6 minutes ago, Celestial Lizards said:

No, because just like the one in TFA (and RoTJ), this one is

BIGGER

and obviously better.

And too much for Mr. Incredible?



Also we have a new one, but this one comes in a flying wing shape.



I'm not entirely convinced it isn't an Arquillian Battlecruiser that Snoke got off UsedSuperWeapons.net, and the cliche' gods will all have a collective aneurysm if it isn't destroyed by a single fighter or a Hershey bar wrapper falling into the core in one of the next two movies.

I mean, sorry if I'm being a drag, but I've seen capital ships do jack-dizzle since the space battle in Ep3. As it stands they are pretty much all paper tigers in my mind, subject to blatant and immersion-stressing Conservation of Ninjitsu without regard to in-universe continuity.

Oh no! A fleet of Star Destroyers! They'll definitely hurt the heroes.

The only thing that can pose an existential danger to a Star Wars hero is a Star Wars villain. No soldier, or supersoldier, or ship, or pointless doomsday device is going to add tension to the plot if I've already seen the ineffectual legions flub mission after mission.

Just now, OneKelvin said:

The only thing that can pose an existential danger to a Star Wars hero is a Star Wars villain. No soldier, or supersoldier, or ship, or pointless doomsday device is going to add tension to the plot if I've already seen the ineffectual legions flub mission after mission.

Another thing the Clone Wars got right. You tasted defeat so much, each battle actually felt like a challenge. A Separatist battle fleet approaching? Someone might actually die! Any battle with Ahsoka felt more real, because the viewers know she isn't in Episode III, so she has to be killed off at some point (although I really like the path they took with Ahsoka's story).

15 hours ago, flyboymb said:

Exceedingly light BFII2 spoiler. Do not look directly at the spoiler if there is any chance of a plot being spoiled. If you look at the spoiler, promptly remove the offending memory cell by any means necessary.

Spoiler will begin in 5...

4...

3...

2...

1...

Spoiler will now commence.

There is a character in a certain Star Wars title that should have spoilers about it avoided at all cost who says that they want to visit Lothal someday in the time period around Endor. While that doesn't necessarily negate taking Lothal 'out of galactic affairs', it is talked about like visiting Mt. Rushmore or some other sightseeing venture instead of some kind of adventure. By the sound of things Lothal is a place that your average person in the galaxy wouldn't mind spending a few days on. So I suppose that further takes away from any evidence that it is a burnt out rock after an Imperial reprisal.

Doesn't mean the world has to survive. It just means whatever its final fate is, news of that fate has been slow to spread.

After all, the world we see in season4, heavily polluted and stripmined, is hardly a tourist magnet. But its pre-imperial state certainly would qualify.

In legends, some worlds in the galaxy didn't even know alderaan had been destroyed until years and years later. And that despite imperial propaganda to blame it on the rebellion.

8 hours ago, OneKelvin said:

And too much for Mr. Incredible?



Also we have a new one, but this one comes in a flying wing shape.



I'm not entirely convinced it isn't an Arquillian Battlecruiser that Snoke got off UsedSuperWeapons.net, and the cliche' gods will all have a collective aneurysm if it isn't destroyed by a single fighter or a Hershey bar wrapper falling into the core in one of the next two movies.

I mean, sorry if I'm being a drag, but I've seen capital ships do jack-dizzle since the space battle in Ep3. As it stands they are pretty much all paper tigers in my mind, subject to blatant and immersion-stressing Conservation of Ninjitsu without regard to in-universe continuity.

Oh no! A fleet of Star Destroyers! They'll definitely hurt the heroes.

The only thing that can pose an existential danger to a Star Wars hero is a Star Wars villain. No soldier, or supersoldier, or ship, or pointless doomsday device is going to add tension to the plot if I've already seen the ineffectual legions flub mission after mission.

This is honestly the biggest change I would ever make to Star Wars. When A single dude with force powers is more scary than an armada, it's very silly.

20 hours ago, Azrapse said:

At least the campaigns with the "good ending" are supposed to be canon.
Obviously, multiplayer matches, what if scenarios, mods and random/custom content aren't.

It was funny how they tried so hard in the pre-Disney canon to fit in stuff like SW Galaxies, when they would even shoehorn non-campaign content into the old C-canon level.
"At least one rebel pilot faced Countess Ryad in her TIE Defender near this and that system, and defeated her." (anonymous players randomly encountering named enemies in a MMO).

