Actually, Mak could have 1 more health, but that's it. In Spy lists he is abolutely OK.

Somos just needs better Troopers. The Jet Troopers are high mobility, he is not. The Heavys are just not good enough for him to be worth it.

Why does FFG shy away from having packs of just cards?

Imperial Assault Core Rules Upgrade Pack - Contains all the updated cards....

Easy done, doesn't need miniature manufacturing and delays etc.

On 1/26/2017 at 4:29 PM, Asvaldr said:

I think your Somos and Sorin changes don't change a thing, they're still terrible.

We have a phrase called "Somos Syndrome", its when your an overpriced character with terrible surges.

Compare Somos to Leia for cost and utility. Personally i think Leia is super broken, at the very least her military efficiency should be 2 surge cost. (Side track)

SOMOS

Somos NEEDs a point reduction. But staying with your theme of "don't reduce points".

Assumming advance comms is an auto include (more on that in a second); I agree, he doesn't need to buff troopers anymore than he does.

Honestly i think advanced comms should be built into his card at no cost and NOT take up an attachment slot.

Where Somos needs help for his points cost is his surges and defense. Look at ObiWan, Leigh, Luke, Shyla, Bossk etc. They all have innate defense.

If shyla is at 8pts and 12hp and can pull in targets from 3 range. Somos should probably at least have +1SurgeEvade and (maybe......... +1block)

Even though advanced comms exists..... it shouldn't. It makes his rules over complicated because it all should be innate in his card and he should still be able to take another attachment.

So in summary, without doing any play testing i'm thinking for your "no points reduction"

Surges- His surges change from +1dmg to +2Dmg, Pierce 1 to Pierce 2.

Abilities - replace adjacent with "friendly troopers within 3 spaces". This should also change on his command card.

Innate Defense: +1 surge block (perhaps also +1 block should be looked at if no points drop; depending on play testing and comparison to Luke, Leia, Shyla, Obiwan, Bossk, Verena Talos, Han, Jyn,)

Comparing him to those other characters i still believe i'm being conservative. He probably should get all the stuff suggested above and be 9 pts.

SORIN

Sorin is no use with jet troopers. Sorins weakness has always been that he has to be close (formerly adjacent) to the figures he's buffing; his other weakness is that he dies really easily. His not a frontline commander and should be at the back. A jet trooper had to be within 2 spaces to be effective. So therefore if somos helps one jet trooper, he likely will die. Therefore, the pairing is useless.

Advanced comms, should literally be Advanced Comms. It should change the "within 2 spaces" to "within line of sight".

So i think either, advanced comms gets changes to "line of sight" or on sorins card and command cards it, replace adjacent with "Line of Sight".

I think you're right that more needs to be done to Somos/Sorin. I was going by that survey, which had Somos/Sorin rated as "slightly overcosted", so I didn't want to do much more to them. But reading your argument convinces me that they need a fuller rework. Maybe I can find something to keep them from being "Super Awesome Elite Imperial Officers".

On 2/1/2017 at 8:04 PM, Asvaldr said:

Why does FFG shy away from having packs of just cards?

Imperial Assault Core Rules Upgrade Pack - Contains all the updated cards....

Easy done, doesn't need miniature manufacturing and delays etc.

That would be convenient. But I can understand why they'd spread out errata attachment cards across the different packs: gives folks who wouldn't normally buy that Jawa pack now would, and it makes FFG more money. If they make more money from us, they will pump more money into making the game last longer. And it's kinda nice to feed the designers, artists, etc. who put all the work into this game.

v0.4 is now ready for your review . I've tried to make each new skirmish upgrade card a bit more potent than before.

v0.5 is now available . I got some good feedback on reddit about how my changes were a bit too much. So I scaled things back a bit. Somos & Sorin still get a built-in Advanced Coms. Finn is closer to being actually viable now and I LOVE my Darth Vader & AT-ST changes.

