Say anything you want here ;') (game stories, comments, whatever you want really— but preferably related to the league) Dam won't yell at you, I promise ;')

"Hey you kids! Get off my lawn!" **** it Dam, you're not supposed to yell at people in here!

Here's the league link again.

http://arkhamleague.blogspot.com/2010/03/arkham-horror-fan-creation-league.html

Are we supposed to use all the expansions everytime we play? We tried the first scenario Saturday night with just the base game, and were drawing vampires left and right, plus got hit with the terrible experiment on the 5th mythos, and 3 monster surges in that time as well (it was ugly, and the game beat us pretty quickly after that). I'm trying to figure out if a) we should have all that other stuff taking place Innsmouth, KiY, Pahroah's Curse while trying to deal witht he scourge of the vampires. Also, are we using personal stories every game too? We didn't play with them originally, but looking over the original league rules it looks like they are allowed.

FYI, it was an 8 player game, so the terror level was ramping up quickly as well. At one point half of us were at St. Mary's Hospital, and John Legrasse was our first investigator to run away (**** him!)But between Zoey and Amanda my wife and I were able to take down 9 monsters from the first monster surge, including 2 zombies, 2 vampire cultists, a Dhole and a chtonian. Too bad we blew all of our karma on the second turn of the game.

JerusalemJones said:

Yes. You're supposed to use all expansions and all components except for the Kingsport Board components (i.e. the Kingsport Board, encounters *in* Kingsport, mythos cards from Kingsport, and Other World Encounters from Kingsport— all other Kingsport components should be used). If you want, you can use less (but you'll be doing so at your own peril). Your monster cup was probably too thick with undead and cultists. Adding in the other expansion monsters will dilute this to a certain extent (and you'll *definitely* have fewer undead to deal with).

I actually like Terrible Experiment (usually)... It's an easy way of getting monster trophies, plus it's a good rumor shield.

I don't really understand how you had half your team in the hospital (I hope you weren't charging at Dracula).

I blew through the first scenario pretty easily with a five investigator team. Hrm... I have *no* idea why you picked Amanda ;'D she's pretty much in all the investigator pools as cannon fodder. Eight player team, ey? Hoo... Well... You should be playing two extra boards, so it should only count as seven players ;') that gives you a *little* terror buffer. Plus DH/IH allows you to have an extra gate on the board (if you still have problems controlling the gates, you could always hold on to Fire of Asshurbanipal after you come across it— although personally that wouldn't be an item of choice for me, but, I am playing smaller teams— I'm trying to play five player minimum so I have an understanding of what larger teams are going through— I don't think smaller teams will be able to beat many of these scenarios, but that's fine— after all :') I built these with the understanding that team size could be grown and shrunk).

Eight player teams will be a bit difficult at times, but it was my opinion (and still is) that high number of investigator teams make for an easier game if played properly (gate blitzing and proper resource sharing and acquisition) than low number teams. An eight player team can be a bit punishing in case of an error or really bad luck, but, um, just send a kamikazee mission (a well equipped fighter) onto an early game gate surge (if there's only one or two gates open when it happens). You can even deliberately let the last monster knock you out if you don't want to get sucked into the gate (just don't use your weapons against it— I'd actually probably advise against kamikaze tactics (if you think you can get by a stack)— it'd probably be better to give Norman Withers the Elder Sign, try to take out either the three stack or the four stack (if the stack split, which is far more likely)— whatever you think him capable of, then have him Find Gate out the next turn and use his built in greater banishment to slice off some of the remaining monsters). Heh... Speaking of kamikaze, last game I actually pulled off a Flute of the Outer Gods/Milk of Shub combo (I bought Flute because I thought it might potentially come in handy, and I had enough characters that money wasn't an issue— I was *so* glad when I got milk, the terror level was at five). Last game (scenario two) was a desperate struggle (you'll see tomorrow, scenario three will be difficult, but, not tense in quite the same way as scenario two— it won't crush you for making a certain kind of mistake). And... Well... You'll see. I was so desperate to finish scenario two, I allowed one of my investigators carrying an item I wanted to carry to the next scenario to be devoured to seal a gate with an Elder Sign (he was at 1 stam 1 san).

I'm going to give you a strategy tip on team selection below, so, please ignore it if you don't want to read it. And tucked away in the center paragraph I'm going to give a hint about how to deal with Dracula (if you haven't figured it out yet).

