where would the servants of twilight even recieve the power to summon Komus?

ThenDoctor said:

not sure what you mean with 'receive' and 'where'?

i mean what could the servants do to get the power to summon Komus, maybe like a "mark of the phaeonite" thing?

That, it does't say in DothDG. It's merely hinted at that they can. But the cult is not described in a more elaborate manner.

arent they hinted at in the beginning of the RH? i think i remember them using some sort of satelitte dish. its what made the assassain go mad.

ThenDoctor said:

That seemed to me more like Inquisitor Kalk and his Adeptus Mechanicus cronies trying to study the Tyrant Star, not so much call it.

ahh, we need sooo much more source material...even on one small little insignificant cult. pieces to the puzzle i guess.

I have been doing my own research into the Tyrant Star and it's safe to say that this is the greatest threat to the Calixis Sector and would have repercussions against the Imperium. I'm working on some fiction right now and my protagonist is near-obsessed with the TS. While I haven't gotten that far since I started from the beginning (The ceremony where he recieved the rosette) he's going to be living the exciting life of a member of the Tyrantine Cabal eventually.

As for the Hereticus Tenebrae I have found six important factions / groups related to it. The Tyrantine Cabal, Xanthites / Phaenonites, Servants of Twilight / Menagerie (I hope they don't start getting a bunch of teenage fans), the Ordo Chronos, the Slaugth and the Haarlock's. My overall guess as to what it is? It's definitely from the warp but it could easily be a creation / representation of Tzeentch. I wanted to find a connection to the Murder Room and the Tyrant Star but I don't see that happening any time soon. If isn't gimp / porno enough for Slaanesh and I don't see any links to Nurgle even though Malal may have something to do with it. The problem is that the Chaos Gods obviously act well like Gods. We never understand them. Throughout 40k we've kind of gotten used to the big bad omnipresent quadrio of evil and we know that the Spez Muhreenz are going to win regardless but maybe this is reinforcing how truely powerful the Dark Gods are.

Haarlock is tied up in some elaborate scheme involving Tzeentch, The Thousand Sons and his minions, and the Calixis Sector happens to be the focal point of all of this. Being a blind idiot, and a human for that matter, he fell into the trap and is now just a small piece of the puzzle. The Tyrantine Cabal obviously wants to know what the Tyrant Star is and I know a few want to harness it for their own purposes. The rest of the Inquisition has more important things to worry about and in true CIA fashion blow it off like it isn't a problem. You may have a few Inquisitors who are Ordoless and are doing their own investigations. I can see Xanthites being extremely interested in the Star but not dealing with the cabal and doing their own investigations. Same goes for the Phaenonites but for them it has to be much much much more difficult even if they've infilitrated other factions. They have to step very lightly and watch over their shoulders in everything they do or just operate completely solo. Without the resources of the cabal it will make it extremely difficult since that wealth of knowledge would be vital. (I can see a Phaenonite pulling an Ocean's 11/12/13 esque grimdark heist on Zerbe.) The Phaenonites are in conflict with the Slaugth due to the Amaranthine Syndicate and the Tyrant Star so they obviously know about each other. The problem is that both sides rely on smoke and mirrors so the shadow war can expose both. Both sides have gone to extreme lengths to maintain their cover but someone is going to caught out in the open. If the Phaenonites are it will negate all of their work over the past few centuries and if they are lucky enough to make it back in hiding they may run out of time.

The Servants of Twilight and Menagerie are the two mystery cults operating within the Calixis Sector but I see them more as not even pawns. Haarlock is a pawn but they are just specks of dust most likely. Naturally they want to serve their master, the giant bird dude in the warp, and want to use the Tyrant Star to their own advantage. But even though they say they do, they don't realize that they have little to zero importance. It's simple actually. While the Inquisition is investigating the cults another group can operate away from their gaze or agents of Tzeentch can fufill the plots without having Ordo interference. They are simply decoys and more S&M (No not that kind of stuff. Smoke and Mirrors).

Now the Ordo Chronos is something I'm extremely interested in. I'm going out on a limb here saying that Silas Marr, the human version of Tzeentch, is a part of the Ordo Chronos. He would obviously be another pawn of Tzeentch but still he is an important player. The Ordo that he belongs to is classified to even the highest level of clearance. In all of the reports and documents forwarded, from or related to him the Ordo is always classified. If he didn't belong to an Ordo they wouldn't even bother putting on there. But I can definitely see him being in the Ordo Chronos. It's much smaller than the Sepulturum and is probably made up of only 5-6 Inquisitors. Most of them, with the exception of Marr, went back in time to deal with Haarlock. Didn't Marr disappear again? I know he doesn't appear since he's always behind the scenes but I'm sure with that uber-extensive network of contacts, acolytes and resources that his investigations continue even without him being in the same era for a few centuries. His people are busy dealing with the present and he goes back in time to continue the hunt for Haarlock and the truth behind the Tyrant Star. (I can imagine Clint Eastwood / Sean Connery playing him in a movie. Think one of them travelling back in time with a badass convertable version of Ravenor's chair.)

To sum it up I think that the Tyrant Star is directly related to Tzeentch. At the most it's a manifestation of his power but at least it's something to do with him. Worst case scenario? It's something completely different and not even the big four understand what it is.

