussive force and, had he not had the explosive pucks, would have been a sitting duck for a flametrooper or frag grenade to finish off. The culvert Mandalorians would have been tough to crack, but not impossible to overcome considering the battlefield and the lack of completed beskar.

Whoever said clairvoyance wasn't a real thing?

Anyhew. Just rewatched it (again).

I have a hard time accepting the continued "Boohm!" of this series. It's just not fair.

Tomorrow I have a session to run ... and my group is nothing like this ... however, it is inspirational, particularly with the canonisation of Tython in this way, and where my story seems to be driven by the players' action.

2 hours ago, Jegergryte said:

Also, it would be inconvenient for Mandalore to be the source for both a bounty hunter that tried to assassinate a senator , and being the template for the clone troopers ... considering your point about politicians lying - they are also conniving ... so disowning Jango was just a good political decision at that time.

Both of these things, as well as being a Sith stooge, are probably more than enough that Jango's status as "True Blue For Real Mandalorian" was officially stripped from him posthumously as soon as they found out.

How cool is it for all us out of shape middle aged guys that we can now realistically cosplay Boba Fett?

Will add it to The Dude Thor, in my new repertoire 🤣

Rewatched it, and realized I got confused about Tython. I thought the orange dot ('round about the Inner Rim) was the target, completely missing the blinking red dot that was actually Tython. So they just shifted it's position from the Deep Core to the Outer Rim.

1 hour ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

Rewatched it, and realized I got confused about Tython. I thought the orange dot ('round about the Inner Rim) was the target, completely missing the blinking red dot that was actually Tython. So they just shifted it's position from the Deep Core to the Outer Rim.

Assuming the map is of the entire galaxy.

1 hour ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

Rewatched it, and realized I got confused about Tython. I thought the orange dot ('round about the Inner Rim) was the target, completely missing the blinking red dot that was actually Tython. So they just shifted it's position from the Deep Core to the Outer Rim.

7 minutes ago, Jegergryte said:

Assuming the map is of the entire galaxy.

I agree with @Jegergryte , you’re assuming that the “map” is of the whole galaxy. It is more likely a sector or even system map of local space. Canonically, it’s still listed as being in the deep core at coordinates L-10.