Overall nice changes. I actually think they might try to fix several deployments in 1 go.
What I was thinking was a card in the Endor set like this:

Overwatch (1) - elite attachment (so max 2 per list)
Vehicle and E-Web Engineer only
+2 HP
When another figure moves into a space to which you have Line of Sight, you may interrupt and become weakened, then, perform an attack.
Limit once per round.

This gives all the Deployment cards involved (AT-ST, Tank, E-Webs) a free attack, and while the enemy is activating.
It is very powerfull, so that is why you become weakened (even before you attack), if they live and fire back, they have an easier shot AND of course you are weakened until you have activated.
Card can be further balanced with increased cost if needed (I think the 2HP is needed to add survivability to all deployment cards mentioned)
I feel it is also thematic in that these guys should wait until something comes into their scopes and try to blast it to smithereens.
So that if my idea: 1 card to fix all those guys in one fell swoop, put 2 of them in the Endor Box, done!

You should say large vechikes otherwise Jets can use it and gives many units extra HP

Good point! I actually had Massive in mind (that leaves room for more large vehicles not being able to use it, and I do expect speeder scouts in the inevitable Endor box as 2x1 base vehicle units) but forgot to write it in the post!

Had a thought about Boba - what if you just gave him Vinto's Rapid Fire ability (1 action, perform two attacks)? Then I realized it's actually Jango who dual wields blasters, so that doesn't make as much sense...

But maybe just give him the equivalent, like your flamethrower idea. You could honestly probably just give him the Flamethrower ability from Capatin Terro's card, but just remove the action cost. That probably gives him the action efficiency he needs to be 13 points. Then maybe just remove Battle Presence and ~: Weaken, Give him a flat +2 accuracy, and add a different option (maybe ~: Blast 1? Or an auto -1 Dodge?) to Battle Discipline. Then he's a jet-packing, flame-throwing, laser-spewing beast, just like in the mov-...

Books. Just like in the books.

On 3/9/2017 at 3:29 PM, Soulflame said:

Overall nice changes. I actually think they might try to fix several deployments in 1 go.
What I was thinking was a card in the Endor set like this:

Overwatch (1) - elite attachment (so max 2 per list)
Vehicle and E-Web Engineer only
+2 HP
When another figure moves into a space to which you have Line of Sight, you may interrupt and become weakened, then, perform an attack.
Limit once per round.

This gives all the Deployment cards involved (AT-ST, Tank, E-Webs) a free attack, and while the enemy is activating.
It is very powerfull, so that is why you become weakened (even before you attack), if they live and fire back, they have an easier shot AND of course you are weakened until you have activated.
Card can be further balanced with increased cost if needed (I think the 2HP is needed to add survivability to all deployment cards mentioned)
I feel it is also thematic in that these guys should wait until something comes into their scopes and try to blast it to smithereens.
So that if my idea: 1 card to fix all those guys in one fell swoop, put 2 of them in the Endor Box, done!

I like this idea of combining all the vehicle fixes into one card. I ended up taking my AT-ST/General Weiss fixes and my SCM-2 Tank fixes and merged them into one upgrade card. I just think Elite E-Web Engineers need so much more done to them to make them even worth sniffing a table.

Version 0.6 is now available for your viewing pleasure . As always, your feedback is most welcome.

The big change is that I am now applying negative deployment costs for some units.

I also threw together a few neutral skirmish upgrade/attachment cards to put non-Unique Trooper groups back into the game. Those I'm very interested in seeing some feedback about.

Just to spur up a bit more discussion about the forthcoming Skirmish Attachment cards, here's what my versions of Chewbacca, Han Solo, & Boba Fett look like. I also have a combined upgrade card fix that works for AT-ST, General Weiss and the SCM-2 Repulsor Tank.

