STAR WARS: REBELS Discussion Thread!

By KCDodger, in X-Wing

They might have wedding, it's not impossible. There just can't be any Jedi capable of defeating Vader by the time of ANH. If Ezra hangs up the sword and cape, it might be enough. Kanan is blind, and I think that might disqualify him from being the "Hope". It might go poorly for their kids though... Ren still has a few Jedi to kill of his own.

Just to clear it up, everyone has the access to force to some degree right? They said no life without midichlorians, they're like mitochondria; even a house plant could sense the force a little right?

Sooo, it was my understanding that every living thing had access to the force at a cellular level. You might have more or less aptitude depending on your genetic pre-disposition for midichlorian density (my father had it, etc, etc), but if you're alive you still have it; even if you have to work harder than other naturals to access it.

That sound right? Sound silly?

A- The only people who can defeat Vader are Luke and Leia. Period. The most powerful Jedi in the galaxy were no match for Sidious and Vader at the close of the Republic and there are no more Jedi who are a match for Sidious or Vader, period. Luke and Leia can only win because of their familial connection.

B- My assumption - prior to The Phantom Menace - was that anyone could become a Jedi (or Force Adept) through the proper training. And I'm hoping that nu-canon allows for that possibility (although with the blind monk in Rogue One , I wouldn't bet too much on that, although he does pretty well for a blind guy from what we've seen so far).

Nah - the only thing really mentioned in 'Lost Stars' that I recall having an X-Wing connection (beyond the obvious fighters) was the Gozanti being used to pick up Vader. First reference to it outside of 'Rebels' and our game, which is always nice to see.

The Raider still remains unmentioned and unseen outside of FFG materials...

Gozantis appear all over the place before Rebels, the Imperial Refit is new though. Shame as I wanted to see the Black Sun version appear in X-Wing.

6bd98e7eadf4f21d026b65e5e6b37a89.jpg

Technically, Vizago's "Broken Horn"...

image_b15d04ff.jpeg

...and Azmorigan's "Merchant One"...

image_070e5a4a.jpeg

...are also both 'modified Gozanti freighters'.

It's...let's just say...a "very versatile design". FWIW, I expect it's more likely we get it in the game looking like one of these two versions, with title cards for both the 'Broken Horn' and 'Merchant One'. Amusingly, this particular customization for it isn't actually that different looking from Jabba's Star Jewel...

Star_jewel.jpg

...given no canonical appearances of that ship to date, I wouldn't be super surprised to see it retconned into a Gozanti, too...

So I think the crashed Y-Wing not looking like a standard clone wars era model is pretty easily explained. I'm not talking budgetary reasons, although that is most likely the real world reason.

As set up in the premiere episode the Y-Wings from the Original Trilogy are all, or at least the initial bomber wings, stripped down Clone Wars era models. Simply put if Cham Syndulla is running a rebellion against a stronger opponent then clearly they need all the resources they can get. I'm sure they stripped the outer armor off the y-Wing to use the metals for far better uses then a lawn ornament.

As for the Gozanti, kit bashing has been fervently used by the Rebels team. The Interdictor itself uses many different components from the various Rebels Imperial vessels.

Edited by Forresto

Hera's over emphasis on the Ghost crew and Ryloth rebels, especially between Kanan and her father has has me thinking somebody's dying because of Thrawn by the season finale. I feel like regardless of what happens to Thrawn its going to bad for the rebels in a permanent way.

Towards the end of every season so far the show has evolved the rebels into a different stage of rebellion. What will this season do?

I think they are telegraphing Thrawn's (temporary) fate pretty clearly, though.

I mean, look at ANY historical dictatorship - they are plagued by petty squabbling over position, internally, with any one person having two people constantly informing on them.

Yes, Thrawn is working towards "the bigger picture", so we - the audience - know he's actually "correct" in how he is attacking the Rebellion and would (could, anyway) ultimately triumph. But this episode is now the second time he's let Rebels get away - ticking off some lower Admiral or Commander - who you had better believe is reporting this up their chain of command.

Consider Maul heading off to Tatooine to confront Obi-Wan, too, and possibly kill Luke...something Ezra might have a hint of. That's going to be the second long-arc to the season.

Obvious conclusion? Thrawn's masterful trap about to manifest itself - not just the Lothal cell, but Dodonna's cell exposed as well...Maul's final destination at hand and the chance to entirely crush the Jedi and Rebellion for good , but the constant reports of Thrawn's "letting Rebels get away" finally chips away at the Emperor and he intervenes to stop everything Thrawn is doing - either jailing him or (IMHO more likely) exiling him to the farthest reaches of the Outer Rim, just before his trap can close - at its most crucial moment.

