gheintze said:
But that's the point - it didn't. If it had different board art I guess most of us would have been happy. As is - there is nothing on that Battlemap that cannot be reproduced with an Epic regular game.
I think that the two biggest problems with the Troll release have nothing to do with its contents: timing and price point.
I think the idea behind battlemaps is a good one. But poorly received in having only two set maps and a creature for MSRP of 18USD as an introduction, and in coming after months of silence about the direction the game was taking - everyone expecting Heroes or development of races/nations, and getting a single (double-sided) battlemap and a single creature instead.
If the introduction had been three such maps with three such creatures for a MSRP around 25-30USD, I think the reception would've been much better, even though the timing would still have been an issue.
The troll is an excellent addition to the creatures in BattleLore and I am looking forward to more creatures that have similar impacts on the game. I'll be fine if FFG continues the battlemap stylings of BL, but still feel that that should wait until the races/nations and Heroes/RPG/Campaign aspects of the game are developed first. And as Kilrah points out, battlemaps should offer more variety/distinction from the "normal" board than the troll map did - but I think that was on the way, and the troll map was a "testing of the waters" , so to speak.
EDIT: O, and there was a third and fourth issue with the troll expansion, both minor in my opinion, but major turn-offs to others: the aforementioned lack of summary cards (a complete non-issue with me, but I tend to play rather frequently
), and the decision to permantly afix the banner to the base of the troll. That one was more problematic as many times it led to the banner breaking off in the packaging, made the troll more difficult to paint, and reduced the flexibility that being able to replace the flag with a green or red would bring.
toddrew said:
and the decision to permantly afix the banner to the base of the troll. That one was more problematic as many times it led to the banner breaking off in the packaging, made the troll more difficult to paint, and reduced the flexibility that being able to replace the flag with a green or red would bring.
So mine wasn't an anomoly? My brother broke off the flag while trying to remove it before a game I played against him and wondered why it wouldn't come out. Ya, I would definitely say that flags should remain removable in the future.
You are not alone
toddrew said:
and the decision to permantly afix the banner to the base of the troll. That one was more problematic as many times it led to the banner breaking off in the packaging, made the troll more difficult to paint, and reduced the flexibility that being able to replace the flag with a green or red would bring.
Use lots of warm water and lots of patience and you can remove the flag evenually without damaging the figure. But yes, it was a pain!
kilrah said:
toddrew said:
and the decision to permantly afix the banner to the base of the troll. That one was more problematic as many times it led to the banner breaking off in the packaging, made the troll more difficult to paint, and reduced the flexibility that being able to replace the flag with a green or red would bring.
Use lots of warm water and lots of patience and you can remove the flag evenually without damaging the figure. But yes, it was a pain!
The glue they used is water based? ia m surprised by that. I guess I can try it on my broken figure first.
Well I had hoped to start a discussion about what Richard has said is being looked at by FFG and which 'we' do and don't want rather than rag on the Troll expansion
.
So what are your opinions on the possible ideas?
Chris
Elberon said:
First thing is that there is a 'map' as the Torks were found in Greenland (and a hint of a timeline/ history). To me this bodes neither good nor bad but perhaps most interesting the possibility for a RPG which would explain the need for a delay in getting stuff out there IF they are re-writing heroes to tie in with it! (Yes I know FFG have CoC and Warhammer but a lighter game world would round out their portfolio).
A map would be good because, if/when campaign rules are "officially" created for Battlelore, a map would give everyone the same world to work with. Granted there will be many who will create their own worlds or use existing worlds (Tolkein) but a map would still be nice.
Elberon said:
I would say that dragons were more than hinted at by Raven. My concern is that, with Raven's post being over a month old, was the post really a hint at things to come of just the wishful thinking of a talented fan of the game. Creatures are a must have for the game and need to be produced. I personally didn't have a problem with the troll except for the glued in flag and no cards included. I got mine for $13 so the price wasn't a factor for me. I would pay that amount for future creatures if they come with cards and maps. Though it would be nice to see new terrain on these maps. Maybe even dungeon maps or cavern maps or tiles that would allow these to be created.
Elberon said:
D&D had a few types of dwarves in it. The ones that readily come to mind are the Duergar, which are a cruel and evil subrace of dwarves. In D&D, they typically make their homes in tunnels and caverns. They are very similar in appearance to surface dwarves, but have distinct pale gray skin, no hair, and bright eyes. Duergar usually dress in drab clothing that matches the color of stone. They also have the ability to become invisible in the Forgotten Realms campaign setting.
