simple title, simple premise. everything is still hypothetical.

I already painted stormtroopers. If I can't use those troopers in this new game I'm not going to get it. I don't want to paint a second set of troopers. FFG should understand that once players invest time into painting a mini they do not want to reinvest in painting another nearly identical miniature. GW did this with many edition changes in their games and that kind of treatment is what lead to the market vacuum you are intending to fill. you have an invested customer base, don't throw it out.

It's unknown how compatible IA and Legion figures will be. so far we know a few things for sure.

The bases of models like the AT-ST, trooper transport, Bantha are not compatible.

This storm trooper upgrade card is not promising. this is the sort of list building option that can easily be included on the core unit card. the existence of this card makes me fear that they are explicitly trying to exclude their previous IA miniatures from this game.

I hope this is not the case. I hope FFG will sell a "conversion Kit" allowing IA models to be used in legion that includes bases that large IA figures can slot into and plenty of extra stormtrooper +1 cards.

I hope this because I am the target market and if FFG can't serve that they are not going to have a good time.

I think if some of us had our way, it wouldn't be compatible with IA at all, because the scale would be drastically too small.

To, y'know, accommodate AT-ST groups and AT-AT single units. Make it clear that it's something new, not a re-tread of one of the lines already in place. :\

that was my hope origonally but given it's clearly a 30+MM miniatures game all I can hope for now is that my storm troopers from AI will work in this

signs do not look good.

First, your IA figs are competely compatible with IA. Why should game pieces from one game be compatible with a different game. It's a bonus if they are. But surely a possible benefit does not equate to a definite drawback, especially considering you will need other Legion components to actually play Legion.

Consider this statememt: "If Battlelore figs are not compatible with Runewars, I will not purchase Runewars."

Second, movement of a squad in Legion is measured only by the squad leader. Other members of the unit move so that they are within a certain distance of the leader after the leader moves. So you should be able to use IA storm troopers as squad members in Legion. I mean, the bases don't look too different so I guess it comes down to your taste rather than anything really about the figures.

Then again, don't expect to use components from one game in another game in any FFG sanctioned organized play or tournaments.

yes they are perfectly in their rights to do as they please.

I am perfectly in my rights to refuse to paint more storm troopers.

they made a choice and I'm making a choice.

as for using some IA troopers to fill out a legion unit. I can't do that because each extra trooper needs an upgrade card and I highly doubt they are going to sell extra trooper upgrade cards if they are going out of their way to change the miniatures scale.

Whens it out then?

Sure, it is each customer's individual perogative as to whether they will spend their money and what their reasons are. But having a reason doesn't make one perforce reasonable. Lack of component compatability between unrelated games is a weird battle to pick.

maybe you have all the time and money in the world and you have no barrier to entry. but I do have limits.

I don't have time for both, I could if they used the same toys but they don't. so I can't play both.

why is that a weird thing?

I really don't get what your problem with the Stormtrooper upgrade card is. From what I understand a squad of Stormtroopers has 4 troopers in it. You can use the card to upgrade the size of that squad to 5. A squad moves as a single unit (not like in IA where each moves separately and they can split up. You move 1 guy and place the others around him). I don't see what that upgrade card has to do with IA.

Also, when everyone thought these figures were going to be smaller than IA figures, there was no issue. Why is it an issue now? Just because they are close in size? That's ridiculous. This is a very different game. It's like complaining that x-wing figures could be not used in armada.

IA is still going just as strong as it was last week. Heart of the Empire is still coming. They have not abandoned you or your investment in that game. This is a completely different game. If the idea of assembling and painting a new set of figures is that off-putting to you, you are probably not the target audience. They are making game closer to warhammer/infinity. It has nothing to do with IA.

I don't have unlimited time or money, but my limits are not due to FFG or their game designs.

Personally I hope to god they are not compatible. IA is too large for something like this. A smaller scale opens the door to great scenery that is readily available. IA does not give you that opportunity.

1 minute ago, Raging Celt said:

Personally I hope to god they are not compatible. IA is too large for something like this. A smaller scale opens the door to great scenery that is readily available. IA does not give you that opportunity.

I may be mistaken but I think IA minis are smaller than Legion ones.

quantumsheep, you are correct

assuming for the sake of argument that IA and Legion both use a consistent scale (some dispute this regarding IA) and using Luke as a guide it seems that Legion is 2-5mm bigger than IA

2 hours ago, TylerTT said:

simple title, simple premise. everything is still hypothetical.

I already painted stormtroopers. If I can't use those troopers in this new game I'm not going to get it. I don't want to paint a second set of troopers. FFG should understand that once players invest time into painting a mini they do not want to reinvest in painting another nearly identical miniature. GW did this with many edition changes in their games and that kind of treatment is what lead to the market vacuum you are intending to fill. you have an invested customer base, don't throw it out.