That's not as bad as what the Wook did with the Rogue Squadron games. Oh, you can fly an A-Wing instead of the default B-Wing and shoot out the bridge of an ISD?

Canon: A-Wings have sufficient weaponry to destroy craft as large as an Imperial Class Star Destroyer!

Oh, you picked up a secret missile upgrade while Lando was flying into the Death Star core?

Canon: At some point while flying into the core, Lando Calrissian picked up a missile upgrade and integrated it into the Millennium Falcon for later use because hey he had the time to stop and pick up some technology, figure out whether it was compatible with a ship he hasn't flown in years, suit up for a spacewalk, take off whatever hull plating covers the Falcon's missile launchers, offload the old systems, install the new, reattach the hull plating, re-enter the Falcon, and take off. Those TIE Interceptor pilots were chill enough to hover there until he was done. It happened in a vidyagame that's C-Canon you can't argue with that I HAVE MOAR EDITS THAN U!

There was a lot of plot stuff in the games that I loved integrating with the lore. Kyle Katarn and Jan, the adventures of Keyan Farlander and Merrick Steele, Yoda Stories (wait no that sucked). But the Wook has some serious OCD when a spinning icon was meant to signify an in-universe event. They don't even apply it 100%. I mean they mention the Habogad from Super Star Wars: The Empire Strikes Back, but they make absolutely NO mention of the time Luke Skywalker had to use his lightsaber the gouge out all of its eyes. Or how Luke gunned down a bunch of Jawas and Womp Rats on his speeder on the way to blow up the sandcrawler holding R2-D2 and C3-PO captive (HE WAS THE GUY BEHIND THE MASSACRE THE WHOLE TIME!).

I do like reading up on lore there, but there's really a lot of facepalmworthy material on there ( *COUGH*ARTICLEONBREASTS*COUGH ). I'm actually pretty relieved that the Mouse wiped the slate clean just to get all that nonsense out of any realm of the canon.

Quote

Sir Orrin: This is honestly the biggest change I would ever make to Star Wars. When A single dude with force powers is more sary than an armada, it's very silly (sorry for the ghettoquote, I'm not sure how to insert new quotes into posts in edit mode).

34 minutes ago, flyboymb said:

That's not as bad as what the Wook did with the Rogue Squadron games. Oh, you can fly an A-Wing instead of the default B-Wing and shoot out the bridge of an ISD?

Canon: A-Wings have sufficient weaponry to destroy craft as large as an Imperial Class Star Destroyer!

Oh, you picked up a secret missile upgrade while Lando was flying into the Death Star core?

Canon: At some point while flying into the core, Lando Calrissian picked up a missile upgrade and integrated it into the Millennium Falcon for later use because hey he had the time to stop and pick up some technology, figure out whether it was compatible with a ship he hasn't flown in years, suit up for a spacewalk, take off whatever hull plating covers the Falcon's missile launchers, offload the old systems, install the new, reattach the hull plating, re-enter the Falcon, and take off. Those TIE Interceptor pilots were chill enough to hover there until he was done. It happened in a vidyagame that's C-Canon you can't argue with that I HAVE MOAR EDITS THAN U!

There was a lot of plot stuff in the games that I loved integrating with the lore. Kyle Katarn and Jan, the adventures of Keyan Farlander and Merrick Steele, Yoda Stories (wait no that sucked). But the Wook has some serious OCD when a spinning icon was meant to signify an in-universe event. They don't even apply it 100%. I mean they mention the Habogad from Super Star Wars: The Empire Strikes Back, but they make absolutely NO mention of the time Luke Skywalker had to use his lightsaber the gouge out all of its eyes. Or how Luke gunned down a bunch of Jawas and Womp Rats on his speeder on the way to blow up the sandcrawler holding R2-D2 and C3-PO captive (HE WAS THE GUY BEHIND THE MASSACRE THE WHOLE TIME!).

I do like reading up on lore there, but there's really a lot of facepalmworthy material on there ( *COUGH*ARTICLEONBREASTS*COUGH ). I'm actually pretty relieved that the Mouse wiped the slate clean just to get all that nonsense out of any realm of the canon.

Okay, it's official. You're my favorite poster.

Because you also, just, do not stand for the utter BS that the EU pushed / that Wook tried to claim was canon. Thank you for being completely sensible about the canon.

