Vader = Himmler? Fitting.

Then Tarkin would be Goebbels.

And Göring? Admiral Ozzel, I guess..!

Thrawn = Rommel?

What about Motti?

Vader = Himmler? Fitting.

Then Tarkin would be Goebbels.

And Göring? Admiral Ozzel, I guess..!

Thrawn = Rommel?

What about Motti?

Tagge = Josef Jodl, Commander of the Wehrmacht.

Just had a laugh: would this make Mon Mothma = Winston Churchill?

Vader = Himmler? Fitting.

Then Tarkin would be Goebbels.

And Göring? Admiral Ozzel, I guess..!

Thrawn = Rommel?

What about Motti?

Motti = Karl Donitz? Grand Admiral of the Kriegsmarine. Responsible for the u-boat "wolfpack" tactics.

a true genius.

Vader = Himmler? Fitting.

Then Tarkin would be Goebbels.

And Göring? Admiral Ozzel, I guess..!

Thrawn = Rommel?

What about Motti?

Ahhh, the pick-your-favorite-Nazi-game.

It's been a while, let me think.

'

Ok, ok. Imma gonna go Dietrich von Choltitz as Kallus .

Stage one right now; he's still in the Wehrmacht aka. working for the bad guys, but he's seen Geonosis and it's getting him thinking. All it's gonna take is are some solid "Evil Orders" to make him reconsider his position, wherein he either goes the "Savior of Paris" route and saves the main cast, or goes down in a blaze of glory saving the cast from his superiors.

Also this.

It's just Hitler all the way down.

The turtle can be found sideways.

I love love love Rebels!!!! Way better than some of the previews of other animated crap on that channel. Some of the other stuff is so dum and very perverted for kid show. Makes me cringe. At least Rebels has an IQ to it. Wish the TRON series would have stayed as well.

SW Rebels doesn't make the cut for my personal Top 5 cartoons either. Gargoyles, LoGH, GitS SAC, Batman TAS and Gravity Falls beat it easily on any level it might try gain ground.

*stabbing pain from hearing GitS:SAC categorized as "cartoons"*

SW Rebels doesn't make the cut for my personal Top 5 cartoons either. Gargoyles, LoGH, GitS SAC, Batman TAS and Gravity Falls beat it easily on any level it might try gain ground.

*stabbing pain from hearing GitS:SAC categorized as "cartoons"*

Is there any meaningful distinction between an Anime and a cartoon beyond the styles?

Is there any meaningful distinction between an Anime and a cartoon beyond the styles?

Depends. On a technical level, no. But for the purposes of this conversation, where "cartoon" is being used by most to refer to kids shows, absolutely.

When we're talking about best cartoons and using things like Gargyles and Batman: TAS as examples, but for obvious reasons aren't including things like Venture Bros. or Rick & Morty etc. because that's obviously not what the conversation is about, then including something like Ghost in the Shell is pretty ridiculous. Whereas if the example had been, say, Pokemon, I wouldn't have batted an eye including it as a cartoon.

I love love love Rebels!!!! Way better than some of the previews of other animated crap on that channel. Some of the other stuff is so dum and very perverted for kid show. Makes me cringe. At least Rebels has an IQ to it. Wish the TRON series would have stayed as well.

I miss it SO MUCH!!

SW Rebels doesn't make the cut for my personal Top 5 cartoons either. Gargoyles, LoGH, GitS SAC, Batman TAS and Gravity Falls beat it easily on any level it might try gain ground.

*stabbing pain from hearing GitS:SAC categorized as "cartoons"*

Is there any meaningful distinction between an Anime and a cartoon beyond the styles?

No, no there absolutely is not.

SW Rebels doesn't make the cut for my personal Top 5 cartoons either. Gargoyles, LoGH, GitS SAC, Batman TAS and Gravity Falls beat it easily on any level it might try gain ground.