Maybe Malal wants to get payback on Slaanesh, Khorne, Tzeentch and Nurgle? Wasn't it at one point even more powerful than the four combined? Maybe after a quadriglinionbilliontrillion years he's built up enough power to fight them and this is simply a tiny after-effect of that titanic struggle bleeding off into real-time. If something like this started popping up in different sectors across the Imperium and not just Calixis, Ixaniad and Scarus it would definitely mean something huge is going in the Warp. At first I thought it had something to do with some Xenos race. But even that ancient war against the Children of the Kingdom (I'm guessing it's them. Inquisition / Spez Muhreenz vs. those pale warp monster things coming out some kind of strange warp anomoly.) goes back to the warp. Xenos are horrific but they aren't THAT horrific.

I also forgot the C'Tan but frankly I don't even want to think about them. They are technically Xenos right? I'll have to look at the names but isn't there something similiar to The Deceiver, Nightbringer, Void Dragon and Outsider related to Haarlock and the Star?

well now that we've seen Knowledge is Power i really do hope they don't dump the Haarlock Legacy for this new demon arm...thing...hopefully it will be tied in loosely. Anyone else thinking the arm will be useful for controling the tesseract?

ThenDoctor said:

I think both trilogies will be totally unrelated to each other. The Apostasy Gambit will not tie in to the Haarlock Legacy, and neither do I think that it should. What happens after Mara is up to the GMs of Dark Heresy to decide, or we'll have to wait for a Haarlock's Doom trilogy

The Laughing God said:

A very good point and one that rises an interesting question - if the players decide not to stop Haarlock's return then what has walked back into our universe from the Tyrant Star? It wears his face but is it also driven by his will? That would make things very interesting, a powerful man/thing/demon who is still desperate to alter time, but now, just maybe, has the knowledge to do it?

And how would you go about writing him up as an NPC?

DW

time manipulation powers from ascention/Lord of change profile with dark pact concealing powers and the power to the haarlocks line of resources

Traveller61 said:

I think there is a reason why there are no stats for him in Dead Stars

He must be insanely powerful. He has the knowledge and skill to entrap daemons, construct terrible clockwork devices, commands the allegiance of what's left of the Haarlock servants and the resources of his line, plus he must somehow be changed after his time out of time ... (btw it would kind of ruin the sense of dread and malice if he was given stats .. seems so plumb, so ordinary ... making him just another monster)

I wouldn't consider him a daemon, although there is still that tidbit of fluff of the Seven Devils of Calyxis (Radical's Handbook IIRC) which mentions the Night Traveller aka the herald as one of the daemons. Maybe Haarlock is on par with them now he is back in our time flow.

In Dead Stars it's suggested that if Haarlock returns, the opposition mounted against him makes that the Calixis Sector does not fall to the fractionalism and infighting that would have made them easy prey for the designs of the Slaugth. So the choice is between the herald and the worms that walk, one of them will dominate the sector ...

for once i would rather have haarlock win out than the slaugh

i know this is a pretty loose kinda sketchy connection but im trying so just bear with me. if the apostasy gambit is an ascention level adventure then it may be connected to the haarlock legacy in that in Dead Stars one of the futures was everyone turning to chaos (happened if you let haarlock back into the calaxis) the imperial priest mentions him not dying without religion like everyone else that lost faith

ThenDoctor said:

why are you so sure the new trilogy must take off where the old one left off? I do not think it's going to be like that. I am counting on a completely new story arc.

And what exactly did which imperial priest say? Not sure I get it.

Now its all out there, John and I are very glad people seemed to have enjoyed it for the main.

Thanks all.

Alan Bligh

Finally I received, and bought, my copy of Dead Stars.

After read it, and the comments of this forum, it seems that the return of Haarlock can be good or bad. But, personally, as GMs, what do you think? If Haarlock can return, are you going to play it as good or as bad?

I asked it because I'm undecided. I think that I will play it as neutral with its own agenda. Neither good or bad, unless that you are in its way.

Kinai.

hmm, it depends, if the pcs goal was to bring haarlock back then i would play it as good heck id even turn it into a RT campaign with haarlock reclaiming his ship and going to the dread stars to reclaim old evil machines for taking out the slaughth

The_Bligh said:

Still have to run it as GM for my players, but enjoyed reading it very much Alan! But you got to reveal one more thing .. what is that mystifying little gesture, that sign with forefinger and thumb around the eye that both Haarlock and his navigator make?

That one gives me sleepless nights!

signifies the eye haarlock lost?

a navigators eye?

the tyrant star?

and "ok" sign???

Kinai said:

IIRC the return of Haarlock means he will be a tyrant in the sector, but it's left intentionally vague exactly what the Herald is going to do. If he is stopped, the Ordo Calixis will not have him as a great enemy to unify against, fall apart in bickering factionalism and thus become ripe for the picking for the Slaugth who enslave the entire sector and feast on its inhabitants.

I'd welcome Haarlock back with open arms

The Laughing God said:

Its very similar to the 'Be Seeing You' gesture from The Prisoner. If ever there was an obscure, paranoic source for a gesture designed to get under your skin, then thats it.