I'll be honest, the only reason I even started down that road was the nerdrages that was the old Star Trek vs. Star Wars debate. I'd be sitting there in the forums with my bag of popcorn randomly prodding the bulls if they were starting to act civilized. It was about that time that Curtis Saxton started putting out his BS figures and you had folks on various websites trying to do frame by frame analysis of the old movies to argue whether the Star Destroyers were vaporizing asteroids or merely shattering them and how many joules it would take to do both and whether the bridge tower of the Star Destroyer was destroyed or whether it shrugged off the impact because if you look real close at frame 393912341.34 you can tell that the bridge tower outline is no longer there but the commander isn't instantly killed so how can the bridge tower be gone...

It was like George Lucas was a savant who had managed to animate a movie in a way that perfectly showed the physics of the universe in a way that Steven Hawking could only do in his most fevered dreams. The OCD level got to the point where somebody decided that Star Destroyers meant that the ISD was merely a destroyer in the Imperial line of battle even though it was their main ship of the line and the name was just a cool way of saying 'these things are powerful'. It just seemed like the deeper into minutiae these guys got the more they lost sight of the big picture.

Of course you couldn't stay in close proximity to that particular black hole without getting drawn in and now I spend way too much time in debates about make believe people and spaceships. I don't participate in Wook editing at all but I'll be darned if some of the islands of stupidity don't draw me into the talk sections like Commissar ***law (lol really?) into a cultist convention.

24 minutes ago, flyboymb said:

I'll be honest, the only reason I even started down that road was the nerdrages that was the old Star Trek vs. Star Wars debate. I'd be sitting there in the forums with my bag of popcorn randomly prodding the bulls if they were starting to act civilized. It was about that time that Curtis Saxton started putting out his BS figures and you had folks on various websites trying to do frame by frame analysis of the old movies to argue whether the Star Destroyers were vaporizing asteroids or merely shattering them and how many joules it would take to do both and whether the bridge tower of the Star Destroyer was destroyed or whether it shrugged off the impact because if you look real close at frame 393912341.34 you can tell that the bridge tower outline is no longer there but the commander isn't instantly killed so how can the bridge tower be gone...

It was like George Lucas was a savant who had managed to animate a movie in a way that perfectly showed the physics of the universe in a way that Steven Hawking could only do in his most fevered dreams. The OCD level got to the point where somebody decided that Star Destroyers meant that the ISD was merely a destroyer in the Imperial line of battle even though it was their main ship of the line and the name was just a cool way of saying 'these things are powerful'. It just seemed like the deeper into minutiae these guys got the more they lost sight of the big picture.

Of course you couldn't stay in close proximity to that particular black hole without getting drawn in and now I spend way too much time in debates about make believe people and spaceships. I don't participate in Wook editing at all but I'll be darned if some of the islands of stupidity don't draw me into the talk sections like Commissar ***law (lol really?) into a cultist convention.

LOL! When I was painting my X-Wings I did a frame-by-frame analysis of the battle of Yavin only to find out the paint schemes for each ship change from scene to scene. Naturally in later movies the paint was standardized (all A-wings and B-Wings looked the same etc etc). That was when I decided no movie universe should get that level of microscopic study.

Star Wars > Star Trek

IV,V > R1, VI> wrath of Kahn, first contact, parts of next generation > TFA, the clone wars> the star Trek reboot movies >Rebels > III > most other Star Trek media > II > I > the unspeakable Star Wars media

there we go. It’s all settled lol

Heresy, you forgot to include TOS. Nobody could stand before the power of giant cornucopias, space hippies, and brain stealing bimbos.

And where would you stick Discovery?

6 hours ago, flyboymb said:

Heresy, you forgot to include TOS. Nobody could stand before the power of giant cornucopias, space hippies, and brain stealing bimbos.

And where would you stick Discovery?

All lumped in with “other Star Trek media”. My list is based almost entirely on rewatch-ability and TOS and Discovery does not do it for me. The Borg were probably my favorite part of the Star Trek universe because they were some solid villains but Voyager kind of neutered them. So thy all get lumped in above episode 2 lol

Maybe I should put Galaxy Quest on my list lol

7 hours ago, Mackaywarrior said:

Star Wars > Star Trek

Oh don't go there

NEEEEEERRRRRDDDSSS!

On 11/27/2017 at 7:04 AM, That Blasted Samophlange said:

Actually, I think in the new canon, many of the mon cala ships were constructed as “buildings” and then launched in a mass exodus.

That is the current canon. The Mon cals, to escape the imperial occupation of their world, adapted their equivalents of skyscrapers and apartments into spaceships, building extras even, and then loading up their people and flying off in one big exodus.