Quote

Chewbacca (Cost: 15)

Like Vader, Chewbacca needs a reduction in deployment cost to make him fit better into the current skirmish game. Reducing his cost means his abilities should be modified a bit to keep him from being too strong for 12 points -- the same cost as Jedi Knight Luke. Chewie should feel like Chewie - dangerous in close range, with a huge-hitting Bowcaster.

Unique Skirmish Attachment Card: Wookie Champion (Chewbacca only)

Cost: -3

You lose "Protector". You gain "SURGE: Blast 1 DMG".

Bowcaster Scope: When you declare an attack, you become Focused.

Explosive Bolts: You may apply Blast damage to hostile figures up to 2 spaces away from your target.

Quote

Han Solo (Cost: 12)

Han's big problem is his Return Fire ability relies too heavily on a poor play by your opponent or rolling DODGEs. If Return Fire is to be used more than once a round, we run the risk of Han being way too powerful, especially against low-figure-cost units. A unique solution would to add an additional chance for Han to roll a DODGE, which also increases his survivability. Even with reducing his cost, he should also benefit from a free attack and an increase in health.

Unique Skirmish Attachment Card: Who's Scruffy-Looking? (Han Solo only)

Cost: -2

Increase Health +2. You lose "Distracting".

Never Tell Me The Odds: When defending, if you roll a blank result, roll one additional white die and add it to your defense results. Limit one additional die per attack.

Heroic: During your activation, you may perform one attack without spending an action.

Quote

AT-ST (Cost: 14), General Weiss (Cost: 16), SCM-2 Repulsor Tank (Cost: 10)

Unless binded with several Elite Imp. Officers, the AT-ST, SCM-2 & General Weiss are huge walking targets with only one big shot per turn. They also take up too much space in an army's deployment cost -- a reduction is necessary. A free attack that is not as powerful or as far-reaching as the primary attack would encourage players to get the AT-ST in the battle quickly. A surge-based attack on adjacent hostile figures allows the vehicles to not depend so much on smaller escorts.

Unique Elite Skirmish Upgrade Card: Imperial Retrofitting

Cost: 0

Apply the following to each AT-ST, SCM-2 and General Weiss figures in your army:

Reduce the deployment cost for each AT-ST & General Weiss by 3, SCM-2 Repulsor Tank by 2.

Secondary Cannons: Once during your activation, you may perform an attack using one blue and one red die without spending an action.

You gain "SURGE: Flatten - Choose up to two adjacent hostile figures. Each figure suffers 1 DMG."

Quote

Boba Fett (Cost: 13)

Boba Fett would benefit from a 2-point cost reduction. Instead the goal should be making him the very best Hunter in the game. Increasing his Health gives him more time on the gameboard to influence the outcome. Giving him more Battle Discipline options during his attack will allow players to feel they are playing with the most versatile Hunter available.

Unique Skirmish Upgrade Card: Mandalorian Arsenal (Boba Fett only) Cost: 0

You lose Battle Presence.

When you use Battle Discipline, you can choose 2 of the listed abilities for your attack. Add the following abilities to your Battle Discipline list: SURGE: Blast +1 DMG | SURGE: +1 STRAIN | SURGE: Bleed | SURGE: -2 Accuracy, +2 DMG

Infamous: During your activation, you may perform one attack without spending an action.

I think there's a real sort of beauty in the very simple (ie. short) fixes. For example, with troopers, I would suggest something that fixes one of the big problems for them in skirmish:

There's too many of them (unique attachment for any trooper squad)

When the first figure in this group is defeated ( alternatively, if you want it to work with Reinforcements: When a figure in this groups is defeated, if this group is at full strength), your opponent does not score victory points for defeating it.

OR

When a figure in this group is defeated, your opponent scores 1 less victory point for defeating it.

On 1/6/2017 at 0:39 PM, ThatJakeGuy said:

Price reductions are the lazy way out, I think. I much prefer buffing units to be worth the price you pay.