-

Wendy, William, Norman, and Zoey start with 3+ clues (and an elder sign). That's nearly enough to seal most of your gates from the start. Jacqueline is a great game controller (she'd definitely be essential for an eight player team— and in my opinion, any team larger than three, i.e. any team that would be very unlikely to win by final combat). Mary, is, well, Mary :') and Carolyn and Dexter pair together pretty well (since Dexter can dump his spells over to her, and potentially become a great spell caster as well). I can't say for certain yet whether this is the best eight player team for the first five scenarios, but, just for the first scenario, I'd say these are the best characters. Gloria's good, but, she's not quite good enough (although I *might* consider swapping her with Dexter since her stats are a little more fit for fighting (she essentially has two more points than him there, but being able to start with a guaranteed shrivelling can really come in handy). It would depend on the scenario I think. Hrm... Now I'm not sure anymore ;'D But I do know I probably wouldn't play Diana with an eight player team (too hard to control the terror track so that she'll only get five or six clues from it, but not ten, and other than that, she's not so great without a dragon's eye) unless I was willing to orient the team around her Mole ability. Twilight Darrell :')

You can dodge Dracula with Wendy, or a Patrol Wagon if you're willing to devote one investigator to the task. It's not the most glamorous job, but it significantly reduces his threat. If Wendy does it, you can theoretically arm her properly and have her do some street sweeping as well (although that could be a bit difficult since there are no cultists or maniacs— she'd need crosses or an ally). Normally I'd just have her squat (but since I assume you have eight live players, that might be a bit dull, so a sub-optimal strategy, but more sociable strategy would be giving her Mary's and Zoey's crosses, and two +4 (or ideally some X handed weapon, or a bullwhip, or a +5 reloadable weapon). Of course, once you have her bring down Dracula from the sky, you don't have to worry about him flying down on anyone else until he moves twice more. So ::shrug::

But yeah. Amanda? No ;') Play her if you *have* to (as a devouring replacement character), but don't *pick* Amanda ;') I included her in the investigator pool for her weakness, not for her strength. ::Shrug:: I can't honestly say I'm certain this will *always* be true (since Lola won't be available until the fourth segment of the scenarios). It's possible I missed something in the scenario designs (and you should definitely consider if she'd be appropriate for one or the other) buuuut, I generally just considered her as cannon fodder...

-

I need to spend all of tomorrow working on my portfolio (what I should be doing now instead of this— well, that or sleeping). I will post the scenario on Friday (or possibly very late Thursday night).

Skipped the hints don't want then yet.

Yes, with just the base game we got swarmed by vampires and undead. And we drew alot of the big monsters off the bat.

Our first mythos card unleahed the Dhole, which moved into the streets to block the gate. Our second mythos card caused a mosnter surge and moved four more monsters to hang out with the Dhole. I was playing Zoe, and moves her to fight the mosnter stack, expecting to beat down everything but the Dhole, but succeed in nailing them all. My wife came through playing Amande (with +1 Fight and +1 Will) and beat down the stack of monster on the gate, but had taken some pretty heavy San/Stam loss (as Zoe, I was at 1 Sanity after my lucky battles). Amanda's OW encounter caused her to be LiT&S. The next round, Dracula moved and attacked me (I had a Sneak of 1, and even though we ruled he could move from the sky into locations as his abiilties sem to imply I still had the lowest Sneak). Managed the Horror Check, failed the combat check, went to the hospital. Another invesitgator lost a fight against the monsters at the Woods gate and went to the hospital, Sister Mary got pounded and went to the Hospital, and the next round Amanda came out at the Hospital since she had 1 Stamina and 3 Sanity. So four investigators at St. Mary's.

Had we been playing with the other boards, we could have controlled the terror level better (since we'd then have an outskirts of 1). And the mosnter cup better be more diluted when we play next. Heck, I would have passed my story on the second round of the game, and that would have made a difference as well. So, now that we know we played it wrong we know how to better fight it.

It also didn't help that we had 9 people, so one person only did the cards, and he thought it might be more interesting not the shuffle the encoutner decks until I called him out on it third turn.

JerusalemJones said:

Hoo boy... 9 people? Yikes. Are they all Arkham Horror veterans? If not, and you're finding these scenarios too hard, let me know and I can change a few game variables to make it a bit easier for you guys (i.e. allowing five items to carry over instead of four for the first five scenarios).

Yeah... You interpreted Dracula's movement correctly, I think. The intention behind the card was that it would treat unstable locations like streets (so it could also move to adjacent locations if it's grounded— I'm not sure if that came up, but with eight players it might, so, I just wanted to clarify it).