I suspect this idea was around in latent for for some time.. Since we see in the Mon cala episodes of clonewars that their 'cities' are basically clusters of free floating buildings looking suspiciously like home one.

On 11/27/2017 at 7:06 AM, Gadgetron said:

I had heard something to that effect, but I wasn't sure if it was current canon or very late old canon.

It is current canon. General Raddis's flagship was the city hall of one of the communities. (Guess you can fight city hall, if you have a star destroyer)

As gonzo as the idea is.. It does open up some interesting dynamics. It makes the Mon Cals world less refugees, making their involvement in the rebellion that much more poignant, and it means that those warships seen at endor? Were all someone's homes. Ones that they armed and fly into harms way in pursuit of freedom.

It also suggests that there are major city-fleets with dozens, if not hundreds of ships, tooling around in the void, packed with civilians ala BSG, trying to avoid imperial patrols.

2 hours ago, mithril2098 said:

It also suggests that there are major city-fleets with dozens, if not hundreds of ships, tooling around in the void, packed with civilians ala BSG, trying to avoid imperial patrols.

So many interesting stories yet to tell in the SW universe. It makes me remember we are still in early days of the new EU.

2 hours ago, mithril2098 said:

That is the current canon. The Mon cals, to escape the imperial occupation of their world, adapted their equivalents of skyscrapers and apartments into spaceships, building extras even, and then loading up their people and flying off in one big exodus.

I suspect this idea was around in latent for for some time.. Since we see in the Mon cala episodes of clonewars that their 'cities' are basically clusters of free floating buildings looking suspiciously like home one.

It is current canon. General Raddis's flagship was the city hall of one of the communities. (Guess you can fight city hall, if you have a star destroyer)

As gonzo as the idea is.. It does open up some interesting dynamics. It makes the Mon Cals world less refugees, making their involvement in the rebellion that much more poignant, and it means that those warships seen at endor? Were all someone's homes. Ones that they armed and fly into harms way in pursuit of freedom.

It also suggests that there are major city-fleets with dozens, if not hundreds of ships, tooling around in the void, packed with civilians ala BSG, trying to avoid imperial patrols.

There is also the issue of the Quarren.. the second class citizens of Mon Cala. Long have they chafed under the mon cal monarchy. With many leaving the world, did the quarren take over? When the new republic formed did these mon cals attempt to return home, only to be told they were no longer welcome, by the quarren? This is an interesting story.

5 hours ago, mithril2098 said:

That is the current canon. The Mon cals, to escape the imperial occupation of their world, adapted their equivalents of skyscrapers and apartments into spaceships, building extras even, and then loading up their people and flying off in one big exodus.

I suspect this idea was around in latent for for some time.. Since we see in the Mon cala episodes of clonewars that their 'cities' are basically clusters of free floating buildings looking suspiciously like home one.

It is current canon. General Raddis's flagship was the city hall of one of the communities. (Guess you can fight city hall, if you have a star destroyer)

As gonzo as the idea is.. It does open up some interesting dynamics. It makes the Mon Cals world less refugees, making their involvement in the rebellion that much more poignant, and it means that those warships seen at endor? Were all someone's homes. Ones that they armed and fly into harms way in pursuit of freedom.

It also suggests that there are major city-fleets with dozens, if not hundreds of ships, tooling around in the void, packed with civilians ala BSG, trying to avoid imperial patrols.

And that, my friend, is why I love that new story for the Mon Calamari. It's just really, really interesting.

15 hours ago, flyboymb said:

I'll be honest, the only reason I even started down that road was the nerdrages that was the old Star Trek vs. Star Wars debate. I'd be sitting there in the forums with my bag of popcorn randomly prodding the bulls if they were starting to act civilized. It was about that time that Curtis Saxton started putting out his BS figures and you had folks on various websites trying to do frame by frame analysis of the old movies to argue whether the Star Destroyers were vaporizing asteroids or merely shattering them and how many joules it would take to do both and whether the bridge tower of the Star Destroyer was destroyed or whether it shrugged off the impact because if you look real close at frame 393912341.34 you can tell that the bridge tower outline is no longer there but the commander isn't instantly killed so how can the bridge tower be gone...

It was like George Lucas was a savant who had managed to animate a movie in a way that perfectly showed the physics of the universe in a way that Steven Hawking could only do in his most fevered dreams. The OCD level got to the point where somebody decided that Star Destroyers meant that the ISD was merely a destroyer in the Imperial line of battle even though it was their main ship of the line and the name was just a cool way of saying 'these things are powerful'. It just seemed like the deeper into minutiae these guys got the more they lost sight of the big picture.

