Like, further:

There was talk of Australians: good players, and usually interesting tournaments... but at no point has their meta looked like ANYONE else's meta. If you want to talk about a region that has a great "Gentlemen's Agreement" going, it's Australia, and it looks pretty great.


But a comment that the US system opens were more boring to watch than the Europe ones... like, everyone has their own tastes, but while we're sharing: all of the last system opens were pretty boring to watch. In aggregate, we got to watch a lot of turrets and hyper defense slam against each other, with weird blips of arcs that shot multiple time or had autothrusters show up on camera (or, just also had hyper defense).

It's still everyone's own tastes, but man, there were not actually that significant differences between the continents, and the one time there was, it wasn't even that big (jumpmasters vs palp aces, almost 3 years ago at this point).

I completely agree with both posts, and I have nothing to add except:

you know how wrong the reactions are after tournaments, pretty much always. Reactions to Coruscant are no different. Maybe you had hoped that it‘s better with 2.0, I know I hope so after every large tournament, but it never happens.

Not to keep throwing gas on this dumpster fire, but it seems to me that no one “didn’t try” as in didn’t play hard, but my national champion didn’t try as in brought a bad list.

My (limited) knowledge seems like the previous points about self selection are the biggest factor, but also a style difference about the “meme” tournament. Chris said that his list isn’t good without Leia, I think? It sounds like the US players went a little more hard at the format, and the European players tended to fit a squad they may have been playing anyway into the format.

Is there a way to check that aside from feels?

1 hour ago, jesper_h said:

Fenn, Teroch, Palob

Hey so first of all congrats on going 6-0 that was pretty fun to watch. Fang Fighters are cool and something I tend to use incorrectly.

Do you think Fenn, Teroch, Palob will see more use/success going forward or will it be replaced by Boba, Teroch, Palob? Starting with Teroch/Palob and adding an ace seems solid to me in general, just like adding anything to whisper/redline. I guess it depends on whether or not the game continues to trend towards 3 ship aces builds or starts to see more swarms hit the table.

Maybe next time one of us says, “This is better than that” without any sort of way to prove it, the rest of us just say “Ok” and move on?

Crossroads! Get hype!

41 minutes ago, Tlfj200 said:

I'm not saying no one tried.

But the analysis that the more limited people pay 3-5x more than "locals" probably tried harder.

Also, to be blunt, I don't really care how hard the miranda and ghost nym players tried. I saw a LOT of people just sit in arcs and eat torpedoes, then the inevitable "OMG, is 2.0 nothing but ordinance!" disccussion play out afterwards.


Of course there are nuggets of info to glean from Coruscant - they just have almost nothing to do with which country players are from (and frankly, almost no tournament results really talk to this aspect, and it's probably the least boring question to even investigate, other than mild curiosity). It borders far closer to "huh... neat" than "wow! How interesting!", and it seems, again, that that is what instead devolved here.

I mean I thought "interesting!" when watching the Coruscant streams - but you are right that it would be silly to draw any overarching conclusions from this. I don't think we really learned anything that we didn't already strongly suspect. Personally I was mostly interested in watching the setup and first few rounds. Meme-y or not, I learn the most from seeing the initial engagements.

No one was actually taking any overarching conclusions from Coruscant, but between that and dismissing it as just a meme format where 2/3 of the players weren't even trying there are many other steps

Just now, Sunitsa said:

No one was actually taking any overarching conclusions from Coruscant, but between that and dismissing it as just a meme format where 2/3 of the players weren't even trying there are many other steps

Pretty sure it's only one or the other. There is no middle ground in Star Wars.

37 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

I completely agree with both posts, and I have nothing to add except:

you know how wrong the reactions are after tournaments, pretty much always. Reactions to Coruscant are no different. Maybe you had hoped that it‘s better with 2.0, I know I hope so after every large tournament, but it never happens.

It seems more visceral, but I think that's because it's tied up in just how new everything is. Never again will x-wing be this new: no new waves will compare to the change of an entire ruleset and change of ships.

And in that, the massive hype and dread of the change that built up over the last few months.


I guess that's it?

5 minutes ago, Scott Pilgrim2 said:

I mean I thought "interesting!" when watching the Coruscant streams - but you are right that it would be silly to draw any overarching conclusions from this. I don't think we really learned anything that we didn't already strongly suspect. Personally I was mostly interested in watching the setup and first few rounds. Meme-y or not, I learn the most from seeing the initial engagements.

