Title should have ended with ''skills 'n stuff.''

Ok I'm the FNG here so I have some typical dumb FNG questions.

First off I did download the errata and read it. Wow, the weapons stats got really changed, bolter damage way down, some other damage way up. I read some comments on this and it seemed that the consensus was that bolters were too powerful especially with righteous fury as written, and people were oneshotting hive tyrants with bolters. Someone else said that without special ammo stock bolters couldn't drop half the stuff in the game.

Ok, so I thought about this and came up with a few conclusions i humbly submit to my more learned fellow members of this board:

The standard bolt gun was designed about M31 to found the imperium and arm original space marines. As such it was meant to be a devastating weapon against most common foes the new imperium faced, like human rebels, orks, eldar and the like. It was also a standard issue infantry weapon meant to deal with other infantry. As such it remains effective against what it was meant to affect. It wasn't really meant to kill things like Major daemons and larger tyranids as tyranids were unknown in M31. Even so the bolter is quite effective against a lot of tyranid troops which is a testament to it's fundamental design quality. Note massed bolter fire or very lucky shots can bring down some larger 'nids like warriors.

The bolter can still be useful against a hella lot of more powerful enemies if armed with special ammo, again it's ability to accept special ammo is a testament to it's basic design value. It says a lot about the standard bolter that it is still effective and can accept special ammo to make it able to punch way above the original design's weight class. So I don't see much wrong with the changes made to keep it from one shotting things it really shouldn't barring a really exceptional hit. My decision is to go with the errata stats, does my logic seem sound? So the arguments like "A bolter without special ammo can't stop a XXXX' seem invalid as if you think you're going to be facing a XXXX bring the special ammo!

As to the bolter losing full auto, yes I see that as a valid modification, as the modern M-16 can fire 3rbs but not full auto in standard issue. Bolts are hard and expensive to make and limited numbers can be carried, a marine needs to aim and hit instead of spray and pray, altho spray and pray works for guardsmen and lasguns given their ammo situation. So I go with the errata there to.

I see some special weapons got nastier, like flamers and plasma guns. I like this as they have limitations, costs or risks that make them unacceptable as standard arms but worth making and using in limited numbers. Again, I have no issue with the errata here. Am I making sense?

Now I have a non errata issue. Skills. Ok I get that space marines are recruited as kids and most of their skills with be standard issue, so you don't get a whole lot of flexibility at first. But I was wondering about some things that should be simple opr easy to do but I can't see how to do them. Suppose I have a techmarine and I want to buy up his evaluate skill during chargen to make him good at attacking installations by finding weak spots. It seems if I'm reading it right he can't buy up evaluate until he's like rank 3 or 4. Is this right?

Also on the character sheets, both hardcopy and downloadable, some skills are filled in, of course, but I notice something. In some cases the current rank if above one is filled in along with the ranks below it, in others only the higher rank is filled in. Is there any significance to this?

Given the mass of deathwatch and the errata i'll have more questions I suppose later on, but for now these are the main ones. I think I'll stick with the errata rules as they seem more conducive to roleplaying and not just blast and burn, and I do need a litle explanation on the skills rules as they seem to make it very hard to inprove what seem routine skills until one reaches a high overall rank.

Errata weapon stats (less dices / more bonuses) make GM's life a lot easier when you start to calculate damage, especially against Hordes.

Errata weapon stats (less dices / more bonuses) make GM's life a lot easier when you start to calculate damage, especially against Hordes.

OK you mean bonuses to damage? So it's more like a fixed number with fewer die results to add them add to the bonus?

Yes. For example, Corebook bolters: 2d10+5 - if Horde TB is more than 7 you must roll. Errata: 1d10+9 - you need to roll only for TB 11+ enemies and even if you must roll, you'll need only half as much dices.

The skill boxes are for basic and trained. Some skills are so simple anyone can do them without training at 1/2 the proscribed stat. If the marine later gets training in that skill he may now use it at the full stat level. Basic skills are listed on pg 93. Everyone gets them. I think the character sheet has boxes for all levels (basic, trained, +10, +20). The skills with only the second box filled in are not basic skills, but advanced skills that require training to use. Any training in skill results in being able to use it at stat level, so skips the basic level completely.

Now I have a non errata issue. Skills. Ok I get that space marines are recruited as kids and most of their skills with be standard issue, so you don't get a whole lot of flexibility at first. But I was wondering about some things that should be simple opr easy to do but I can't see how to do them. Suppose I have a techmarine and I want to buy up his evaluate skill during chargen to make him good at attacking installations by finding weak spots. It seems if I'm reading it right he can't buy up evaluate until he's like rank 3 or 4. Is this right?

Yes, that's right. Except Chapter grants him access as well (not sure if any does). If you're not happy with the advancement system, you might want to have a look into the only war conversion someone on the forum wrote.

The skill boxes are for basic and trained. Some skills are so simple anyone can do them without training at 1/2 the proscribed stat. If the marine later gets training in that skill he may now use it at the full stat level. Basic skills are listed on pg 93. Everyone gets them. I think the character sheet has boxes for all levels (basic, trained, +10, +20). The skills with only the second box filled in are not basic skills, but advanced skills that require training to use. Any training in skill results in being able to use it at stat level, so skips the basic level completely.

The skill boxes are for basic and trained. Some skills are so simple anyone can do them without training at 1/2 the proscribed stat. If the marine later gets training in that skill he may now use it at the full stat level. Basic skills are listed on pg 93. Everyone gets them. I think the character sheet has boxes for all levels (basic, trained, +10, +20). The skills with only the second box filled in are not basic skills, but advanced skills that require training to use. Any training in skill results in being able to use it at stat level, so skips the basic level completely.

Ah, thank.you brother, I see now.