*stabbing pain from hearing GitS:SAC categorized as "cartoons"*

Is there any meaningful distinction between an Anime and a cartoon beyond the styles?

No, no there absolutely is not.

Personal preference is the only one I can think of. To me anmie tends to be more adult but not always....

What I want to know is where that construction project has gone and how this will will tie in with Rogue One?

Love all the character stuff too ☺

I half wonder if maybe Kallus won't start wondering about Geonosis, starting asking too many of the "wrong" questions, and end up showing up in Rogue One as an Imperial defector that leaks the Death Star plans to the Rebels.

Listed in no particular order, and far from a complete list:

• Whales that swim in the vacuum of space.
• Darth Vader, the second in command of the entire empire bothering to show up in person to take care of a small band of rag-tag resistance fighters who have been making trouble in one measly system.
• WHY DOES C3PO AND R2-D2 HAVE TO SHOW UP EVERY GORRAM WHERE!? (sorry, pet peeve)
• Apparantly the Empire cannot track a single ship that flies up from one town on a planet and then lands on another part of the planet. Apparantly, all you have to do to get away from the Empire, is to fly a bit farther away on the same planet you're on. In a spaceship. While they have Star Destroyers in orbit. And TIE Fighters patrolling. And all kinds of communication towers available.

  But nope, just go straight up to the clouds, take a left, fly a bit and then go down and land, and you'll be perfectly fine. No wonder the Empire can't stop the Rebel Alliance.

There's more, but I really can't be bothered. Since you seem to think there's nothing childish about the show in the first place, I doubt anything I say will change that.

Well, as noted:

1. As noted by others, we've already had that in the OT, right from the second movie.
2. Given "the Rebellion" has been established as not a singular entity you could wipe out in one attack, but a myriad of individual cells (which makes more sense, anyway - that's how rebellions actually work ), it makes the OT just as silly with Vader personally chasing down one other Rebel cell with just as much fervor. But that's basically his only job - 'chase down Rebel cells that have Jedi in them'.
3. Presuming some core of Lucas's original plan remains (and even as of 'The Force Awakens', I can't see anything that would conflict with it), the reason R2-D2 shows up everywhere is that he is the one telling the story . IE., the entirety of the 'Star Wars' saga (at least, all the 'Episodes'), from beginning to end, was witnessed by R2-D2...literally the only character there for everything, and who never had his memory wiped. But he's basically just a glorified computer, so doesn't exactly volunteer information in an endless stream. One day, somebody does ask him what he knows about this whole 'Clone Wars' and 'Jedi' and 'Sith' stuff, and...well, this is the story as he knows it.
4. Also as noted by others, it's established as a point of dialog right from the pilot that the Ghost scrambles its signature so that it doesn't read as the same ship. Still, once it starts REALLY fighting the Empire, they don't stay fooled for long (a second-season episode has Kallus immediately identifying the ship as the Ghost on a bridge officer simply noting a Correllian VCX-100 entering the system).

SW Rebels doesn't make the cut for my personal Top 5 cartoons either. Gargoyles, LoGH, GitS SAC, Batman TAS and Gravity Falls beat it easily on any level it might try gain ground.

*stabbing pain from hearing GitS:SAC categorized as "cartoons"*

To me the definition itself doesn't matter at all.

Same goes to people getting pumped up on a subjectively perceived misuse of one word in a whole entry during a casual discussion.

Personal preference is the only one I can think of. To me anmie tends to be more adult but not always....

Anime may tend to be more adult but that doesn't mean it's more grown up. I tend to find that the more adult an anime is the more purile it becomes. There are notable exceptions to that rule I admit. I cannot however think of an anime series that I have enjoyed nearly as much as Rebels.

SW Rebels doesn't make the cut for my personal Top 5 cartoons either. Gargoyles, LoGH, GitS SAC, Batman TAS and Gravity Falls beat it easily on any level it might try gain ground.