Heh... Well... At least for a 8 player game cultists won't go to the outskirts or count against the monster limit ;')

Yes, we are all veterans. I still remember the night at the store we had two 8 player games of Arkham taking place. The other table lost, and we were running Hastur with Tulzscha as the Herald. The game was going poorly for us, and we actually decided to use the spell to awaken the AO, since we figured we'd have an easier time beating up Hastur than winning normally. It was cheesy, but it worked.

JerusalemJones said:

Okay, well, I mostly asked because I didn't understand why your team picked Amanda (was it just someone's personal preference, or was there a rationale for it?). You do know you can— and are encouraged to— select your investigators from the investigator pool?

Usually when we play we deal out four random investigators to each player and then pick one. If our investigator is devoured or retired, our next pick must come from the remaining investigators.

For the scenario we picked from the list that was given, and the only one we knew we had to pick was Zoe. My wife picked Amanda because she was last to pick, and of the remaining characters was her favorite to play. I picked second to last and choose Zoe, since it was either me or her playing her and she didn't have a preference.

Let's see...Zoe, Amanda, Wendy, Yorick, Mary, Norman, Diana, Carolyn. Not sure why Jacqueline wasn't picked, probably because we didn't expect to be hosed by the mythos deck. Dexter is so-so for our group, and if Zoey wasn't still available I'd have picked Gloria because whenever I play Gloria she kicks ass! There was one game were her and Ammi Pierce were going from place to place killing everything on the board). Our choices may be much different the next time we play.

JerusalemJones said:

::Blink blink:: ::Laughter:: oh my. I'm actually blushing ;') I *always* expect to be hosed by the Mythos Deck.

But now that I think about it, I guess it would be less of an issue if you were only playing the base game (no other boards or double doom to worry about). Still, even with the base game you can prevent the small gates from opening with her and really mess up the doom track (and she can protect you from hitting Gate Limit). I don't really like her that much for small number of investigator games, but for teams larger than three, I think she almost always pays off. But yeah, I can see the logic in not picking her if expansions weren't played (I'd still probably pick her because I tend to prefer control strategies in strategy games and diverse skill sets— Amanda's too generic for my liking, strategically speaking).

From a non-strategy point of view though, I do like Amanda :') I like challenging characters (but I have to admit, it annoys me that she coexists with Lola who is just so much better than her in every way). I was shocked when the personal stories came out and she remained Lola Jr. jr. ::shrug:: they should have also let her draw an extra skill when passing her personal story. *Then* she would have been a bit more balanced in comparison. Ah well...

I'll be posting the next scenario between 9 and midnight my time (Pacific Daylight Time). I figure that's tomorrow on the East Coast ;')

I just posted the second scenario:

http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_foros_discusion.asp?efid=5&efcid=1&efidt=310273

I finished the 2nd scenario about a week ago, and kept Illuminated Manuscript on Mary, Alchemy on Jacqueline, Healing Stone on Caroline, and Gruesome Talisman on William Yorrick (I was really tempted to go for a weapon instead— but I figured there are lots of weapons in the deck, but only one Gruesome Talisman).

We came closer Saturday night to beating the first scenario. This time around we had seven investigators Mary, Yorick, Zoey, Amanda, Wendy, Diana and Carolyn. We had no problem closing gates, but only manged to seal 3 of them. Several times we could win on the next turn if a gate didn't open and it always did. In the early game had a few monster surges, and the TT never went above 3, but in the later game every mythos opened a new gate (ecept for the one that opened no gates but added two Doom Tokens to the Doom track). Even if we had played Jacqueline, her ability would not have made a difference.

The thing that hurt us the most this game was a lack of decent weapons. The best magical weapon was a ythian rifle; the second best Enchanted blade. Our best physical weapons were the flamethrower and the shotgun (1 of each). Our initial mythos card put an exhibit item in the Merchant and Rivertown streets, and the second turn Dracula moved to the Rivertown streets and stayed there for the next 4 or 5 turns. Amanda had picked up the item, and barely snuck into the General store. But she was trapped there for the first third of the game. Thankfully we finalyl got a gate burst and Dracula flew to the sky. Sister Mary had to fight a 5 toughness Mummy and actually beat the darn thing.

Some players still think the scenario is "too tough," but this time I knew we had a strong chance of winning. Maybe the next time (hopefully, there is a next time).

JerusalemJones said:

::Laughter:: "too tough"? Are you serious? Oh crap. They're going to *hate* scenario two (that one actually *is* difficult). I hope you don't end up having to play it alone.

