So, I've been looking at the stats of some creatures and have noticed them having both Unnatural Agility and Unnatural Speed. Unnatural Speed says it doubles the Agility Bonus *after* all other factors have taken place, so does this mean if a creature with say Agility 50 with Unnatural Agility x2 would have a bonus of 10 that would then be doubled to *20* for determining movement speed?

I mean it usually says that whenever things get multiplied it just adds another multiplier making x2 into x3, but here it seems to specifically be calling for doubling whatever's there.

The reason I'm so curious about this is that from what I can tell the Lictor with Ag 50 that is Size (enormous) which the book says gets factored in as a +2 to the Agility Bonus means it's starting with an effective bonus of 7, that's doubled to 14 because of Unnatural Agility x2, it also has Quadreped which makes the modifier x3 for an AG bonus of 21, this is topped off by Unnatural speed which says it doubles the total AG bonus after taking everything else into account making the AG bonus for a Lictor when calculating movement 42.

This would give it a move of 42/84/126/252.

Is this right or have I gone mad? o.O

While a strict reading of these rules may state otherwise, the creatures out of CA with traits like this (consider the genestealer), do not apply unnat agility multiplier on top of the unnat speed multiplier.

I would say just apply unnat speed to the AB, and don't even consider unnat agi as being involved.

Unnatural Agility's bonus doesn't apply to your Speed, only Unnatural Speed applies to speed.

So true.

Unnatural Agilty gives you no speed boost and that is good for if it did then Genestealers and Lictors would be real pain in a RT and DH game.

Yeah, I just read the section on movement in more detail and it does say it is determined by Agility bonus with traits and talents being able to modify it and Unnatural Speed specifically sates that "the creature doubles its Agility Bonus (after modifying AB from other traits and factors, specifically size) so it sounds to me like Unnatural Agility *should* affect movement, while Unnatural Speed and being a Quadreped in the case of Lictors *only* affects a creature's movement.

But then again the Eldar in Lure of the Expanse have Unnatural Agility and don't apply it to their movement so I guess that's just something that hasn't been clarified.

So, if we can assume that Unnatural Agility doesn't come into movement how do Quadreped and Unnatural Speed interact as they both say double but unnatural speed says to do so after everything else is calculated? Just give the creature times three for its movement? That feels a bit more in line with the rules, and would make the Lictor's speed based on an agility bonus of 15 instead of 20.

This also means that the Genestealer's movement is fine at 12/24/36/72.

The main reason I brought this up was because it seemed clearly wrong for the lictor to have a move of 6/12/18/36 when its basic Ag is 50, and it has Quadreped, Unnatural Speed, and Unnatural Agility x2 (which looks like should be ignored).

So that leaves us with Lictors having a speed of 15/30/45/90 or 20/40/60/120.

Either way my players will be happy not to be fighting a Lictor that can travel 252 metres every 5 seconds!

The description of Unnatural Agility explicitly notes that it does not apply in any way towards speed.

Not in the Deathwatch Rulebook, it just has the trait "Unnatural Characteristic" which covers all of them and talks about Unnatural Strength, and Intelligence, but not how Unnatural Agility works.

Here is a thread that has covered this already.

That's presumably a mistake that will get fixed by the errata then. Dark Heresy's Inquisitor's Handbook explains it:

"Note that Unnatural Agility whilst increasing the AB, does not affect the creature's Move Rate - this is a separate Trait, Unnatural Speed."

Unnatural Agility is only good for your initiative rating (Eldar and Death Cult Assassins tend to go towards "1d10+I Go First" with it) and opposed tests such as stealth vs detection.

Aye, an erratta would be handy!

Thanks Uncertain for that link, that seems to have a lot of information that will be helpful!

Deathwatch core, page 136. Unnatural Characteristic , second paragraph, last sentence:

• " Note this trait does not modify the creature's movement. "

-=Brother Preatus=-