12 minutes ago, Manolox said:

that having the possibility of bidding so deep doesen't mean that imperials aces are undercosted.

also if they are the only that can do it

bidding is usefull but how many time do you use a so deep bid?

i prefere filling it like duncan howard instead

Duncan "famous for running aces with no bid" Howard

22 minutes ago, Ablazoned said:

It seems pretty simple to me. It's an upside versus downside thing. Some people think the fact that Soontir can be very fragile, exemplified by the fact that he can "die in 1 shot," means that his cost should be discounted from the value he can offer when played well.

I mean, I've seen people fly soontir towards the same corner of the board my eight ships are going for. I've seen someone choose to not dodge 2 arcs "so he won't be stressed next turn.". Some of us can be so deep into the competitive mindset as to be appalled that someone would want to fly soontir like a fang fighter, and to price him accordingly. They're not wrong to enjoy that, but they're definitely wrong to want points to be balanced around it.

Agreed. Kitchen table X-Wing is fine, but the difference between a 52 and 58pt Soontir is basically meaningless to such a player and the type of player that these kinds of changes matter to are capable of putting the time in to learn to not suck with Soontir.

Also, the concept that you're durability is not increased by a greater ability to avoid shots entirely vexes me to no end.

Gonna get a tattoo of this:

If the bids are this deep, the ships are too cheap.

Aren’t most aces underpriced comparative to everything else in the game?

2 minutes ago, LagJanson said:

Aren’t most aces underpriced comparative to everything else in the game?

Just the imperial ones. All aces are under costed but some aces are more under costed than others, and their sacrifice next points update will not be forgotten.

Acelets- When will they ever learn?

Prompted by the mynock question of the day: here's a hypothesis - or, more aptly, my **** take of the day

People don't like i6 aces because they are more fun, they like them because they are less frustrating. That's maybe a small but important difference.

• You are less likely to be arc dodged. Nothing screams "noob, failure" as loudly in your face as losing a shot. It is one of the most unpleasant parts of the game.
  • That made turrets so popular in 1.0. Not that they are good or easy, but that they are less frustrating
  • Same with i6 double reposition aces, cards like passive sensors, or a phantom's candy cane
  • It probably also the reason why outmaneuver has always been my favorite ept. It's not just the equivalent of a mod, it is a statement thrown in your opponent's face: "I just outflew you because I'm better, and this is now my reward". Of course that reason is completely false. But i6 aces, turrets, outmaneuver, they are all very seductive.
• Aces traditionally rely on green dice for their defense. So if the inevitable blank out happens, it's not the fault of the player! Again, another one of the most unpleasant parts of the game. But this time it's actually desired! It's not your fault that you lost the game, it was the dice.
  • If there's one thing we love to blame for our failure, it's anyone but ourselves.
  • And even better if it is actually justified. Sometimes it's even true and you did take the right action, did dial in the correct move, rolled and boosted to the best spot. And still that 0.2% chance happened - poof, you lost the game. Not your fault. Disregard that this is probably less often the case than we'd like to think.

To sum up, i6 double repo aces, exemplified by none better than Soontir, give you a less frustrating game and a perfect excuse for losses.

4 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

To sum up, i6 double repo aces, exemplified by none better than Soontir, give you a less frustrating game and a perfect excuse for losses.

Or their name is Poe.

6 minutes ago, gennataos said:

Or their name is Poe.

Ouch! Sad reacts only

10 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

Prompted by the mynock question of the day: here's a hypothesis - or, more aptly, my **** take of the day

People don't like i6 aces because they are more fun, they like them because they are less frustrating. That's maybe a small but important difference.

• You are less likely to be arc dodged. Nothing screams "noob, failure" as loudly in your face as losing a shot. It is one of the most unpleasant parts of the game.
  • That made turrets so popular in 1.0. Not that they are good or easy, but that they are less frustrating
  • Same with i6 double reposition aces, cards like passive sensors, or a phantom's candy cane
  • It probably also the reason why outmaneuver has always been my favorite ept. It's not just the equivalent of a mod, it is a statement thrown in your opponent's face: "I just outflew you because I'm better, and this is now my reward". Of course that reason is completely false. But i6 aces, turrets, outmaneuver, they are all very seductive.

but i was told an ogp can arc dodge so its the same as soontir

10 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

• Aces traditionally rely on green dice for their defense. So if the inevitable blank out happens, it's not the fault of the player! Again, another one of the most unpleasant parts of the game. But this time it's actually desired! It's not your fault that you lost the game, it was the dice.
  • If there's one thing we love to blame for our failure, it's anyone but ourselves.
  • And even better if it is actually justified. Sometimes it's even true and you did take the right action, did dial in the correct move, rolled and boosted to the best spot. And still that 0.2% chance happened - poof, you lost the game. Not your fault. Disregard that this is probably less often the case than we'd like to think.

To sum up, i6 double repo aces, exemplified by none better than Soontir, give you a less frustrating game and a perfect excuse for losses.

