4 hours ago, xanderf said:

Not much to add beyond what others have said - basically perfect episode, and the best capstone to the Obi-Wan/Maul arc that seems possible*.

Of course, as noted, there is sort of a gaping plot hole around Ezra's participation, here. I mean, it's great that Obi-Wan spells it out to him that he isn't part of this story . That's nice and all. But especially given you are hanging out with Rex, nevermind a Rebellion teetering on the brink - it seems kinda unlike Ezra to not TELL EVERYONE THAT KENOBI LIVES .

* Point on this, of course. That Obi-Wan and Maul's arc should have ended a long time back . At the VERY least, I hope Obi-Wan bothered (after their final words) to whip out that ol' lightsaber and DICE UP MAUL INTO 1" CUBES! And then, like, spend the next few months traveling around Tatooine and burying each cube-o'-Maul in distant areas, at least a thousand miles apart. He did, after all, come back after you cut him in half the first time . So...just sayin'...

Grasping here but maybe Ezra is clever enough to realize that Bail Organa and Kenobi himself have reasons to keep his existence a secret... maybe.

5 hours ago, xanderf said:

Of course, as noted, there is sort of a gaping plot hole around Ezra's participation, here. I mean, it's great that Obi-Wan spells it out to him that he isn't part of this story . That's nice and all. But especially given you are hanging out with Rex, nevermind a Rebellion teetering on the brink - it seems kinda unlike Ezra to not TELL EVERYONE THAT KENOBI LIVES .

Maybe this actually answers a question from Rogue 1. Mon Mothma asks Bail if he's going to get his Jedi friend, but she's not supposed to know about Obi-Wan or the Skywalker twins either. Imagine Ezra calls Bail out at a high command meeting for lying about Kenobi's death. Bail would have to answer at least to Mon Mothma.

2 minutes ago, jmswood said:

Maybe this actually answers a question from Rogue 1. Mon Mothma asks Bail if he's going to get his Jedi friend, but she's not supposed to know about Obi-Wan or the Skywalker twins either. Imagine Ezra calls Bail out at a high command meeting for lying about Kenobi's death. Bail would have to answer at least to Mon Mothma.

By the way... Mon Mothma has met Ezra and Kanan in person and must know that they are Jedi, or Jedi-ish.
Your quote of Mon Mothma in Rogue One makes Kanan and Ezra's absence during those events even more intriguing.

Why would she think on getting the help of an old guy hidden somewhere, perhaps dead by then, when she has two young jedi available?
I think this is a bad omen for Kanan and Ezra.

9 minutes ago, Azrapse said:

Why would she think on getting the help of an old guy hidden somewhere, perhaps dead by then, when she has two young jedi available?
I think this is a bad omen for Kanan and Ezra.

"Their fire has gone out of the universe. You my friend are all that remains of their religion." -Tarkin

Tarkin knows Kanan and knows of Ezra. They've been marked for death since the moment Tarkin first came to Lothal in Season 1.

1 hour ago, eMeM said:

"- I can't kill my own father.

That is Luke's line. He is jumping to the conclusion that "facing" or "confronting" Vader automatically means that he has to kill him, or be killed by him, and is stating his unwillingness to do that. Maybe even Ben and Yoda don't realize the significance of what they have seen, but they very explicitly never say he has to kill Vader, only that the two of them have to be in the same room interacting with each other.

1 hour ago, LordBlades said:

If this was indeed Yoda's and Obi-Wan's intention it's also interesting to wonder what made them hope Luke would be a better warrior than both of them combined.

Well, they were probably hoping that he would defeat Vader, and then, at some later point, face the Emperor. They probably weren't expecting him to surrender, then try and fight them both at the same time.

28 minutes ago, jmswood said:

"Their fire has gone out of the universe. You my friend are all that remains of their religion." -Tarkin

Tarkin knows Kanan and knows of Ezra. They've been marked for death since the moment Tarkin first came to Lothal in Season 1.

To be fair, neither Kanan or Ezra is an actual Jedi. Kanan was never promoted past Padawan, which makes Ezra the Padawan of a Padawan.

Though I doubt Tarkin knows enough to make that distinction. It's another one of those possible "from a certain point of view" things.

6 minutes ago, DarthEnderX said:

To be fair, neither Kanan or Ezra is an actual Jedi. Kanan was never promoted past Padawan, which makes Ezra the Padawan of a Padawan.

Though I doubt Tarkin knows enough to make that distinction. It's another one of those possible "from a certain point of view" things.