Maybe, but I learned more than I thought.

Like, knowing Sloane is good, and seeing sloane on the table was a pretty big difference for me, for instance.

And confirming just how many people find torpedoes inescapable had me questioning why I try so hard.

10 minutes ago, Boom Owl said:

Hey so first of all congrats on going 6-0 that was pretty fun to watch. Fang Fighters are cool and something I tend to use incorrectly.

Do you think Fenn, Teroch, Palob will see more use/success going forward or will it be replaced by Boba, Teroch, Palob? Starting with Teroch/Palob and adding an ace seems solid to me in general, just like adding anything to whisper/redline. I guess it depends on whether or not the game continues to trend towards 3 ship aces builds or starts to see more swarms hit the table.

Teroch/Palob is super solid, but if you want to go anti-meta, then investing into Fenn/Palob might be good idea.

The most solid ships (aka “rock” of this meta) are almost exclusively I5s - Redline, Whisper, Boba, Teroch, Guri, Luke, etc..

Bringing one, or even better two I6s can seriously mess with many lists.

At least that’s how I interprete the winning list from Coruscant - not necessarily the most solid out there, but designed to counter those lists..

11 minutes ago, baranidlo said:

Teroch/Palob is super solid, but if you want to go anti-meta, then investing into Fenn/Palob might be good idea.

The most solid ships (aka “rock” of this meta) are almost exclusively I5s - Redline, Whisper, Boba, Teroch, Guri, Luke, etc..

 Bringing one, or even better two I6s can seriously mess with many lists.

 At least that’s how I interprete the winning list from Coruscant - not necessarily the most solid out there, but designed to counter those lists..

I'll repeat what I said a bunch of pages ago.

Besides re-confirming what we already knew about a few specific ships (not lists) the only takeaway I have from Coruscant is that regardless of power level the vast majority of players will avoid taking 5+ ship lists at all costs.

Which is going to lead to alot of super comfortable 3 ship aces lists running around, even outside of this most important meme tournament.

Presents an opportunity to both i6 with a bid, and the handful of players who do bring something more efficient.

5 minutes ago, Tlfj200 said:

Maybe, but I learned more than I thought.

Like, knowing Sloane is good, and seeing sloane on the table was a pretty big difference for me, for instance.

And confirming just how many people find torpedoes inescapable had me questioning why I try so hard.

I need to watch a Sloane game.

Also I thought that 1.0 would have taught you that people can't escape torpedoes.

6 minutes ago, baranidlo said:

Teroch/Palob is super solid, but if you want to go anti-meta, then investing into Fenn/Palob might be good idea.

The most solid ships (aka “rock” of this meta) are almost exclusively I5s - Redline, Whisper, Boba, Teroch, Guri, Luke, etc..

Bringing one, or even better two I6s can seriously mess with many lists.

At least that’s how I interprete the winning list from Coruscant - not necessarily the most solid out there, but designed to counter those lists..

"I5" is for sure a meta staple. What will be interesting is if there is an actual top "I5" list or if will be a more generic "take (Luke/Boba/Guri/Teroch/Whisper/Redline) and fill out the rest with this bid".

11 hours ago, Dismal Scientist said:

Hahaha, as if she has ever ridden on it. She hates it.

Now I’m furtivey looking for a game of X-Wing on Mackinac island. I don’t think I will have much luck.

I think the Michigan gt is this weekend also? I'm not a geometry expert though so I don't know how close that is for you

12 hours ago, Dismal Scientist said:

Hahaha, as if she has ever ridden on it. She hates it.

Now I’m furtivey looking for a game of X-Wing on Mackinac island. I don’t think I will have much luck.

14 minutes ago, catachanninja said:

I think the Michigan gt is this weekend also? I'm not a geometry expert though so I don't know how close that is for you

Just about 3 hours directly South. Also, not sure if you've been to Mackinac Island before, but with how the weather has dropped this week around just metro Detroit area, I'll going to assume you're going to freeze your balls up there.

At the risk of tautology, I feel like Coauscant told us exactly what it told us:

What is competitive when Boba Fett pilot is not around.

If you see something that looks good from Coruscant, you ask yourself if that is still good if it has to deal with Boba Fett. Redline, for example, was seen quite a bit. He seems pretty good, but I think he makes less of an impact if Boba is there. I expect Boba to have a bigger bid, and Redline therefore has a pretty hard time getting good shots.