*stabbing pain from hearing GitS:SAC categorized as "cartoons"*

Is there any meaningful distinction between an Anime and a cartoon beyond the styles?

Animation is just a means of telling a story.

The meaningful distinction here is what age group is it intended to tell a story FOR, not how it goes about doing so - you don't compare Yo Gabba Gabba to NCIS: Miami, or High School Musical to Fifty Shades of Grey, so why compare Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex to Star Wars Rebels?

Flat out saying, "Cartoons are for kids" is ignoring that key point, and it's a rather ignorant idea to begin with - certainly Bugs Bunny cartoons were intended just as much for adults as children. It also lets companies continue the Hanna-Barbara model of "Let's just put shiny moving objects on the screen for 22 minutes while the parents clean the house" instead of putting real effort into their work.

That's why Dragonball, Cardcaptor Sakura, Doraemon, Hikaru no Go, Sailor Moon, and other anime intended for children under twelve is an appropriate comparison, but things like Berserk, Kill la Kill, and GITS were kinda left off my radar.

That said, I'd say SW:R is probably in my top 50 somewhere of good shows for children, which does put it in some rarified strata.

I'd answer OddballE8's list, but it's been adequately answered elsewhere, and it was the exact same answers I'd've given. I will admit I laughed when I read, "What is Darth Vader doing there?" coming from a supposed canon junkie, as hunting down Jedi is literally one of is two jobs , the other acting as an enforcer for Palpatine and Tarkin. You might as well ask, "Why was Vader hunting down some stolen data on the Death Star at the start of A New Hope?" but then the answer would be that it's part of job 2.

Threepio everywhere annoys me, but the idea that it's R2 being the passive observer of the story (and possibly the one telling the story too) actually makes a lot of **** sense. 3P0 being his domestic robot partner means that he's gotta be involved too.

What I want to know is where that construction project has gone and how this will will tie in with Rogue One?

Love all the character stuff too ☺

I half wonder if maybe Kallus won't start wondering about Geonosis, starting asking too many of the "wrong" questions, and end up showing up in Rogue One as an Imperial defector that leaks the Death Star plans to the Rebels.

Listed in no particular order, and far from a complete list:

• Whales that swim in the vacuum of space.
• Darth Vader, the second in command of the entire empire bothering to show up in person to take care of a small band of rag-tag resistance fighters who have been making trouble in one measly system.
• WHY DOES C3PO AND R2-D2 HAVE TO SHOW UP EVERY GORRAM WHERE!? (sorry, pet peeve)
• Apparantly the Empire cannot track a single ship that flies up from one town on a planet and then lands on another part of the planet. Apparantly, all you have to do to get away from the Empire, is to fly a bit farther away on the same planet you're on. In a spaceship. While they have Star Destroyers in orbit. And TIE Fighters patrolling. And all kinds of communication towers available.

  But nope, just go straight up to the clouds, take a left, fly a bit and then go down and land, and you'll be perfectly fine. No wonder the Empire can't stop the Rebel Alliance.

There's more, but I really can't be bothered. Since you seem to think there's nothing childish about the show in the first place, I doubt anything I say will change that.

Well, as noted:

1. As noted by others, we've already had that in the OT, right from the second movie.
2. Given "the Rebellion" has been established as not a singular entity you could wipe out in one attack, but a myriad of individual cells (which makes more sense, anyway - that's how rebellions actually work ), it makes the OT just as silly with Vader personally chasing down one other Rebel cell with just as much fervor. But that's basically his only job - 'chase down Rebel cells that have Jedi in them'.
3. Presuming some core of Lucas's original plan remains (and even as of 'The Force Awakens', I can't see anything that would conflict with it), the reason R2-D2 shows up everywhere is that he is the one telling the story . IE., the entirety of the 'Star Wars' saga (at least, all the 'Episodes'), from beginning to end, was witnessed by R2-D2...literally the only character there for everything, and who never had his memory wiped. But he's basically just a glorified computer, so doesn't exactly volunteer information in an endless stream. One day, somebody does ask him what he knows about this whole 'Clone Wars' and 'Jedi' and 'Sith' stuff, and...well, this is the story as he knows it.
4. Also as noted by others, it's established as a point of dialog right from the pilot that the Ghost scrambles its signature so that it doesn't read as the same ship. Still, once it starts REALLY fighting the Empire, they don't stay fooled for long (a second-season episode has Kallus immediately identifying the ship as the Ghost on a bridge officer simply noting a Correllian VCX-100 entering the system).