Elberon said:
Forest Elves, Shadow Elves, War Elves - Forest elves sound tolkienesq, Shadow elves sounds Drowish, would there be space for a War type elf as well, I don't know, though it might tie in with the tribesmen / barbarian humans.
I would love to see elves in the game, probably second only to the undead as far as other races go. They could move freely through woods and would employ bows with greater effect (blue and red banner).
Elberon said:
Tork (aka Orks) from Greenland, so purely a mercenary race to me rather than having full depoyment deck as their 'home base' is too far away.
Not overly excited about Torks unless they are distinguished from Goblins by more than a banner color. Hopefully, if they come out with them, they will have some distinct characteristics that separate them from the goblins.
Elberon said:
Human Barbarian Army, Human Tribesman, Human Ice Army, Man'chines, Wolven Migration.
These leave me with the biggest doubts, where in europe would a barbarian or tribesmen like area exist without more devoloped organised etc nations just steam rolling over them? France, England, Holland, Spain, the Proto Pussian states, Holy Roman Empire, Ottoman empire, I just can't see where or how they could exist
Ice Army sounds plausible (if thet come from the area that will beome Lenigrad), Wolven migration from Nordic region.
Man'chines, sound like humans making use of machines to aid their war efforts. I could see them being from the Holy roman Empire region (aka Italy) from which the Renaissance and all the technological / scientific break throughs come from
While these would all be cool I see them as more of a distraction than an addition to the game. They would take the game on other tangents than those already established in the game. I just don't see them adding as much as an undead army or elves would.
Elberon said:
Rat Nation, Reptilian Army, The Swarm (Bugs)
Again I'm in two minds on these, would need to see how they are done, mind you I like the twists on tradtional fantasy races so far so more than happy to see Richards interpretations on these
These are more appealing to me than the previously mentioned races but again, not as appealing as undead or elves. The Swarm would interest me (ie: Starcraft) most, probably third to undead and elves. I could do a lot with the Swarm as an alien race that attacks.
Elberon said:
Necromancer Skull Army (featuring the dead and much more) - Lithuania sort of area lots of mountains narrow valley passes, lots of darkness and shadows, yeah that could be interesting, perhaps an unholy allience with shadow elves and dwarves?
My favorite by far. I could see new tiles with cemetaries as home bases for the undead. Maybe any undead units must start on or adjacent to a cemetary but if they return to the cemetary they gain a figure back (up to their max of four) for every turn they stay on the cemetary hex. Maybe a new lore card is introduced that allows you to create an undead unit on every cemetary hex on the board. A cemetary could be "cleansed" by an opposing hero of sufficient levels who occupies the cemetary hex for a turn so that it can no longer be used by the undead.
Elberon said:
So FFG if you've got this far through this thread and interested heres my wish list based on what Richard has hinted at, make of it what you wll:
Heroes (and please add in a RPG game at some stage but don't delay more release because of it)
Skull Army
Dwarven Lords, Forest Elves, Human Ice army and Wolven migration
Bugs, Man'chines, Shadow armies
Rat Nation, Reptilian Army
War Elves, Tribesmen and barbarians
My list would be:
I would also like to see more done with the mideivil campaign. I love both fantasy and historical settings for this game and could see it being successful in both areas. My wife is a school teacher and could use the historical side of the game to excite kids to learn about the dark ages much like many teachers have used Memoir 44 to teach about WWII.
As hard as it may be to imagine, I would really like races that didn't hue too closely to Tolkien/D&D/Warhammer. I know it's a little far a-field, but I'd love to see a Greek themed army with Centaurs and naiiads or the like. Or Scandenavian giants. Or Irish fairies (trows and selkies and plenty of other things).
I certainly don't feel the need for Orks, and would be fairly indifferent to elves.
Of course, if I have the money I'll buy whatever comes out. But one casualty of the long wait for a new release is I don't have the disposable cash that I used to.
Spring 2009 will be a great time to be a BattleLore fan.
Man, is this dish going to taste good when it's ready to eat.