Net-net: good guys get away, Thrawn is ultimately defeated by those he considered allies (THAT's never happened before...) and the Rebellion grows!

^this^ :)

So I think the crashed Y-Wing not looking like a standard clone wars era model is pretty easily explained. I'm not talking budgetary reasons, although that is most likely the real world reason.

As set up in the premiere episode the Y-Wings from the Original Trilogy are all, or at least the initial bomber wings, stripped down Clone Wars era models.

Given that the Rebels ships look like they have more armor than the ANH ships

http://www.starwars.com/tv-shows/episodes/steps-into-shadow-behind-the-scenes-gallery

I would suggest that the "stripping down" took place after the Rebels got them (probably converting them from two-seaters to single seaters, removing the rotation function of the turret, and the cylindrical turret casing, etc).

And that, between the start and the end of TCW, a "light bomber" variant of Y-wing came out, as a successor to the BTL-B Bomber variant - and it's that which we see in the premiere and on Ryloth.

Edited by Ironlord

ANH and TCW model comparision:

hpN6urc.png

The engines are clearly different, if they were the same just stripped down it'd suggest TCW model has a hollow tube behind the engine twice as long as the engine itself. And it is not true, as we can see here:

BTL-B_Y-wing_rear.jpg

No hollow tube, the exhaust is visible at the very end of the engine nacelle.

EDIT

iWvLZ6t.jpg

Those Y-wings have unmanned turrets, unlike the TCW model, so definitelly it's not just the TCW model stripped down, something has been done to increase the combat value.

Edited by eMeM

iWvLZ6t.jpg

Those Y-wings have unmanned turrets, unlike the TCW model, so definitelly it's not just the TCW model stripped down, something has been done to increase the combat value.

Indeed.

The question is - are the Rebels Y-Wings close enough in proportions to the ANH ones, to justify the implication in the Trivia Gallery that some of the Y-Wings in ANH, are those?

http://www.starwars.com/episodes/steps-into-shadow-trivia-gallery

We know from the Behind The Scenes gallery that the Rebels ships are two-seaters - I'm guessing the gunner remote-controls the turret:

http://www.starwars.com/tv-shows/episodes/steps-into-shadow-behind-the-scenes-gallery

Edited by Ironlord

Rey never has an actual adversity in the movie. When they need a pilot, she's an expert, when they need a mechanic, she's an expert, when she's captured, she's suddenly a master of the force, and when she's chased down, she suddenly can defeat someone who's trained all his life with a lightsaber, and this is the first time she's used one in a fight.

I don't really see this being any different to Luke in ANH. He is farmboy who has never been off-planet and whose piloting experience comes from messing about in an air-speeder.

Yet when he gets onto the Deathstar, we find he is a better shot than crack Imperial infantry who have trained for years. When they need to shoot down incoming Tie fighters, he blows them away despite having never shot anything more tehcnologically advanced than a Wamp Rat. When it comes to the trench run, he succeeds where pilots with decades of experience miss and/or die. Why? Because of the Force.

It is not until ESB that we start to see Luke's flaws (and his adversity) more clearly as his anger and impatience goad him into facing Vader before he is ready (and very nearly paying the ultimate price for it). Also, despite fighting Vader and ultimately besting him in ROTJ, we never see Luke receiving any training in duelling from either Obi-wan or Yoda. At least we are shown in TFA that Rey is pretty good in hand-to-hand combat, even if she has never used a Lightsaber before.

iWvLZ6t.jpg

Those Y-wings have unmanned turrets, unlike the TCW model, so definitelly it's not just the TCW model stripped down, something has been done to increase the combat value.

Indeed.

The question is - are the Rebels Y-Wings close enough in proportions to the ANH ones, to justify the implication in the Trivia Gallery that some of the Y-Wings in ANH, are those?

http://www.starwars.com/episodes/steps-into-shadow-trivia-gallery

We know from the Behind The Scenes gallery that the Rebels ships are two-seaters - I'm guessing the gunner remote-controls the turret:

http://www.starwars.com/tv-shows/episodes/steps-into-shadow-behind-the-scenes-gallery

Just by eyeballing I'd say yes. Strip down some more armour, cut out the rear part of the cockpit (behind the turret "barbette"), reducing the crew to one, sink the turret to the cockpit roof level and shrink the barbette, and you should get (more or less) the ANH Y-wing.

Edited by eMeM

Those giant toad creatures were way too fast. Otherwise solid episode.

Those giant toad creatures were way too fast.

Weren't the Blurrgs just as fast in TCW - with Cham's troops being able to keep up with Mace's speedy mini-walkers?