1: And the others were wrong. The Exogorth didn't swim through space. At least they were never shown doing that in any official material. They simply lived on large asteroids.

2: Not really. In Ep IV he's chasing down the ship carrying the stolen death star plans. That's the kind of mission you send your very best on. In Ep V he's not chasing down a small rebel cell, he's attacking one of the main rebel bases and then he's chasing his son. In Ep VI he's actually not chasing anyone. He just happens to be at the death star.

3: That makes no sense since he wasn't around for all of the events in Rebels, only a small part.

4: Are you trying to tell me that when the Empire is tracking a ship with rebels, they'll just stop tracking it if the signal changes? That's the dumbest I've heard in a while. I'm not talking about when they jump away in hyperspace and later return to the planet. I'm talking about litterally flying up a bit from the planet (not even leaving orbit) and then fly a bit away from where they were on the planet, and then land again. And you're saying the Empire would stop tracking that if the identification signal changed?

Right...

Threepio everywhere annoys me, but the idea that it's R2 being the passive observer of the story (and possibly the one telling the story too) actually makes a lot of **** sense. 3P0 being his domestic robot partner means that he's gotta be involved too.

Thats an interesting idea.

SW Rebels doesn't make the cut for my personal Top 5 cartoons either. Gargoyles, LoGH, GitS SAC, Batman TAS and Gravity Falls beat it easily on any level it might try gain ground.

*stabbing pain from hearing GitS:SAC categorized as "cartoons"*

Is there any meaningful distinction between an Anime and a cartoon beyond the styles?

No, no there absolutely is not.

Well, just one.

Anime characters tend to have much more "blood" in their bodies than regular cartoon characters.

A western character like Batman or Elisa tends to have about 4.5 - 5.5 liters of blood or red ink in their person. Sometimes, when the character is hit really hard or stabbed this liquid comes out in a sensible volume; it's function is to project a shield of "drama" around the character, often protecting them from more fatal harm.

(^ She'll be through the ER and up in time for the next episode. )

Anime characters on the other hand have evolved an extra two or three liters of "blood" as a defense against the "mature-style" hyperviolence often depicted in anime shows. The blood serves the same function as the blood in western shows: it projects protective drama fields. However the overabundance of blood has lead to a few interesting quirks.

For one, the abundance of blood means that Anime characters can suffer ridiculous gushing wounds with little to no drop in combat effectiveness. Two, the familiarity with blood and it's relative ease of access have made blood magic much more commonplace in anime that in western cartoons; so much so that sometimes anime heroes (not anti-heroes, just heroes) can use blood magic with little to no stigma surrounding them. Vampires as well are much more prevalent due to the rich feeding grounds, and the high blood pressure means that anger or arousal can have visible surface ques: aka. popping veins and nosebleeds.

The unfortunate side-effect of this adaptation is that the volume of blood also dilutes the drama-field. Over successive generations of media anime characters have to bleed more and more to produce any life-saving drama effects, whereas western characters tend to only need to shed a little in order to get instant drama and audience empathy. Go figure.

Anyway, that's a small difference, but I thought I'd point it out.

(Sorry about the blood, I tried to tone it down as much as possible. It was easy with the Gargoyles pic, but I had to wade through tons of gore, guts, and downright nuttiness just to find that one nosebleed gif. Seriously, never type "anime blood" into Google. Ever.)