<From wikipedia>
"Definition
Meteorologists generally define four seasons in many climatic areas, winter, spring, summer and autumn (or fall). These are demarcated by the values of their average temperatures on a monthly basis, with each season lasting three months. The three warmest months are by definition summer, the three coldest months are winter, and the intervening gaps are spring and autumn. Spring, when defined in this manner, can start on different dates in different regions. In the vast majority of Northern Hemisphere locations, spring occurs during the months of March, April and May. (Summer is June, July, August; Autumn is September, October, November; Winter is December, January, February.) The vast majority of Southern Hemisphere locations will have opposing seasons with spring in September, October and November. "
</From wikipedia>
YEAH we have some info soon !
To be fair to FFG summer doesn't officially start til the 21st June so they do have a few hours left. (Well I'm from the UK so I'm trusting Mr Internet not to lead me astray on this date...)
Chris
p.s. though I'm not holding my breath that there will be any info in the next 36 hours
Elberon said:
To be fair to FFG summer doesn't officially start til the 21st June so they do have a few hours left.
Perhaps the post/blog/news item in question was from the point of view of the good people of the southern hemisphere and they have a few thousand hours left
toddrew said:
Elberon said:
To be fair to FFG summer doesn't officially start til the 21st June so they do have a few hours left.
Perhaps the post/blog/news item in question was from the point of view of the good people of the southern hemisphere and they have a few thousand hours left
Wouldn't hold my breath on that aspect..but go ahead!
ITS midsummer feast here in finland
Here is a fine example of why FFG doesn't/shouldn't give specific deadlines.
Germ said:
Here is a fine example of why FFG doesn't/shouldn't give specific deadlines.
No, this is more a comment about the fact that there has been NO official comment from any FFG employee. If my company were to keep customers so uninformed we wouldn't have many customers. If anyone from FFG got on the forum or wrote an article about BattleLore, that would be something at least. Even to say, "well, we didn't make a spring release, but here is what is in the works. . . ." or ANYTHING.
I would like to second the previous poster. I was told that Fantasy Flight buying Battlelore was a good thing because of their support. But the lack of ANY information tends to tell me that nothing is happening. I even wrote FF attempting to provide support and suggest that posting some information about how thing were going would be awesome. I got a fairly unimpressive email response of "it is not our policy to provide details about a game prior to the launch". I beg to differ with this mentality. Just a little information here and there maintains interest. I also tend to not care about timelines being moved as long as the flow of information continues (Been a long time Blizzard Entertainment fan -- and look how long it take them to get their games out!!!!) I believe since the last official posting discussed a spring launch that an official update is warranted. Hope someone out there in FF land can spend just 20 min an post something official.
Weak performance from FFG.
Does anyone know good "miniature" game with board ? I have tide of iron also but fantasy style game (not heroscape) would be nice... .
We could start to think in this forum some alternative game to Battlelore ?
But As mr. Borg is working on the next game. Lets hope he takes some other producer than FFG
I agree, weak performance to say the least.
When FFG bought BL I was very enthusiastic and started to pick up some of their other games just because i liked the company and wanted to give them my support.
My respect for FFG is now gone. I will buy new Battlelore products from them but otherwise I will try to stay away from their games. I will not support a company that don´t want to talk to its customers and fans.
Maybe they'll have an announcement at Origins. Let's hope.
diaper, if you are not going to buy any FFG games just as a protest, you'll be missing out on some great games. some of the greatest even.
If people here want to protest, I think I have an idea.
You can move all BattleLore discussion to the "Legacy Game Discussion" forum (here: http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_foros_temas.asp?efid=119&efcid=28 ).
Just open new threads with the word BattleLore in the title. I guess the administrator will move them back to this forum at one point or another, and it won't really affect anything, but it might be funny.
Also, in case someone missed that, there's a nice post on BGG forums regarding battlelore ... http://www.boardgamegeek.com/thread/415481
Now posting to the Legacy Game discussion whilst slightly childish does have a certain appeal, perhaps moving plastic toys round a board means my inner child is alive and well
Chris
Anyone tried the new Spiked Shot and the new Dwarven Bull Rider units yet?
Yes, many times.
Both the Cattle-Riders and Goblin Slingers are a lot more interesting to play.
Use the new summary card rules in any prior adventure an see what I mean.
Sorry for the delay on these....
Richard Borg
Thanks for the new versions, they do look interesting.
Chris
Zero to hero -> FFG is best that there is ! (some irony but lets show that if we get info we show some grattitude)