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Blurrg

The only place they've ever been slow was in Ewoks: Battle for Endor, when they tended to be used more for convoy-escort than as light cavalry.

Edited by Ironlord

Rey never has an actual adversity in the movie. When they need a pilot, she's an expert, when they need a mechanic, she's an expert, when she's captured, she's suddenly a master of the force, and when she's chased down, she suddenly can defeat someone who's trained all his life with a lightsaber, and this is the first time she's used one in a fight.

I don't really see this being any different to Luke in ANH. He is farmboy who has never been off-planet and whose piloting experience comes from messing about in an air-speeder.

Yet when he gets onto the Deathstar, we find he is a better shot than crack Imperial infantry who have trained for years. When they need to shoot down incoming Tie fighters, he blows them away despite having never shot anything more tehcnologically advanced than a Wamp Rat. When it comes to the trench run, he succeeds where pilots with decades of experience miss and/or die. Why? Because of the Force.

Sure Luke is pretty decent at everyting he does in ANH, but all he does is piloting, shooting, and manning a turret. Rey on the other hand is not only an amazing pilot and sharpshooter, but also a meele expert, a linguist, a well trained force user, a skilled engineer, and a ninja acrobat.
But I think people would swallow the ridiculous explanations (earning a degree in engineering by collecting scrap, the concept of spare time while being an altruist slave struggling to survive in a wasteland, Y-wing simulator teaching you how to be an ace YT pilot etc.) much more easily if Rey wasn't completely self sufficient. Luke wasn't, he would be dead multiple times if his friends didn't help him, but Rey doesn't need no man, woman, or droid, she can do everything, get out of every trouble by herself.
Edited by eMeM
I have a simple theory as to why Thrawn let the Ghost crew get away, twice. The Ghost crew is amongst the most visible elements of the Rebel Alliance: a Lassat (endangered species), a mandalorian which leaves graffiti everywhere, 2 Jedi (or trainee) wielding lightsabers, etc. They are also, in many cases, acting as the tip of the spear for the rest of the Alliance.


Thrawn is not interested in destroying the tip of the spear; he would rather be able to predict where the tip is intending to strike so he can destroy the spear itself.


That’s my 2 cents.

Rey never has an actual adversity in the movie. When they need a pilot, she's an expert, when they need a mechanic, she's an expert, when she's captured, she's suddenly a master of the force, and when she's chased down, she suddenly can defeat someone who's trained all his life with a lightsaber, and this is the first time she's used one in a fight.

I don't really see this being any different to Luke in ANH. He is farmboy who has never been off-planet and whose piloting experience comes from messing about in an air-speeder.

Yet when he gets onto the Deathstar, we find he is a better shot than crack Imperial infantry who have trained for years. When they need to shoot down incoming Tie fighters, he blows them away despite having never shot anything more tehcnologically advanced than a Wamp Rat. When it comes to the trench run, he succeeds where pilots with decades of experience miss and/or die. Why? Because of the Force.

It is not until ESB that we start to see Luke's flaws (and his adversity) more clearly as his anger and impatience goad him into facing Vader before he is ready (and very nearly paying the ultimate price for it). Also, despite fighting Vader and ultimately besting him in ROTJ, we never see Luke receiving any training in duelling from either Obi-wan or Yoda. At least we are shown in TFA that Rey is pretty good in hand-to-hand combat, even if she has never used a Lightsaber before.

To a certain extant I agree with you that Luke's character is definitely not that fleshed out until ESB, but he isn't super amazing at everything. Sure in Episode 4, he's pretty good at what he does, but lets face it, without his friends, he'd be dead several times over. And he's by no means a master. Without Obi-Wan, he'd be dead, without Han, he'd be dead, without Leia, he'd be dead, without Han again, he'd be dead, without Wedge and Biggs, he'd be dead, and without Han again he'd be dead. That's the difference between him in Rey. There are no moments in TFA where you can say, "Without the help of *insert character*, she'd be a goner". Lets not forget that in ESB, Luke fails at everything he does too. Again conflict makes an interesting character. Luke actually has conflict, Rey can do everything.

There are no moments in TFA where you can say, "Without the help of *insert character*, she'd be a goner".

Starkiller Base on the brink of exploding when Chewie rescues her in the Falcon.

Without Chewie, only Hux (sent to rescue Kylo) was in a position to save her - and there were no ships around for her to save herself with.

There are no moments in TFA where you can say, "Without the help of *insert character*, she'd be a goner".

Starkiller Base on the brink of exploding when Chewie rescues her in the Falcon.

Without Chewie, only Hux (sent to rescue Kylo) was in a position to save her - and there were no ships around for her to save herself with.