Why would you have problems with scenario one? Other than Dracula eating an investigator, and an occasional curse, it should be a relatively regular game. I think I beat it with the doom track at seven or was it nine? Either way, not even close.

You should have just ran Amanda into Dracula and sent her to the hospital (I don't mind slightly crippling investigators as a transportation tool— free hospital bed rides).

I'll give you some advice, I really don't want you guys to quit :') add Norman Withers to your team. A guaranteed find gate , 3 initial clues, and at least one greater banishment really comes in handy over the course of the game. Especially considering that you're dealing with a large team, you should have better gate closing abilities, and he'll provide that.

Beating the first scenario really shouldn't be difficult, you can start off with Wendy, Yorick, Zoey, and Norman. If you don't spend Yorick's trophies at South Church (a frequent mistake— in my opinion, he's often better off with three starting clue tokens even if it means his focus is permanently one lower and he has reduced stats). Anyways, that's 13 clues and an Elder Sign as starting equipment (just among four of your characters). I.e. you start with enough resources to nearly seal five gates (if you move your characters properly, you'll have enough resources by. So if you blitz the gates, you shouldn't have trouble. You can always bless Yorick later, with whoever's the streetsweeper's (probably Zoey or Carolyn) monster trophies.

Did you go shopping for items at the Curiosity Shop? And why are you still using Amanda ;') two broke characters weren't enough?

I'm tempted to dismiss Diana as worthless in this scenario (low speed, low sneak, bad starting items, poor, can't stay at the Lodge because of Dracula). The only real benefit I'd see in playing her is a clue boost... But, as I said above, you really already *have* enough clues. If you played Jacqueline instead, you'd have a higher speed character (who starts somewhere useful) with more money, and better starting items (plus you'd have an ability to use once or twice in case of emergency).

P.S. Why would you close gates but not seal them? You should almost never do that because it means you have to invest three turns accomplishing no permanent game objectives. The only justification for that could possibly be preventing death by gate limit; however, you have enough investigators with clues to go for seals and not make a closing strat necessary. Also, if you're having a problem with too many gates, remember that one of Jaqueline's powers is being able to spend two clues and make a low frequency gate, or an out of Arkham gate (also relatively low frequency, and costly to go and deal with), just not appear.

P.P.S. are you aware that you can distract Dracula by use of Patrol Wagon, or Wendy's auto-dodge?

Anyways, the short story is I'm sad you guys are having trouble with the scenarios, and I hope you don't quit (persevere and become stronger!) I am playtesting these things, so no one should worry that they're impossible. It does sound like some of the character selection is being done on personal preferences, and not for strategic reasons, that's... A mistake. I'm really shocked that no one is using Norman Withers.

Do your players cooperate properly— item and money sharing for optimal strategies, and dividing labor? Or do you have any selfish players?

----

Hrm... Anyways... If your team keeps having trouble, let me know and I'll come up with a custom game modifier to make it easier (probably just allowing all investigators to carry over an item and not just four— although I think that causes major design problems and is quite exploitable).

Well, partially it is because we like to make games harder than they need to be. Seriously. We dislike playing Patrice and Hank just for that reason. And we've played the game so much that we like to play certain investigators either because a) we never play them or b) we are sentimental towards them. I almost always pick Joe Diamond because I am a Joe. My wife really likes Amanda, for some reason and she had to pick last both games we played.

I agree that Norman should have been picked, but we play the game for fun, and try to avoid meta situations. So we'll lose a few more games than we should. But that's fine we don't lose nearly as much as we used to, so it is good to be humbled.

Also, we generally play cooperatively, through occasionally someone will do something selfish (and certain players are more prone to this than others we do play at the store, so games are open to just about anyone who wants to play, though we have a regular groups of us friends who play).

As for Jacqueline, like I said earlier -- as we got deeper into the game, we had new gates opening every turn (and looking at the next few mythos cards, her ability wouldn't have helped us). We don't usually send people to the hospital if we can avoid it, and Amanda actualyl had some decent encounters at the General Store (since she spent her money the first turn there). What sucks is getting a mission when you really wanted a unique item. And the Esoteric Order of Dagon had four clues on it, mocking us, since we couldn't easily get there during the second half of the game (stupid fishmen patrolling Innsmouth).

Yeah, someone should have gotten the Patrol Wagon (Both Yorrick and I had at least 2 gates trophies) but it never occured to us to go there -- we were more interested in getting allies, but never had the chance. Yorrick did bless himself first turn, and he and Sister Mary never lost their blessings the entire game (which NEVER happened before). I was the only player to get a Curse from Death during the game, but Sister mary spent the Mummy token to Bless me and get rid of it (passing her story at the same time).