Yeah, I don't think Tarkin or Mon Mothma would split hairs like that when referring to some guys with paranormal abilities that deflect lasers with lightsabers.
After all, it took years for a padawan to become a proper jedi, right? And Luke does it in a few days with Yoda? I don't think Luke would even qualify as a pre-padawan, if such a thing exists. Probably Ezra has already had longer total formal training than Luke ever did.

43 minutes ago, Forgottenlore said:

That is Luke's line. He is jumping to the conclusion that "facing" or "confronting" Vader automatically means that he has to kill him, or be killed by him, and is stating his unwillingness to do that. Maybe even Ben and Yoda don't realize the significance of what they have seen, but they very explicitly never say he has to kill Vader, only that the two of them have to be in the same room interacting with each other.

You completely ignored Obi-Wan's response to Luke's assumption which can't be more clear and specific as to what he wants Luke to do, especially in context of his earlier remark about Vader's humanity (or lack of thereof).

15 minutes ago, Azrapse said:

I don't think Luke would even qualify as a pre-padawan, if such a thing exists. Probably Ezra has already had longer total formal training than Luke ever did.

Youngling preceded Padawan in the years before Order 66, which gives some credence to Yoda's "he is too old" protest to training Luke. It's a safe bet Kenobi was supposed to train Luke starting at a younger age.

26 minutes ago, DarthEnderX said:

To be fair, neither Kanan or Ezra is an actual Jedi. Kanan was never promoted past Padawan, which makes Ezra the Padawan of a Padawan.

Kanan was made a Jedi Knight in a force vision inside a Jedi Temple. You might not like it, but its canon. Jedi Knights can choose their Padawan. If Kanan is officially a Jedi Knight; then Ezra is officially his Padawan.

17 hours ago, aRandomBoardGamingDude said:

On a side note, I'm pretty sure Obi-Wan never kills anything but droids in TCW, so, Darth Maul is literally the only thing he has ever successfully killed with a lightsaber.

He has the same statistical success against living opponents with a blaster as he does with a lightsaber. So when he heard about Vader, if it was before his encounter with Maul and he's pretty sure Maul is alive, he must've thought "how the heck do you finish with these gosh darn lazer swords"

He killed general grevious, granted - with blaster not with his lightsaber, but grevious was a living creature inside an armour.

39 minutes ago, jmswood said:

Kanan was made a Jedi Knight in a force vision inside a Jedi Temple. You might not like it, but its canon.

Don't remember that, but if that's the case, I have no problem with a Jedi being promoted by ghosts.

2 minutes ago, DarthEnderX said:

Don't remember that, but if that's the case, I have no problem with a Jedi being promoted by ghosts. the force

give how much of the saga revolves around the Force's influence, me either

36 minutes ago, DarthEnderX said:

Don't remember that, but if that's the case, I have no problem with a Jedi being promoted by ghosts.

Season 2, Episode 18 "Shroud of Darkness"

The Grand Inquisitor in Temple Guard form tells Kanan, "You are what I once was, a Knight of the Jedi Order."

I'm a huge, dyed to the bone Star Wars fan, but realistically, I don't think its wise to try and assume meaning out of every detail and word choice used to describe the Force throughout the series. As much as I love the scenes themselves, none of them feel written with the kind of forethought required to hold up to any real scrutiny, and they all have that flimsy kind of "something, something Daaaark Siiiiiide" nonsense logic. Trying to assume every word was chosen with heavy intent instead of to just sound mysterious is probably giving the dialog too much credit, particularly if you try to reconcile the prequels and their complete failure to explore Anakin's fall.

Ultimately, my biggest hope for the new trilogy is that it takes some time to explore the Force and what it means to fall to the Dark Side. This next movie feels like the best shot with it giving our first chance to learn from Luke and perhaps the best opportunity since Anakin to explore the Dark Side with Kylo Ren. The franchise needs something after the prequel flailed about with the Jedi and failed entirely to meaningfully explore the Force.

4 minutes ago, LunarSol said:

I'm a huge, dyed to the bone Star Wars fan, but realistically, I don't think its wise to try and assume meaning out of every detail and word choice used to describe the Force throughout the series. As much as I love the scenes themselves, none of them feel written with the kind of forethought required to hold up to any real scrutiny, and they all have that flimsy kind of "something, something Daaaark Siiiiiide" nonsense logic. Trying to assume every word was chosen with heavy intent instead of to just sound mysterious is probably giving the dialog too much credit, particularly if you try to reconcile the prequels and their complete failure to explore Anakin's fall.