She had already escaped custody, and there are clearly ships on the planet. She could've found a hanger and stolen a ship easily. And considering it wouldn't have blown up if Chewie and Han weren't there in the first place.....

So the new Rebels episode alright. Wasn't anything amazing about it, but it wasn't bad. We got some back story on Chopper of all characters :lol:

There are no moments in TFA where you can say, "Without the help of *insert character*, she'd be a goner".

Starkiller Base on the brink of exploding when Chewie rescues her in the Falcon.

Without Chewie, only Hux (sent to rescue Kylo) was in a position to save her - and there were no ships around for her to save herself with.

Without Finn, she would have been dead when Kylo threw her into a tree. Finn could have chickened out at that point but he stood his ground in front of her, even knowing he probably didn't stand a chance.

Edited by Karhedron

There are no moments in TFA where you can say, "Without the help of *insert character*, she'd be a goner".

Starkiller Base on the brink of exploding when Chewie rescues her in the Falcon.

Without Chewie, only Hux (sent to rescue Kylo) was in a position to save her - and there were no ships around for her to save herself with.

Without Finn, she would have been dead when Kylo threw her into a tree. Finn could chickened out at that point but he put himself between the two of them, even knowing he probably didn't stand a chance.

If Finn hadn't been there, she wouldn't have ever had that conflict because she would've continued sneaking around the installation until she found a hanger.

I don't concern myself with the appearance of the ships to be honest.

Y-Wings are my favourite Rebel ship but as far as I'm concerned, they stole some and they've got some in time for ANH. Job done.

I don't concern myself with the appearance of the ships to be honest.

Y-Wings are my favourite Rebel ship but as far as I'm concerned, they stole some and they've got some in time for ANH. Job done.

I think they're definitely not the same ones we see in the series. They're probably A4s, which the Republic probably used, we just never see them on screen in TCW.

I think the show's writers have some kind of agenda against turrets. Capital ships hardly ever shoot, and smaller ships never use them.

Hell, when Wedge and Sabine were in that simulation last episode, the instructor even pointed out that the Y-Wings they were attacking had turrets. Not ONCE in that scene did any of those turrets fire.

I blame this game. The writers probably hate PWTs so much it bleeds over into the show.

Edited by DarthEnderX

The Clone wars era Y-wings seen in the TCW series were different. They are listed as being an earlier design plus fairing.

It is mentioned that the BTL-A4 series DID have fairing but that was typically stripped.

Different, but similar looking (with or without fairing).

I think they're definitely not the same ones we see in the series. They're probably A4s, which the Republic probably used, we just never see them on screen in TCW.

The Clone wars era Y-wings seen in the TCW series were different. They are listed as being an earlier design plus fairing.

It is mentioned that the BTL-A4 series DID have fairing but that was typically stripped.

The biggest difference between these and A4s is that these are still two-seaters. I hypothesise that in the newcanon, the "single seater" we see in ANH is not a production model, but a field modification of the Rebels two-seater model.

If Finn hadn't been there, she wouldn't have ever had that conflict because she would've continued sneaking around the installation until she found a hanger.

But using the actual timeline rather than an alternate, "Finn & Han never came" timeline - the situation is such that, once the battle with Kylo was over, there would have been no time to escape alone - they're in the woods a long walk from any hangars.

Edited by Ironlord

The S3 and B4 are just different permutations made by Koensayr.

I've no problem with a fixed position gun vs gunner, you see that in real life military combat aircraft.

I think they're definitely not the same ones we see in the series. They're probably A4s, which the Republic probably used, we just never see them on screen in TCW.

The Clone wars era Y-wings seen in the TCW series were different. They are listed as being an earlier design plus fairing.

It is mentioned that the BTL-A4 series DID have fairing but that was typically stripped.

The biggest difference between these and A4s is that these are still two-seaters. I hypothesise that in the newcanon, the "single seater" we see in ANH is not a production model, but a field modification of the Rebels two-seater model.

If Finn hadn't been there, she wouldn't have ever had that conflict because she would've continued sneaking around the installation until she found a hanger.

But using the actual timeline rather than an alternate, "Finn & Han never came" timeline - the situation is such that, once the battle with Kylo was over, there would have been no time to escape alone - they're in the woods a long walk from any hangars.

They were in the woods to get to the Falcon. Without the rescue party she would have stayed indoors and tried to steal or stow away on a ship. But the base was on alert looking for her by then so they would have locked down everything. Even if she got into a ship they would have mag pulsed her before she escaped the atmosphere. Her only real chance of escape would have been to kill and dispose of a storm trooper and wear their armor/assume their identity hoping for deployment before Ren scans everyone's brains at assembly. She was doomed without rescue. All because she refused the lightsaber when Maz tried to give it to her.