It's unknown how compatible IA and Legion figures will be. so far we know a few things for sure.

The bases of models like the AT-ST, trooper transport, Bantha are not compatible.

This storm trooper upgrade card is not promising. this is the sort of list building option that can easily be included on the core unit card. the existence of this card makes me fear that they are explicitly trying to exclude their previous IA miniatures from this game.

I hope this is not the case. I hope FFG will sell a "conversion Kit" allowing IA models to be used in legion that includes bases that large IA figures can slot into and plenty of extra stormtrooper +1 cards.

I hope this because I am the target market and if FFG can't serve that they are not going to have a good time.

or you simply are not the target market. Just because you were the target market for IA doesn't not automatically mean you are the target market for Legion. That isn't what that venn diagram looks like. I was not the target market for IA but I definitely am the target market for Legion. Its ok if you like one and not the other. But just because you like one and not the other does not mean no one like the other.

2 hours ago, TylerTT said:

maybe you have all the time and money in the world and you have no barrier to entry. but I do have limits.

I don't have time for both, I could if they used the same toys but they don't. so I can't play both.

why is that a weird thing?

Its not a weird thing it is completely reasonable. But just because you do not due to investment into other games does mean everyone has invested into those other games.

If Legion isn't your thing thats ok. But it may be someone else which is also ok.

2 hours ago, TylerTT said:

yes they are perfectly in their rights to do as they please.

I am perfectly in my rights to refuse to paint more storm troopers.

they made a choice and I'm making a choice.

as for using some IA troopers to fill out a legion unit. I can't do that because each extra trooper needs an upgrade card and I highly doubt they are going to sell extra trooper upgrade cards if they are going out of their way to change the miniatures scale.

Lol all I hear is "wah wah wah, I want this new game that FFG have spend a huge amount of time and money developing but I don't want to spend any money on it."

5 hours ago, Manchu said:

Sure, it is each customer's individual perogative as to whether they will spend their money and what their reasons are. But having a reason doesn't make one perforce reasonable. Lack of component compatability between unrelated games is a weird battle to pick.

its weird that this game wasnt either 15mm or 28mm. no one would be complaining if they had made them smaller to fit more figs on a table.

Nah, if the minis were anything but the same as IA (which is like 32mm, although there are inconsistencies) there would have been complaints from people who think unrealted games like IA and Legion should be compatible.

As for 15mm, Jonathan Ying explained on a Reddit AMA that one of the reasons FFG dropped Battlore 2e was because they were frustrated by the lower level of detail they got in smaller scales. So Legion not being smaller than IA/RW was unsurprising, for those paying close attention to FFG over the past few years.

The compatibility argument with IA makes no sense to me (and I'm not a fan of legion so far).

They are separate products with separate gameplay elements. They aren't meant to share components and there would be no reason to. What good would it do anyways? You'd still need the actual 'hardware' from Legion to play the units officially right? And if you aren't playing officially, then who cares what you use. It's not like you'd save money by using IA stuff in a way that you can't anyways.

its not purchasing the core set or hardware that bothers me.

it is re painting and re purchasing miniatures I already have.

the legion box has some really nice storm troopers in it, I'm fine with owning a few more, but legion likely requires a bunch more troopers to play. likely 2-3 times those in the starter box.

this gets even worse with the named characters,

I already have Han, chewy, Leia, boba, ect. all of those cost an amazing amount of time painting and money.

I want to buy a conversion kit. I bought one for decent 1 to decent 2.

what would be amazing is if they pulled a "big tent" move and made a conversion kit that allowed people to use old West end games and old WOTC minis. you would really have an install base ready to go if you allowed such a thing.

"I already have ..."

Nope. None of us own any figures for Legion.

If Legion was 15mm, would you be angry that you had already painted the IA Han Solo figure?

I already have a painted luke Skywalker miniature that is almost exactly the same size. it's crazy to paint another one thats a few MM off.

if legion was 15 MM I would not touch it with a 10 foot pole. 15MM is hardest to paint scale that exists (I painted a nearly full set of 1st edition battle lore with expansions, NEVER AGAIN will I paint 15 MM). 10MM and smaller is a breeze however! I would be super happy to have a 10MM starwars game, you have no idea.

I can understand that you don't want to paint another Luke Skywalker figure. I just don't see how that matters to anyone but you. If you decide not to spend your money on Legion, for whatever reason, so be it; that is completely and utterly legitimate. But it doesn't amount to an argument that IA should be compatible with an unrelated game, much less that FFG ought to make conversion kits so that out of print miniatures from other companies can also be used with that unrelated game.

This is a forum for people to talk about about stuff. it's fine that we have a difference in opinion. FFG put this here so we can do exactly this.