Of course you couldn't stay in close proximity to that particular black hole without getting drawn in and now I spend way too much time in debates about make believe people and spaceships. I don't participate in Wook editing at all but I'll be darned if some of the islands of stupidity don't draw me into the talk sections like Commissar ***law (lol really?) into a cultist convention.

Good old times on spacebattles.com and stardestroyer.net
Though to be fair, all those applied mathematics was kind of fun.

2 hours ago, SEApocalypse said:

Good old times on spacebattles.com and stardestroyer.net
Though to be fair, all those applied mathematics was kind of fun.

The whole premise involved picking apart specific frames of specific movies to prove a pre-existing theory, though. Which is silly.

I mean, we saw asteroids in ESB hitting each other and exploding , which to my mind makes a good argument that they aren't even solid rock so much as gunpowder and flint shells filled with hydrogen. Now how does that impact the calculations of damage output of weapons used against them?

I jut stumbled upon this awesome fanart. Would be interesting if Thrawn survived for us to get to this point although I doubt Thrawn would join the First Order.

3 minutes ago, Forresto said:

I jut stumbled upon this awesome fanart. Would be interesting if Thrawn survived for us to get to this point although I doubt Thrawn would join the First Order.

Wow that art is awesome! If thrawn survives the galactic civil war, I feel like once the Empire is gone he will return to the Chiss. Would be cool to see Thrawn re-appear in the new-trilogy era as the new Leader of the Chiss Empire.

8 hours ago, SEApocalypse said:

Good old times on spacebattles.com and stardestroyer.net
Though to be fair, all those applied mathematics was kind of fun.

5 hours ago, xanderf said:

The whole premise involved picking apart specific frames of specific movies to prove a pre-existing theory, though. Which is silly.

I mean, we saw asteroids in ESB hitting each other and exploding , which to my mind makes a good argument that they aren't even solid rock so much as gunpowder and flint shells filled with hydrogen. Now how does that impact the calculations of damage output of weapons used against them?

While the journey (and fighting) was fun, I have to agree with xanderf. One side was arguing that being able to show something mathematically was tantamount of proof even if it flew right in the face of what happened on screen. This is what eventually culminated in the Curtis Saxton numbers for Star Wars ships.

If you extrapolate the damage that can be absorbed by Star Destroyer shields to how powerful capital ship weapons have to be to overcome them and how strong the hull has to be to absorb damage after those shields have failed while realizing that starfighters can damage the hull of even the Death Star with their primary weapons, all those numbers require that X-Wing laser bolts be either burning their way 100 feet into the ground of a planet or making small nuclear explosions while proton torpedoes should be doing something akin to the explosion the Death Star made of Jedha.

As xanderf said, they were looking for a specific outcome and tailoring the evidence to meet that argument. For example, stormtrooper armor may or may not be impervious to .50 cal machinegun fire (but not Ewok arrows). One could make the argument then that stormtroopers would be able to tank a whole line of machinegun fire as they moved forward (and some have made this claim). But this conveniently leaves out the fact that this isn't one solid piece of the armor, but individual segments held on by the trooper's body. The missed conclusion therefore is that the .50 cal round might not damage the armor, but that armor is going to be arching towards the ground still attached to whatever part of the trooper's body even if that body part is no longer attached to the trooper!

This is why, in science, making an observation is so important. You must first see what is actually happening and then try to use science to explain that happening. Most importantly, going off of the observation at least sets up a baseline to help avoid bias before the controls of the scientific method come into play.

On 11/29/2017 at 10:10 AM, Forresto said:

Oh don't go there

NEEEEEERRRRRDDDSSS!

The best part about this.... the storm troopers still missed their shots.

8 minutes ago, BlueSquadronPilot said:

The best part about this.... the storm troopers still missed their shots.

The Redshirts died anyway.

4 minutes ago, Drasnighta said:

The Redshirts died anyway.

Throw in a wilhelm scream and an attempt at a Kirk double handed axe chop and you've got a beautiful fight.

It devolves into a fist fight with Kirk and Bossk, who is there for some reason.

6 hours ago, BlueSquadronPilot said:

The best part about this.... the storm troopers still missed their shots.

But the red shirts still die. So in a ship battle, Star Trek wins, but if the empire can board the Stormtroopers will win.