I agree. It makes it more interesting than just making them cheaper. I also like when they used an action or ability that someone else has. Could they give Han "heroic" for example? Luke gets an extra attack for free, why not Han?

6 hours ago, cnemmick said:

Version 0.6 is now available for your viewing pleasure . As always, your feedback is most welcome.

The big change is that I am now applying negative deployment costs for some units.

I also threw together a few neutral skirmish upgrade/attachment cards to put non-Unique Trooper groups back into the game. Those I'm very interested in seeing some feedback about.

Just to spur up a bit more discussion about the forthcoming Skirmish Attachment cards, here's what my versions of Chewbacca, Han Solo, & Boba Fett look like. I also have a combined upgrade card fix that works for AT-ST, General Weiss and the SCM-2 Repulsor Tank.

Some cool ideas.

On 5/22/2017 at 11:44 PM, Stompburger said:

Had a thought about Boba - what if you just gave him Vinto's Rapid Fire ability (1 action, perform two attacks)? Then I realized it's actually Jango who dual wields blasters, so that doesn't make as much sense...

But maybe just give him the equivalent, like your flamethrower idea. You could honestly probably just give him the Flamethrower ability from Capatin Terro's card, but just remove the action cost. That probably gives him the action efficiency he needs to be 13 points. Then maybe just remove Battle Presence and ~: Weaken, Give him a flat +2 accuracy, and add a different option (maybe ~: Blast 1? Or an auto -1 Dodge?) to Battle Discipline. Then he's a jet-packing, flame-throwing, laser-spewing beast, just like in the mov-...

Books. Just like in the books.

I think in one of my previous versions of the document, I had done exactly what you suggested - added Terro's Flamethrower ability. As a free action I thought it was way too powerful, even for 13-point cost Boba. Dishing out that kind of unavoidable damage and strain nearly every round really stacks up.

As a special action, the Flamethrower basically ensured Boba would favor it over actually attacking. (Even improving his Battle Discipline options didn't make a regular attack more viable than Weakening targets for the Weequays.) Giving Boba additional movement points on activation seemed silly for a figure with a Speed of 6.

I also previously tinkered with removing Battle Discipline completely and replacing it with a Special Action weaker version of Flamethrower, a Special Action missle attack w/ Blast that could not be used closer than 4 spaces away from Boba, and a Special Action whip attack that negated all damage to do Stun & Weaken.

29 minutes ago, cnemmick said:

I think in one of my previous versions of the document, I had done exactly what you suggested - added Terro's Flamethrower ability. As a free action I thought it was way too powerful, even for 13-point cost Boba. Dishing out that kind of unavoidable damage and strain nearly every round really stacks up.

As a special action, the Flamethrower basically ensured Boba would favor it over actually attacking. (Even improving his Battle Discipline options didn't make a regular attack more viable than Weakening targets for the Weequays.) Giving Boba additional movement points on activation seemed silly for a figure with a Speed of 6.

I also previously tinkered with removing Battle Discipline completely and replacing it with a Special Action weaker version of Flamethrower, a Special Action missle attack w/ Blast that could not be used closer than 4 spaces away from Boba, and a Special Action whip attack that negated all damage to do Stun & Weaken.

Well, if the full Flamethrower is too powerful for no action, maybe you could make it a little weaker. You could use a die roll like the Shock Lance/Indiscriminate Fire, or do something like:

Wrist Flamethrower: Once during your activation, you may choose a space within 3 spaces. Choose up to 2 figures on or adjacent to that space; each of those figures suffers 1 Damage and 1 Strain, and become weakened.

8 minutes ago, Stompburger said:

Well, if the full Flamethrower is too powerful for no action, maybe you could make it a little weaker. You could use a die roll like the Shock Lance/Indiscriminate Fire, or do something like:

Wrist Flamethrower: Once during your activation, you may choose a space within 3 spaces. Choose up to 2 figures on or adjacent to that space; each of those figures suffers 1 Damage and 1 Strain, and become weakened.