Threepio everywhere annoys me, but the idea that it's R2 being the passive observer of the story (and possibly the one telling the story too) actually makes a lot of **** sense. 3P0 being his domestic robot partner means that he's gotta be involved too.

Thats an interesting idea.

It's a concept that goes all the way to the original ideas about the Journal of the Whills . R2 and 3p0 are important to star wars in a very spiritual way.

What I want to know is where that construction project has gone and how this will will tie in with Rogue One?

Love all the character stuff too ☺

I half wonder if maybe Kallus won't start wondering about Geonosis, starting asking too many of the "wrong" questions, and end up showing up in Rogue One as an Imperial defector that leaks the Death Star plans to the Rebels.

Listed in no particular order, and far from a complete list:

• Whales that swim in the vacuum of space.
• Darth Vader, the second in command of the entire empire bothering to show up in person to take care of a small band of rag-tag resistance fighters who have been making trouble in one measly system.
• WHY DOES C3PO AND R2-D2 HAVE TO SHOW UP EVERY GORRAM WHERE!? (sorry, pet peeve)
• Apparantly the Empire cannot track a single ship that flies up from one town on a planet and then lands on another part of the planet. Apparantly, all you have to do to get away from the Empire, is to fly a bit farther away on the same planet you're on. In a spaceship. While they have Star Destroyers in orbit. And TIE Fighters patrolling. And all kinds of communication towers available.

  But nope, just go straight up to the clouds, take a left, fly a bit and then go down and land, and you'll be perfectly fine. No wonder the Empire can't stop the Rebel Alliance.

There's more, but I really can't be bothered. Since you seem to think there's nothing childish about the show in the first place, I doubt anything I say will change that.

Well, as noted:

1. As noted by others, we've already had that in the OT, right from the second movie.
2. Given "the Rebellion" has been established as not a singular entity you could wipe out in one attack, but a myriad of individual cells (which makes more sense, anyway - that's how rebellions actually work ), it makes the OT just as silly with Vader personally chasing down one other Rebel cell with just as much fervor. But that's basically his only job - 'chase down Rebel cells that have Jedi in them'.
3. Presuming some core of Lucas's original plan remains (and even as of 'The Force Awakens', I can't see anything that would conflict with it), the reason R2-D2 shows up everywhere is that he is the one telling the story . IE., the entirety of the 'Star Wars' saga (at least, all the 'Episodes'), from beginning to end, was witnessed by R2-D2...literally the only character there for everything, and who never had his memory wiped. But he's basically just a glorified computer, so doesn't exactly volunteer information in an endless stream. One day, somebody does ask him what he knows about this whole 'Clone Wars' and 'Jedi' and 'Sith' stuff, and...well, this is the story as he knows it.
4. Also as noted by others, it's established as a point of dialog right from the pilot that the Ghost scrambles its signature so that it doesn't read as the same ship. Still, once it starts REALLY fighting the Empire, they don't stay fooled for long (a second-season episode has Kallus immediately identifying the ship as the Ghost on a bridge officer simply noting a Correllian VCX-100 entering the system).

1: And the others were wrong. The Exogorth didn't swim through space. At least they were never shown doing that in any official material. They simply lived on large asteroids.

2: Not really. In Ep IV he's chasing down the ship carrying the stolen death star plans. That's the kind of mission you send your very best on. In Ep V he's not chasing down a small rebel cell, he's attacking one of the main rebel bases and then he's chasing his son. In Ep VI he's actually not chasing anyone. He just happens to be at the death star.

3: That makes no sense since he wasn't around for all of the events in Rebels, only a small part.

4: Are you trying to tell me that when the Empire is tracking a ship with rebels, they'll just stop tracking it if the signal changes? That's the dumbest I've heard in a while. I'm not talking about when they jump away in hyperspace and later return to the planet. I'm talking about litterally flying up a bit from the planet (not even leaving orbit) and then fly a bit away from where they were on the planet, and then land again. And you're saying the Empire would stop tracking that if the identification signal changed?

