really folks all it is is JJ putting HIS mark on it.. just like he did with the Enterprise... i guess he likes his ships squatty with thick engines... as for being able to tell the difference its whats on the INSIDE that changes when it comes to aircraft... somebody needs to post a pic of a block 10 F-16 next to a block 50 F-16.. most folks couldn't tell the difference. Externally.. or for an even harder challenge post a pic of an F-15A next to an F-15C.... only a person that worked them can tell them apart from the outside with out looking at the tail number or one other key component that i wont say because it gives it away..lol would try to post pics but EVERY time i do now i get the "You are not allowed to use that image extension on this community." error...

Ah, but are any of the sources for that canon anymore?

Sure until they're declared non-canon by a movie they're still effectively canon. Besides the tech manuals are more likely to remain canon because they wouldn't interfere with the narrative of the movies.

I've seen the argument before, where people try to tie a lot into the terms used, like George or Gene actually gave any thought to the science behind the terms they came up with, like Turbolaser or Phaser.

Phaser for example was most likely just used to make it sound like a more advanced version of a laser.

really folks all it is is JJ putting HIS mark on it.. just like he did with the Enterprise... i guess he likes his ships squatty with thick engines... as for being able to tell the difference its whats on the INSIDE that changes when it comes to aircraft... somebody needs to post a pic of a block 10 F-16 next to a block 50 F-16.. most folks couldn't tell the difference. Externally.. or for an even harder challenge post a pic of an F-15A next to an F-15C.... only a person that worked them can tell them apart from the outside with out looking at the tail number or one other key component that i wont say because it gives it away..lol would try to post pics but EVERY time i do now i get the "You are not allowed to use that image extension on this community." error...

I didn't know JJ was Ralph McQuarrie. The things you learn.

Ah, but are any of the sources for that canon anymore?

It's what Bespin makes and what the carbon freezer is used for transporting.

Why the semicircular engines on the X-wing? Two reasons: first is making it look like a different model. Second is making things Ralph McQuarrie style is the in thing at the moment. Rebels is doing it too (look at their TIE fighters).

Ha, take that you "don't talk about science/logic" killjoys, we went and had an argument so there

Speaking of Bespin, anyone read the new supposed plot leak?

It doesn't matter how powerful your lasers are if your opponent has shields that render lasers harmless, and since the Empire doesn't have shields designed to block phasers

Just because they're called lasers in Star Wars doesn't mean they're the same thing as they talked about in TNG. Likewise an energy shield designed to stop turbolasers would in theory at least be effective against any form of directed energy weapon, including phasers.

To clear something up.

____________________________________________________

Star Wars directed Energy Weaponry is not actually any form of laser. It's more akin to Superheated Plasma Ala Halo, see: Tibanna Gas used as fuel for the weapons.

Ah, but are any of the sources for that canon anymore?

You really need a canon source to see that this:

is not the same thing as this?

Star Wars laser weapons are not lasers, and anyone who's used a laser pointer before knows this.

Ah, but are any of the sources for that canon anymore?

It's what Bespin makes and what the carbon freezer is used for transporting.

Why the semicircular engines on the X-wing? Two reasons: first is making it look like a different model. Second is making things Ralph McQuarrie style is the in thing at the moment. Rebels is doing it too (look at their TIE fighters).

This, "use our vault of art" approach really gets me hyped up. It's wonderful. Utterly wonderful.

...Haha. Hehehahaha.

+1, my good man.

I love Ralph's concept arts, but this new X-wing just looks...kinda derpy, to me. I'm too attached to the X-wing I grew up with as a child.

Give it a chance to grow on you. It was off-putting at first to me, but I'm slowly warming up to it. I think I'll have to see it in theaters kicking the crap out of Imperial Remnant forces before I say whether I truly like or dislike it.

I hated the redesign in star trek and I'm not crazy about that x-wing redesign, I'm fairly sure he's going to turn star wars into a movie for the lowest common denominator like he did trek.

You're right, it's an F-16E. I didn't recognize it because of those conformal fuel tanks they've added to the Block 60s. It looks like only India and the United Arab Emirates fly them.

So it's not really a fighter from the 2010s, it's just a fighter from the 1970s that's been modified in the 2010s. =P A better example would be the Chengdu J-20, whose first flight was in 2011:

Wait, hold on.

"So it's not really a fighter from the 2010s"

Sweet christ, who thought that!? Tell me so that I may beat them with a trout! Oh, god. No, the F-16's models were all made roughly 1970s-1980s. Still in wide use today- 'cuz it's good. Seriously the F-16C, for instance, is one of the USAF's most widely used fighters. And it's old as ****.

The comparison was made a couple pages back.

And yeah, I love Vipers, I wouldn't disrespect them. Not sure I like the CFTs on the E variants, though. I like the smooth curves of the original airframe.

Obvioulsy, JJ can't win.

