Hi,

One of my players would like to play a Bretonnian Knight.

He is just starting, so he would start as a Knight Errant.

I am hesitating on the career definition.

The traits would be : Devoted, Basic, Combat, Noble

The Skills: Leadership, Weapon Skill, Piety, Athletics, Ride

The exp. upgrades would be the same as a Knight.

Now for the talents: 1x Tactics (obviously), and then either Oath or Reputation.

If Oath, then I will have to devise an Oath for the Lady Equivalent to to the Virtue of Knighthood, and also devise a Career ability for the Knight Errant.

Alternatively, the second talent could be a Reputation talent, and the Virtue of Knighthood reflected in the career ability.

Also, what would you guys suggest as the Virtue of Knighthood?

What do you guys think? Whats the best option , considering the data that can be found in Knights of the Grail?

I can think of two ways of doing this.

First is the below method. The carrer ability card is you start with the Virtue of Chivalry card and a Steed.

Instead of Oath, have a Tab called Virtue.

Knight Errants start with Virtue of Chivalry.

I have access to eon or storage sites to create this so you have to visualise it

A card, one side says VIRTUE on left side, Other Side says GIFT. In the centre the below text

You spend a Fortune Point to obtain One Gift, which will last through on encounter or until you retreat

Then have Gift cards for

Grail Draught

Ladys Mantle

Might of Purity

Shout Heart

Word of LIght

For the Virtue of Knighthood - For Knights of the Realm

I am confused by the wording, as it seems to say they must have Virtue of Chivalry before they can choose the one and only Virtue of Knighthood they can have.

If this is so then For Knights of the Realm must take Virtue of Chivalry. And also need a place on their card for a second virtue. Which would be a choice from the list of the other 14 Virtues.

Second method is to have the Virtue of chivalry to be the career ability for bretonnian knights. And just have the Gifts as separate cards

You spend a Fortune Point to obtain a One Gift, which will last through on encounter or until you retreat

But have for the Knights of the Realm to have a Virtue tab on their card, for to hold one of the 14 Virtue Talent cards they can only have one of.

What do you think?

Thank you for your post.

Your view on this is interesting and valuable.

You have pinpointed the issue exactly.

I do believe one of the virtues should be a talent tab. Either the virtue of Knighthood or the Virtue of Chivalry.

Considering all Bretonnian Knights have the virtue of Chivalry, it would seem that it should be the one on the tab.

However, considering there are (12?) 13? Virtues of Knighthood, perhaps that should be the one on the talent tab, and virtue of Chivalry be a career ability. I think that last option is best. It gives more distinctive features to Bretonnian Knights, and actually allows a player to have several Virtues of Knighthood and swap them around, which I find is interesting.

Virtue of the Grail would just be an Epic version of the chosen virtue of Knighthood, and Virtue of the Quest would be a career ability.

I like your idea of swapping the 12 rounds of praying with the expenditure of a fortune point for the use of the Virtue of Chivalry. I would add an average Piety check to that cost to integrate the use of the skill, and to be able to modify its difficulty according to the Knight's actions.

Do you agree?

Also, would you have the gifts as talent cards? Extra bonus cards you get with the virtue of chivalry career ability? Action cards?

Not sure How to do them.

A specialised Talent called Gifts. Or bonus cards.

Cant really be actions as theres no reckless/conservative to them

You know I did a nice long post with pictures, but my internet decided to not post the post. I try rememebr all i said.

I think what i wrote was treat Virtues like oaths,they can only choose one. (The Virtue of Chivalry is a required purchase)

Maybe they buy Gifts to expand their collection of usable gifts.

The book I read says the below

Knight Errant = Virtue of Chivalry

Knight of the Realm = Virtue of Chivalry + Only one of the 14 listed Virtues

Questing Knight = Virtue of Chivalry + Quest Virtue (this is Questing Knight Only)

Grail Knight = Virtue of Chivalry + Upgraded Virtue of the one picked when a Knight of the Realm

As a Career Ability. Doesnt look too good

As a Talent ( Dont know how to edit the png to change the colour and rename them to Virtue and Gift. but gives you an idea.)

I am only going from what I read in the book. The Gifts are the difficult part. Balance wise I mean.

I have given this quite a lot of thought and have come up with a system I am rather happy with. I would like your comments on the balance issues: are the effects strong enough, or too strong?

Knight Errant: Basic, Combat, Noble, Devoted

Skills: Weapon Skill, Athletics, Leadership, Piety, Ride,

Advances: same as Knight

Stance meter: Cons. x1 and Reckless x 3

Talents: Reputation x 1 and Tactics x 1

Career ability: You may purchase Gifts of the Lady as Talents, and may slot one gift in one of your talent slots. Also you gain for free the Blessing of the Lady action card.

Gifts: Each gift requires the expenditure of a fortune point at the beginning of the player's turn, lasts for the rest of the encounter or until the gift is unslotted, and only one may be active at a time.

Valiant heart: +2 fortune dice to all Fear and Terror checks.

Aegis of light: +2 misfortune dice to all negative/offensive spells against the knight.

Grail Chalice: +2 fortune die to all checks to resist poison. Cancels poison attacks that don't cause a check to be made.

Nimbus of the Lady: +1 Defense.

Pure soul: +1 boon to all melee attacks performed by the knight.

Blessing of the Lady: Action card, same stats in Conservative and Reckless.

Trait: Lady

Check: Piety

Difficulty: 2 Purple

Requirements: Must be able to loudly call on the Lady by performing at least a maneuver. The longer the praying the easier the check.

Recharge: Special. Praying for 1 hour or more recharges the card.

1 success: Regain 1 fortune point

3 successes: Refresh your fortune pool

2 boons: gain the Inspired condition with three recharge counters.

Sigmar's comet: This action recharges immediately.

Chaos Star: The Lady is displeased by your actions and you lose 1 fortune.

2 Chaos Stars: The Lady is displeased and you may not use Gifts in the next encounter.

Everyone thinks these rule subset is perfect?

LotM

LordoftheMilk said:

You need to test it, most looks fine, but is the Blessing of the Lady action card a bit too powerful, you havent put a recharge on it, so in theory the knight could use it every turn when they are low on fortune until they have full fortune.

Unless I have read it wrong,

Am not sure what happens if you have no fortune and lose 1.

The Blessing of the Lady recharges after one hour of praying.

It might still be OTT.

I'm going to revisit this topic further. Great work so far