Right...

1) It's no more or less ridiculous to say "these space whales can survive and even move through space" than it is to say "These space wizards actually have mystical powers connecting them to all living things, oh, and laser swords that somehow mysteriously terminate a mere meter from the generator instead of going on forever." Why is one so much harder for you to accept than the other? Star Wars is fiction with more mythology than science in it, has been since the beginning.

2) Darth Vader is a troubleshooter for Emperor Palpatine, his go-to man to hunt down Jedi that survived the purge as well as whatever other odd jobs came up. Guess what Kanan and his padawan are? His involvement seems pretty clear-cut to me. The authority Vader derives is because it's the EMPEROR who sends him out, not because he himself is high-ranking.

3) Because... they're R2-D2 and C-3P0? Yeah, R2 only has the one episode, but this is a side story to the main Rebellion after all, not the major one. Star Wars has always been about mixing the familiar with the new, and the two droids are highly familiar. Frankly, it kind of annoys me too.

4) And what kind of traffic does Lothal have on an average basis for the Ghost to hide in, as an important planet in the Outer Rim that the Empire was constructing materiel factories on? We do know that when the Empire locked down the planet the Ghost was useless to them; also, later on the signature hiding also becomes useless to them - otherwise why try a blockade run against the whatever planet the B-Wing was needed for? Presumably the Empire cracked it once they knew it was being used against them.

But here's the thing: None of these 'problems' are bad. None of them are fatal flaws which undercut the entire reality of the show and CANNOT be explained in some way or another - it's not like watching He-Man and wondering, "Why doesn't he just cut Skeletor in half with his big sword?" or Sailor Moon and wondering, "Why doesn't anyone recognize this girl when she's somehow wearing even LESS than she was before?"

Unless, of course, one has decided to dislike the show, and is scrambling for excuses to justify that dislike. If you dislike it solely based on what it adds to canon, you must have HATED the Extended Universe, holy crap was there some truly dumb things in there.

Back to the last episode, I did like them showing Kallus as more than just an evil guy. As a honorable warrior and all that. And I think it would be cool to see him in Rogue One or another of the live action movies. But I don't think it will happen. And that brings me to what used to casually bother me, but recently has been bugging me more, and that is why isn't Kallus black? The actor who voices him is a black actor from England. Why make Kallus white at all? I don't understand. If they had just modeled the character off the actor they could have used said actor to portray Kallus in live action. Is there no black Imperials? Or is there just racist artists? Or is there just some benign reason I am missing?

Back to the last episode, I did like them showing Kallus as more than just an evil guy. As a honorable warrior and all that. And I think it would be cool to see him in Rogue One or another of the live action movies. But I don't think it will happen. And that brings me to what used to casually bother me, but recently has been bugging me more, and that is why isn't Kallus black? The actor who voices him is a black actor from England. Why make Kallus white at all? I don't understand. If they had just modeled the character off the actor they could have used said actor to portray Kallus in live action. Is there no black Imperials? Or is there just racist artists? Or is there just some benign reason I am missing?

Yeah.... here. Enjoy... I think.

Poor Chopper doesn't even get a voice actor.

Back to the last episode, I did like them showing Kallus as more than just an evil guy. As a honorable warrior and all that. And I think it would be cool to see him in Rogue One or another of the live action movies. But I don't think it will happen. And that brings me to what used to casually bother me, but recently has been bugging me more, and that is why isn't Kallus black? The actor who voices him is a black actor from England. Why make Kallus white at all? I don't understand. If they had just modeled the character off the actor they could have used said actor to portray Kallus in live action. Is there no black Imperials? Or is there just racist artists? Or is there just some benign reason I am missing?

Kallus was designed first, and then they found a voice actor.

Yeah.... here. Enjoy... I think.

Kanan Jarrus = Freddie Prinze Jr.