15 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

Prompted by the mynock question of the day: here's a hypothesis - or, more aptly, my **** take of the day

People don't like i6 aces because they are more fun, they like them because they are less frustrating. That's maybe a small but important difference.

• You are less likely to be arc dodged. Nothing screams "noob, failure" as loudly in your face as losing a shot. It is one of the most unpleasant parts of the game.
  • That made turrets so popular in 1.0. Not that they are good or easy, but that they are less frustrating
  • Same with i6 double reposition aces, cards like passive sensors, or a phantom's candy cane
  • It probably also the reason why outmaneuver has always been my favorite ept. It's not just the equivalent of a mod, it is a statement thrown in your opponent's face: "I just outflew you because I'm better, and this is now my reward". Of course that reason is completely false. But i6 aces, turrets, outmaneuver, they are all very seductive.
• Aces traditionally rely on green dice for their defense. So if the inevitable blank out happens, it's not the fault of the player! Again, another one of the most unpleasant parts of the game. But this time it's actually desired! It's not your fault that you lost the game, it was the dice.
  • If there's one thing we love to blame for our failure, it's anyone but ourselves.
  • And even better if it is actually justified. Sometimes it's even true and you did take the right action, did dial in the correct move, rolled and boosted to the best spot. And still that 0.2% chance happened - poof, you lost the game. Not your fault. Disregard that this is probably less often the case than we'd like to think.

To sum up, i6 double repo aces, exemplified by none better than Soontir, give you a less frustrating game and a perfect excuse for losses.

22 minutes ago, jagsba said:

I had already written down MOBAs as example and scratched it again. IMO one reason it got so extremely popular, same for all those multiplayer shooters like COD and so on. It's never your fault.

8 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

I had already written down MOBAs as example and scratched it again. IMO one reason it got so extremely popular, same for all those multiplayer shooters like COD and so on. It's never your fault.

muh dice and muh teammates are same team

1 hour ago, Kaptin Krunch said:

Acelets- When will they ever learn?

I believe it's spelled 'ocelots'

1 hour ago, GreenDragoon said:

• • It probably also the reason why outmaneuver has always been my favorite ept. It's not just the equivalent of a mod, it is a statement thrown in your opponent's face: "I just outflew you because I'm better, and this is now my reward". Of course that reason is completely false. But i6 aces, turrets, outmaneuver, they are all very seductive.

I'm a long time Outmaneuver hater but had reason to run an Outmaneuver Soontir recently (it wasn't a traditional 200 point tournament and I had the points to play with) and I'm a convert (at least in the context of putting it on an under-priced arc-dodger I know will be moving last). It feels like kicking someone when they are down but oh man.

3 hours ago, Manolox said:

i prefere filling it like duncan howard instead

The Dunc.How. upgrade costs 20 points, so the bid is actually a lot less than that.

1 hour ago, gennataos said:

Or their name is Poe.

I'm still horribly confused as to whether Poe is actually costed correctly and there's simply THAT MUCH broken in the meta, or if he's overcosted in a Droid Swarm meta.

Halllp.

8 minutes ago, Bucknife said:

I'm still horribly confused as to whether Poe is actually costed correctly and there's simply THAT MUCH broken in the meta, or if he's overcosted in a Droid Swarm meta.

Halllp.

IMO a lot of stuff needs to go up before Poe comes down

3 minutes ago, RStan said:

IMO a lot of stuff needs to go up before Poe comes down

NERFS NOT BUFFS

5 hours ago, Boom Owl said:

Factions that are allowed to have a little 10-20+ pt Bid Trip Ace:

• Empire

Factions that are not allowed to have 10-20+ pt Bid Trip Ace:

• Rebels
• Republic
• Resistance
• Scum
• First Order
• Separatists

republic totally is allowed, you just have to drop regen

21 minutes ago, Bucknife said:

I'm still horribly confused as to whether Poe is actually costed correctly and there's simply THAT MUCH broken in the meta, or if he's overcosted in a Droid Swarm meta.

Halllp.

if you think it's vultures keeping Poe down, you haven't played against many other aces...

44 minutes ago, Bucknife said:

I'm still horribly confused as to whether Poe is actually costed correctly and there's simply THAT MUCH broken in the meta, or if he's overcosted in a Droid Swarm meta.

Halllp.

Poe is probably fine. You can fit him with 3 good A-Wings, which really should be a great list, but it's just a good list because to be great something has to be broken.

2 minutes ago, gennataos said:

Poe is probably fine. You can fit him with 3 good A-Wings, which really should be a great list, but it's just a good list because to be great something has to be broken.

Sounds like a bad list for me.

For certain definitions of bad.

40 minutes ago, jagsba said:

republic totally is allowed, you just have to drop regen

I was talking to future you not today you.
Thursday you. The you that will be mad about the vulture nerf.

46 minutes ago, RStan said:

IMO a lot of stuff needs to go up before Poe comes down

TROO! SAME TEAM!