No, it was a decent game, we just didn't control it as well as we would have liked. And it cost us dear.

JerusalemJones said:

Heh... If you really wanted handicaps I could have made the entire investigator pool three movement characters ;')

I guess the one thing I'm concerned about is it sounds like some of your players were getting disheartened and are considering quitting (and I was thinking if they think it's hard now, dear god, they're going to be screaming bloody murder soon).

The investigator pools will be challenging enough (and no, at no time will Patrice or Hank be used). Heh... I still haven't heard a word of feedback on the second scenario from anyone (other than myself-- I thought it was hard!)

I'll be playtesting the third scenario soon. I'm looking forward to it (I've never used the custom components for it before), and while it's very convoluted, it should be challenging (and I want to write its plot).

Also, an early ally purchase isn't that useful for this investigator pool (since none of them can carry over their allies). There'll be one investigator with an ally in the second group of scenarios, the third group of scenarios, and the fourth group of scenarios though (I think).

The first scenario was designed to be relatively easy (well, by my definition of easy apparently), so that players would have a chance to stockpile some good items for scenario two (which is when the scenarios *really* start). Perhaps your players are underestimating the difficulty of these scenarios. They shouldn't :') This is no FFG league. They need to arm up, play hard, and lock and load. The closest thing each set of scenarios has to an easy scenario will be the first one of each series (but as you're seeing now, even the first scenario in a set is somewhat challenging).

I suggest your group try to make these games as easy as possible ;'D they still won't be easy. I guarantee it (when I look at the last scenario design, my blood runs cold and I am filled with a strange mixture of pleasure and panic).

In my game, I actually blocked a curse with Wendy's Elder sign :'D I was so happy when that happened.

Avi_dreader said:

We did the same.

JerusalemJones said:

::Laughter::

I'm tempted to say something about this, but I can restrain myself for a month ;') I think.

::Gulp:: I playtested the third scenario tonight... It was somewhat disasterous (although I think partially it was the result of my stupidity for not thinking through my strategy properly, and partially bad luck— I can't fully explain it without spoilers, first I got a gate on Jaqueline on the second turn (when I'd just gotten her four clues— then I got Mary devoured when she had more than half my money, and two of my best items on her)... All on the second turn. I decided to tweak the altered game parameter's a bit (not that that's what caused my disaster— it's just the more I thought about it, the more potentially problematic I decided an aspect of the scenario design was). It has an interesting corruption mechanic :') but you'll see it on Friday. I can think of several strategies teams could potentially play against this scenario, it's fairly complex (it might be one of the most complex in the entire twenty four), but I think it's fairly interesting, so, I hope you don't throw your boards at me for making it :')

I have to admit, I'm a little worried about the difficulty on this one... It almost feels like Quachill/Ghatanatoa mixed with Hastur and a short doom track. It's... Not though. It's very unpleasant... I like it :')

I'll weaken it a bit though— I'm worried about the instant devourings (I could get around it with my size team, but I'm worried it'd decimate an 8 player team extremely rapidly)... Heh... Okay, I've done something to fix it a bit :') I'll still be quite nasty, but not quite as immediately game ending for large teams.

@Jerusalem Jones

How are your games coming along? Have you made it to the second scenario yet?

Hrm... Okay, I just finished writing the bi-weekly story and playtested the third scenario and... I'm going to make it a little easier than I would have liked, but, eh, it should still be somewhat challenging (I'm throwing in an optional Visions as a starting item, I got it randomly with Jacqueline and thought it would be appropriate in terms of plot— and mechanically, I'm worried that the game might be a bit tough without it, it'd still be doable, but it would require a bit more luck than some people are comfortable with).

I hope you guys like corruptions :') because we're going to see some this Friday. I got five in my game. And it's very conceivable that you'll get into the red corruption pile (or burn though all the corruptions). It depends on how you play really.

Well, let see how it goes. I haven't played the first one yet. :-( But will do soon hopefully. :-)

amikezor said:

Heh :') well, the sooner the better (sure, why not).

I'm looking forward to showing next week's scenario mechanic. I think the abstraction principle behind it is fairly useful. Having something on the board that distributes things and has some negative penalty for removing it from the board.

The concrete example you'll see on Friday :') (or Thursday night really).

Sooo... I'm just curious... Is *anyone* up to schedule? If not, I can make the release tri-weekly (which would make it easier for me too).