That seems to be true pretty much no matter what he does. I think there's still a lot of people who haven't forgiven him for Lost, and that carries over to everything else he does. To the point that people who didn't even watch the show get sucked into it.I've seen people completely disregard the dialog in a scene to justify complaining about something he did.

Obvioulsy, JJ can't win.

That seems to be true pretty much no matter what he does. I think there's still a lot of people who haven't forgiven him for Lost, and that carries over to everything else he does. To the point that people who didn't even watch the show get sucked into it.I've seen people completely disregard the dialog in a scene to justify complaining about something he did.

I hated the redesign in star trek and I'm not crazy about that x-wing redesign, I'm fairly sure he's going to turn star wars into a movie for the lowest common denominator like he did trek.

Oh just shut the **** up already.

Why does the XWing need to be changed?

I liked how it was in the original.

JJ always makes changes. Not always good ones.

The nose cap piece is basically non existent and he is making it look more like a earth fighter jet than something from the Star Wars universe. And no astro mech?

Give me episode 4

I have good news for you! Episode 4 is probably for sale at your local Best Buy or Target for around 20 bucks! You can go get it Today!

And this doesn't mean that he has changed the X-Wing you know.... Perhaps this is a modified X-Wing? Perhaps this is an X-Wing V2.... which may fly alongside the classic X-Wings. Just because a ship looks different doesn't mean it's replacing another ship - look at the Z-95 and the X-Wing from our game.... they look similar but are 2 separate ships. This could be an advanced X-Wing, a modified X-Wing, or a new type of Wing altogether. Maybe it isn't even a "wing". Maybe it's the JJ-Bird.

I mean we already know people in this universe like to make "Special Modifications" to ships right? Han made a ton to the Falcon, Vader had a custom Advanced.... maybe someone has a custom X-Wing. Just because you see JJ next to this ship doesn't prove that he is taking your X-Wing away from you.

And this doesn't mean that he has changed the X-Wing you know.... Perhaps this is a modified X-Wing? Perhaps this is an X-Wing V2.... which may fly alongside the classic X-Wings. Just because a ship looks different doesn't mean it's replacing another ship - look at the Z-95 and the X-Wing from our game.... they look similar but are 2 separate ships. This could be an advanced X-Wing, a modified X-Wing, or a new type of Wing altogether.

Exactly.

And while this is likely to be a newer model of X-wing, I would be VERY surprised to see Luke flying around in something other than the classic version.

I hated the redesign in star trek and I'm not crazy about that x-wing redesign, I'm fairly sure he's going to turn star wars into a movie for the lowest common denominator like he did trek.

To be fair, the new Star Trek movies were using the lower common denominator of writing teams.

Obviously the Me-262 is the more advanced fighter: it's rounder and has a cooler paint job.

The justification behind S-foils is it adds surface area for radiating heat. In space your best bet is to add more surface area to vent heat. Same deal with TIE Fighters.

The quote from 'The Outrageous Okona' is a beaten dead horse argument taken out of context; they're only referring to 'lasers' they're familiar with in tech and scope. a Gortex coat may be 'water proof', but would you put it into an industrial hydropower sawmill? Besides, the person delivering the line is a nimrod.

The secondary reason we shouldn't bother debating scientific principles in a gaming forum is because it's all ultimately make-believe and they'll design the starships however they want. If people want to come up with rational explanations they will, and if they don't care they wont. The primary reason we shouldn't bother is because most of us have the scientific knowledge of a house cat.

It's definitely a new model of X-Wing. I mean, come on. Shorter nose, sleeker body, brand new engines, new S-Foils, there's a point where something stops being a modification and becomes a new ship altogether.

And there's nothing wrong with that. It's this, "But I like the X-Wiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiing!" that people did- specifically writers in the EU, that made it so that the E-Wing, the would-have-been X-Wing replacement, never replaced the outdated fighter.

And that's how you have to look at it.

Times change, new technology develops, and stuff gets outdated. You have to continue developing technology to stay in the lead, to keep things working.

Just imagine if we had the Z-95 first, and then we suddenly had to deal with the X-wing. You know what the complaints would be?

"That's too blocky. What's up with the exposed stuff? Four wings? That's seriously stupid. An exposed astromech? Wow that'll make re-entry fun and I bet it'll handle debris and weapons well. This thing is stupid, give me back my Z-95!"

That's what this sounds like, and it's not even that big of a change.

I mean, things HAVE to change. Consider the TOS enterprise. Then the refit. Then the B, C, D, E. Each was vastly different, but they had to be.

Technology advances.

And this doesn't mean that he has changed the X-Wing you know.... Perhaps this is a modified X-Wing? Perhaps this is an X-Wing V2.... which may fly alongside the classic X-Wings. Just because a ship looks different doesn't mean it's replacing another ship - look at the Z-95 and the X-Wing from our game.... they look similar but are 2 separate ships. This could be an advanced X-Wing, a modified X-Wing, or a new type of Wing altogether.

Exactly.