8 minutes ago, Biophysical said:

At the risk of tautology, I feel like Coauscant told us exactly what it told us:

What is competitive when Boba Fett pilot is not around.

If you see something that looks good from Coruscant, you ask yourself if that is still good if it has to deal with Boba Fett. Redline, for example, was seen quite a bit. He seems pretty good, but I think he makes less of an impact if Boba is there. I expect Boba to have a bigger bid, and Redline therefore has a pretty hard time getting good shots.

Redline lists can bid pretty hard to.

13 minutes ago, Boom Owl said:

Redline lists can bid pretty hard to.

Not hard enough. Redline lists need his wingmates to handle Boba and not get handled by Boba’s wingmates.

Crossroads might give us a better view of how that plays out.

3 minutes ago, Biophysical said:

If you see something that looks good from Coruscant, you ask yourself if that is still good if it has to deal with Boba Fett. Redline, for example, was seen quite a bit. He seems pretty good, but I think he makes less of an impact if Boba is there. I expect Boba to have a bigger bid, and Redline therefore has a pretty hard time getting good shots.

Not sure I agree. Redline's ability to fairly reliably push 3 hits and a crit thanks to his free TLs into Boba's 2 evades plus bombs has done a number on him in almost all the games I've played with this combo. The one game that didn't happen they went all in on Redline who still managed to block him, nail him with 2 proton bombs, and soak up 3 turns of fire before going down. Not bad considering the fairly steep points differential.

1 hour ago, gennataos said:

Maybe next time one of us says, “This is better than that” without any sort of way to prove it, the rest of us just say “Ok” and move on?

Crossroads! Get hype!

Crossroads is at best the second most prestigious tournament. Almost maximum hype!

31 minutes ago, Biophysical said:

At the risk of tautology, I feel like Coauscant told us exactly what it told us:

What is competitive when Boba Fett pilot is not around.

If you see something that looks good from Coruscant, you ask yourself if that is still good if it has to deal with Boba Fett. Redline, for example, was seen quite a bit. He seems pretty good, but I think he makes less of an impact if Boba is there. I expect Boba to have a bigger bid, and Redline therefore has a pretty hard time getting good shots.

That. Someone mentioned earlier we leaned into the format, they were right. I tried to abuse free Leia - I should have been trying to abuse no Boba.

6 minutes ago, Makaze said:

Not sure I agree. Redline's ability to fairly reliably push 3 hits and a crit thanks to his free TLs into Boba's 2 evades plus bombs has done a number on him in almost all the games I've played with this combo. The one game that didn't happen they went all in on Redline who still managed to block him, nail him with 2 proton bombs, and soak up 3 turns of fire before going down. Not bad considering the fairly steep points differential.

I'm pretty sure if your Boba Fett is eating a torpedo from Redline, even if Redline is moving last, you done messed up some where along the way.

2 minutes ago, miguelj said:

I'm pretty sure if your Boba Fett is eating a torpedo from Redline, even if Redline is moving last, you done messed up some where along the way.

At least on the approach. I'd believe a few turns into an engagement that you can set up a scenario where bobas best positioning involves eating a proton torp.

With that being said, reinforce two agility and rerolls is a good strategy so he'll still probably only take one damage...

Random questions...

How many Tournament Quality practice games do you play per month? ( i.e. Against other Major Tournament Regulars )

How many total games do you target with a list you plan to bring to a tournament?

3 minutes ago, Boom Owl said:

Random questions...

How many Tournament Quality practice games do you play per month? ( i.e. Against other Major Tournament Regulars )

Less than one.

3 minutes ago, Boom Owl said:

How many total games do you target with a list you plan to bring to a tournament?

As many as possible, but preferably at least 3-5.

1 minute ago, Boom Owl said:

Random questions...

How many Tournament Quality practice games do you play per month? ( i.e. Against other Major Tournament Regulars )

How many total games do you target with a list you plan to bring to a tournament?

Maybe 5 a month.

Normal games against any opponents (even good ones) rarely does me as much good as practicing against myself at home. I can stop, restart, rewind a couple of turns. I always plan "my" maneuvers first, then let the squad I'm practicing against operate as if they predicted my maneuvers. Leads into discovering winning game states, major mistakes to avoid, etc.