I'd do something like give him a free movement each turn and a new special action: Wrist Cable: Stun an enemy figure.

5 hours ago, cnemmick said:

I think in one of my previous versions of the document, I had done exactly what you suggested - added Terro's Flamethrower ability. As a free action I thought it was way too powerful, even for 13-point cost Boba. Dishing out that kind of unavoidable damage and strain nearly every round really stacks up.

As a special action, the Flamethrower basically ensured Boba would favor it over actually attacking. (Even improving his Battle Discipline options didn't make a regular attack more viable than Weakening targets for the Weequays.) Giving Boba additional movement points on activation seemed silly for a figure with a Speed of 6.

I also previously tinkered with removing Battle Discipline completely and replacing it with a Special Action weaker version of Flamethrower, a Special Action missle attack w/ Blast that could not be used closer than 4 spaces away from Boba, and a Special Action whip attack that negated all damage to do Stun & Weaken.

You can't remove battle discipline cause his command cards is built in.

I think the better way is improve battle discipline with some blast and damage. Perhaps need a built in damage losing another one, like weaken.

Adding a special action flamethrower that allow him to gain 3 movement points and cause damage all in the same action. You have action economy and good damage per attack. He can move 3, cause 1 or 2 damage and then attack with better surges.

I think free flamethrower isn't op for a 13 point figure. We have vader with his free chocke that causes more damage without range limitations.

On 5/26/2017 at 7:01 PM, naitsirk said:

You can't remove battle discipline cause his command cards is built in.

I think the better way is improve battle discipline with some blast and damage. Perhaps need a built in damage losing another one, like weaken.

Adding a special action flamethrower that allow him to gain 3 movement points and cause damage all in the same action. You have action economy and good damage per attack. He can move 3, cause 1 or 2 damage and then attack with better surges.

I think free flamethrower isn't op for a 13 point figure. We have vader with his free chocke that causes more damage without range limitations.

Yeah 13 points is a ton. You can (and need to) fit a lot of power into a figure if it costs 13 points. So giving him the free flamethrower is probably fine.

I think for Battle Discipline/attack changes:

1. Replace ~: Weaken with the ~: +2 Damage from Battle Discipline (just give him a decent attack without Battle Discipline; he's Boba Fett for crying out loud, he should have a good attack without jumping through hoops)
2. Have the Battle Discipline options be more interesting and make it a more meaningful choice. How about +3 accuracy, ~: Blast 1, and ~: -1 Dodge. Then he can actually adapt to whatever he's shooting at instead of just picking the same one every time because otherwise his attack won't deal damage.

@buckero0 Your comment in the other post gave me a Boba Thought (tm):

Quote

Unique Skirmish Attachment: Mandalorian Arsenal (Boba Fett only)

Cost: 0

You lose Battle Presence and "SURGE: Weaken". When you use Battle Discipline, choose up to 2 of the listed abilities for your attack. Add the following abilities to your Battle Discipline list:

SURGE: Flamethrower - Choose a space within 2 spaces. Figures on or adjacent to this space suffer 1 STRAIN and become Weakened.

SURGE: Wrist Rocket - Choose a hostile figure within 4 space. That figure suffers 2 DMG. Then push the figure up to 2 spaces.

SURGE: Wrist Cable - Choose an adjacent hostile figure. That figure loses all Beneficial conditions then becomes Stunned.

So this gives Boba essentially three choices for a secondary damage abilities -- and you can choose to do ANY TWO OF THESE in one attack. It also defines abilities that are iconic for Boba... and this is probably so wordy that it won't fit on a **** Skirmish Attachment Card BUT WE'RE GONNA TRY IT ANYWAYS.

Yeah, his Flamethrower is not as strong as Terro's. He's triggering it as a SURGE ability and can do another SURGE abilities to the targets of it.

Wrist Rocket basically gives him a +2 DMG boost to his primary weapon target.