And while this is likely to be a newer model of X-wing, I would be VERY surprised to see Luke flying around in something other than the classic version.

Now on the flipside, some people get attached to their particular type of ship because it's what they know how to fly. Yeah, I can't see Luke flying anything but an old X-Wing either. It's the ship he blew up the death star in.

Probably not the exact same one, but still.

I mean that's why The Raven's Claw never felt right. 'Cuz it never matched Kyle or Jan. I associated them with The Crow, and that's because they looked ragtag as hell. Constantly. No idea why they needed a sleek ship without themselves updating to be sleeker too. It was inconsistent and weird.

But eh.

This is a new X-Wing, and that's okay.

I hated the redesign in star trek and I'm not crazy about that x-wing redesign, I'm fairly sure he's going to turn star wars into a movie for the lowest common denominator like he did trek.

Oh just shut the **** up already.

Ummmmm....no.

And this doesn't mean that he has changed the X-Wing you know.... Perhaps this is a modified X-Wing? Perhaps this is an X-Wing V2.... which may fly alongside the classic X-Wings. Just because a ship looks different doesn't mean it's replacing another ship - look at the Z-95 and the X-Wing from our game.... they look similar but are 2 separate ships. This could be an advanced X-Wing, a modified X-Wing, or a new type of Wing altogether.

Exactly.

And while this is likely to be a newer model of X-wing, I would be VERY surprised to see Luke flying around in something other than the classic version.

Could be a StealthX..... and we now have cloaking rules......

Of course it could be piloted by John Harrison. I'm reserving judgement until I see the movie.

It doesn't matter how powerful your lasers are if your opponent has shields that render lasers harmless, and since the Empire doesn't have shields designed to block phasers

Just because they're called lasers in Star Wars doesn't mean they're the same thing as they talked about in TNG. Likewise an energy shield designed to stop turbolasers would in theory at least be effective against any form of directed energy weapon, including phasers.

To clear something up.

____________________________________________________

Star Wars directed Energy Weaponry is not actually any form of laser. It's more akin to Superheated Plasma Ala Halo, see: Tibanna Gas used as fuel for the weapons.

Ah, but are any of the sources for that canon anymore?

Star Wars laser weapons are not lasers, and anyone who's used a laser pointer before knows this.

That much is abundantly clear.

You see some limited use of lasers in the prequel trilogy -- specifically, the Battle of Geonosis -- but that's about it. Beyond that, it's all plasma throwers or somesuch (i.e. "blasters").

Given the onscreen demonstration of their respective weapons, Star Wars "blasters" are simply orders of magnitude more powerful than Star Trek "phasers". Given that Star War ships have energy shields that can repel blaster fire, there's no way in hell a Star Trek phaser weapon could ever penetrate even the weakest of Star Wars energy shields on the smallest of ships. There's just simply no way.

All these calculations (and more) have already been done to death (the aforementioned link is absolutely fantastic). Sorry, ST fans: Star Trek ships are *scientifically* no match for Star Wars ships.

Why does the XWing need to be changed?

I liked how it was in the original.

JJ always makes changes. Not always good ones.

The nose cap piece is basically non existent and he is making it look more like a earth fighter jet than something from the Star Wars universe. And no astro mech?

Give me episode 4

I have good news for you! Episode 4 is probably for sale at your local Best Buy or Target for around 20 bucks! You can go get it Today!

And this doesn't mean that he has changed the X-Wing you know.... Perhaps this is a modified X-Wing? Perhaps this is an X-Wing V2.... which may fly alongside the classic X-Wings. Just because a ship looks different doesn't mean it's replacing another ship - look at the Z-95 and the X-Wing from our game.... they look similar but are 2 separate ships. This could be an advanced X-Wing, a modified X-Wing, or a new type of Wing altogether. Maybe it isn't even a "wing". Maybe it's the JJ-Bird.

I mean we already know people in this universe like to make "Special Modifications" to ships right? Han made a ton to the Falcon, Vader had a custom Advanced.... maybe someone has a custom X-Wing. Just because you see JJ next to this ship doesn't prove that he is taking your X-Wing away from you.

The official Star Wars Twitter confirmed that it's an X-Wing: https://twitter.com/starwars/status/491196351422554112

I like the new X-wing. It makes sense that there would be some minor design improvements over the decades. Most of the changes are subtle enough that you can still identify the ship as an X-wing.

Star Wars: Force for Change - An Update from J.J.…:

It looks like it has got some SU and AR-Wing in its dna.

I think I like it.

The pilot helmet and rumor of a galaxy destroying super weapon and luke losing his sabre and hand agian not so much.

One thing's for sure...it's more attractive than anything the Prequel's put out so I'm behind it all the way. Would be pretty awesome to have a little Astromech on it, but hell, I'm sure the computers are beefy enough they don't need the extra droid for help. A-wing and B-wing didn't need an Astromech.

As someone else said...perhaps we're just not seeing it in all it's glory maybe there is an Astromech spot.