Ultimately, my biggest hope for the new trilogy is that it takes some time to explore the Force and what it means to fall to the Dark Side. This next movie feels like the best shot with it giving our first chance to learn from Luke and perhaps the best opportunity since Anakin to explore the Dark Side with Kylo Ren. The franchise needs something after the prequel flailed about with the Jedi and failed entirely to meaningfully explore the Force.

This. I'm a Star Wars fantaic just as much as the rest of you, but I think with the new Think Tank that is the Story group, they will show us more and more force stuff. Pablo has a master plan I'm sure.

Well apparently the story group has already mapped out Rebels for the most part. Pablo Hidalgo said he's known about things such as Yularen being included for three years or so. I imagine this means only the arcs and big picture stuff has been worked out as of yet.

I really like Pablo, He is basically a Star Wars super nerd, that got hired to make the overall Star wars story make sense. That's not an easy task.

28 minutes ago, LunarSol said:

Ultimately, my biggest hope for the new trilogy is that it takes some time to explore the Force and what it means to fall to the Dark Side.

That is an issue, yeah. Up to now the Dark Side has always been described as giving in to one's emotions, allowing your passions instead of your reason to govern you, but Vader has always come across as extremely controlled and even repressed. Yeah, reading the subtext of the films you can understand that he is filled with self-loathing and hatred for what he has become, but that really doesn't come through in the portrayal very well.

I'm not sure, however, that the franchise really does need to explore those issues. the force is supposed to be mysterious and the fact that its true nature and inner workings have been treated so vaguely up till now means that everyone has their own interpretations. If the writers try to delve into those mysteries too deeply there is no way they can't annoy some people. that is, essentially, how we got Midichlorians.

2 hours ago, Azrapse said:

Yeah, I don't think Tarkin or Mon Mothma would split hairs like that when referring to some guys with paranormal abilities that deflect lasers with lightsabers.
After all, it took years for a padawan to become a proper jedi, right? And Luke does it in a few days with Yoda? I don't think Luke would even qualify as a pre-padawan, if such a thing exists. Probably Ezra has already had longer total formal training than Luke ever did.

Luke's training was a montage. Everyone knows you learn waaaaay faster if you do it in a montage. Team America-style

By this point everyone is calling Kanan and Ezra Jedi. If there is a distinction to be made, the only ones who would care about it would be former members of the Jedi Council. To absolutely everyone else who is aware of their existence, they ARE Jedi.

1 minute ago, Forgottenlore said:

By this point everyone is calling Kanan and Ezra Jedi. If there is a distinction to be made, the only ones who would care about it would be former members of the Jedi Council. To absolutely everyone else who is aware of their existence, they ARE Jedi.

Even the inquisitors aknoleged that Ezra was Kanan's Padawan, pretty sure they called them Jedi to.

4 hours ago, eMeM said:

"He's more machine now than man. Twisted and evil."

and a moment later :

"- I can't kill my own father.

- Then the Emperor has already won. You were our only hope."

And Yoda straight up tells him that he should let his friends die, just like he told Anakin in RotS. What Obi-Wan and Yoda were trying to do was training Luke the exact same way they have been trained. Let go of your emotions etc etc.

They were wrong.

But apparently Luke was wrong too, God, I hate TFA so much.

Love the last sentence.

25 minutes ago, Sir Orrin said:

I really like Pablo, He is basically a Star Wars super nerd, that got hired to make the overall Star wars story make sense. That's not an easy task.

He's also super condescending to people that don't agree with his current point of view. I'll take Chee over Hildago any day of the week.

2 hours ago, Azrapse said:

Yeah, I don't think Tarkin or Mon Mothma would split hairs like that when referring to some guys with paranormal abilities that deflect lasers with lightsabers.
After all, it took years for a padawan to become a proper jedi, right? And Luke does it in a few days with Yoda? I don't think Luke would even qualify as a pre-padawan, if such a thing exists. Probably Ezra has already had longer total formal training than Luke ever did.

FWIW, and I wish this was something the movie did spell out better, but it was answered by one of the writers/producers at some point along the way...

The Falcon didn't get from the Hoth-system asteroid field to Bespin 'in a few days', nor was Luke trained by Yoda 'in a few days'. That scene transition covers a jump of (IIRC) 6 months.

(Still, realistically, not enough time for either to happen - but at least someone, somewhere, was thinking about it at all. They just didn't show it on-screen very well.)

1 minute ago, arkhamssaber said:

He's also super condescending to people that don't agree with his current point of view. I'll take Chee over Hildago any day of the week.

I woudln't know, I've only seen him in Rebel's Recon/The Star Wars show.