And this Boba Focused & using his Command card? DEATH BLOSSOM!!!!!

It is very, very likely this Boba is OP. Care to test?

I like the list - its certainly much better than what his current card is. I would prefer that he had an extra special ability action vs just tacking on more surges to his current attack though. But this certainly would buff his current attack nicely.

Out of everything listed, I love the "loses all Beneficial conditions and is stunned" touch. That would be perfect! Nothing is worse than losing your focus

7 minutes ago, totalnoob said:

I like the list - its certainly much better than what his current card is. I would prefer that he had an extra special ability action vs just tacking on more surges to his current attack though. But this certainly would buff his current attack nicely.

Keep in mind that these surge abilities allow you to target figures *other than the figure Boba just attacked*. So you could use Wrist Rocket on the target of the attack, or you could use it on another figure within range.

I wrote them specifically to be Special Action-like. This is a very different solution than the Terror/IG-88 solution of "free movement points at the start of your turn". Boba has a Speed of 6 -- this is very unique and should be available for Boba every turn.

21 hours ago, cnemmick said:

@buckero0 Your comment in the other post gave me a Boba Thought (tm):

So this gives Boba essentially three choices for a secondary damage abilities -- and you can choose to do ANY TWO OF THESE in one attack. It also defines abilities that are iconic for Boba... and this is probably so wordy that it won't fit on a **** Skirmish Attachment Card BUT WE'RE GONNA TRY IT ANYWAYS.

Yeah, his Flamethrower is not as strong as Terro's. He's triggering it as a SURGE ability and can do another SURGE abilities to the targets of it.

Wrist Rocket basically gives him a +2 DMG boost to his primary weapon target.

And this Boba Focused & using his Command card? DEATH BLOSSOM!!!!!

It is very, very likely this Boba is OP. Care to test?

Look awesome... but keep in mind his command card (2 attack with +1surge and using all battle discipline). It sounds to me like a auto win "this guy that would keep the objetive, take a wirst rocket and get out; you will attack in your next activation with focus? Come on you are stunned now madafakaaaa!" Sounds hilarius yes, but the oponent will cry after this.

Also if you add jabba to the ecuation, focus boba + extra attack. The hell for boba's enemies.

Sorry for the novel, I've been pondering my Boba fix for awhile. I've had fun reading The wrist rocket and other fixes presented for Boba in this thread. Here is my idea.

Because of Mandalorian tactics, we know the Battle Discipline skills are still going to be integral to Boba. I think his fix is most likely going to come from an adjustment to those skills.

He has to have a 1 point cost reduction, because he can't cost the same as Vader and IG can't be better than him. 12 is his cost.

My 'fixed' Boba would keep his defense and mobile. Then I'd move the +2 accuracy from BD to be an inherent skill. I'd give him normal surge skills of pierce 2, and 1 damage. My new battle discipline skills would be surge to damage+weaken, surge for 2 damage, and a 'fell swoop' like ability I'll call 'off-hand blaster' to use 2 surges to trigger 2 movement and another attack. No skills from BD would apply to the second attack.

I don't like Battle presence, so I'd replace that with a skill similar to guerilla from the rangers. Let's call it Adrenaline Amplifier: collect a surge power token when you defeat a hostile figure.

With my Boba, you essentially then have to make the choice between an attack with up to 3 extra damage from 2 surges against having 2 crowd control style attacks from very good range. I think it's important not to make him overpowered. Luke's average attack is 4-5 damage and he has to be adjacent to do that.

I think this combination of things puts Mandalorian tactics right in line with Son of Skywalker and blaze of glory. Boba would potentially get 2 attacks with good damage potential and a couple of crowd control shots. Having a couple of power tokens available will really help to make sure you get the most out of Mandalorian Tactics.

I hereby give FFG rights to use any of these ideas for a future imperial assault Boba Fett skirmish attachment card. Thanks.