B-Rad said:

There's nothing they can do.

He's unwilling to sign the release. There is nothing that they can do to force the issue.

Jesus christ. This is appalling. I'd be pissed.

Antigoth said:

No no not about the ****** bag not signing the release, about the cards getting out

can they "redo" the asset without him?

Personally, i can sit here and go "that sucks" but for Kin (who i met briefly at PotM, nice guy) and whoever the other teammate was, that REALLY sucks...

Oh well, i guess when it comes down to it, it is just a card game, and if your biggest problems in life are the result of a card game, you are doing OK. (i guess except for if that "problem" is owing a certain legbreaker $100K from losing at poker)

Zzasikar said:

It's never gonna happen to me, but I share the feeling entirely.

B-Rad said:

This is kind of uncalled for as James is busting his ass to fix the ******* issues that the old guard left behind. And the sets he has designed have been stellar to say the least. James is easily one of the best things to happen to this game since its inception. We need knowledgeable, savvy, and creative designers in this game. Period.

As for FFG not reading the forums, James is aware of this issue. Sketch (my teammate and "co-owner" of the asset) and I have spoken to James personally on the issue and we should have more information come Monday.

ShippuJinrai said:

Who said it was an issue?

The only issue I had was that before they never said they never read the forums. They only mentioned "We don't heavily police our forums."

Homme Chapeau said:

Im not talking about the issue being them not patrolling the forums. The issue is that i have a copy of a card that nobody at the FFG offices even has a printed copy of. The card apparently should not have gone through the presses but it did and that's what im tryign to find out more about.

The answer is obvious. You received a box from the future, when promos are commonplace replacements for random cards, and people put the enjoyment of others over a slight inconvinience to themselves.

-Tinman

ShippuJinrai said:

FFG does have the cards.

They are printed. Sitting in a box of roughly 800-1000 copies.

Sadly that box is in a drawer somewhere in a locked room, and cannot leave until all three team members, and both stores (yes, but I still don't understand why Galaxy has to sign a release since they're not mentioned anywhere on the card) have signed the release.

How would this happen?

The champion cards are printed together with some other cards on the same sheets. It's not that an entier sheet of just "pigeon games" or "pacific games" is printed. The cards are then sorted. Somewhere in the sort, while the multiple sheets were running a couple of copies of cards got mis-sorted. (I can't speak to how exactly the mis-sort happened.) Go back and look at uncut sheets that have been distributed as prize support in the past - Box Toppers & Other promo

Keep in mind, on the scale of "horrific printer screwups" this is really minor. Here are some of the more "Dramatic" printer errors I've seen:

• I have seen where a CCG was sent out with a different CCG's foil process overlayed on their cards.
• Printed an entire set with the card backs inverted. (Picture the UFS logo upside down on all of the cards, forcing players to use sleeves if they were to play with cards from that expansion mixed with cards from other sets)
• A God Box - where every single pack was nothing but Ultra Rares. The company didn't find out about it happening until at Origins when a customer bought the box, and proceeded to have more UR's then knew what to do with.
• An employee of the company arranging with the printer to have part of the entire expansion print run shipped to their home. (From what I understand there was criminal proceedings surrounding this one, not sure the entire extent. However the guys name became akin to Voldamort's from Harry Potter )

There's a multitude of other print errors I've seen over the years including mis-sorting, mis-distribution, shorting of cards in packs, mis-printing, the list goes on.

I've never seen a community as outraged by printer mistakes as the UFS community especially over how minor some of the stuff is. (Not saying that you Shippu are outraged, but as a whole the UFS community is quick to anger.)

Don't even know what and how to feel or respond to the situation...

Maybe I put it this way,

I flew there to attend a National Team Champ event and was recognized as that...

I flew there to make a couple of new friends, I got that however brief the friendship was, and, get acquinted with Antigoth, Garret and the Calgary crew...

I flew there to get away from my work for several days and got treated very well there by Antigoth, thanks again...

I flew there to prove a point about Talbain*** and that he is the best multisymbol deck at that time and I did just that...

I flew there to win a card for me and probably the last opportunity to do it for my store and I won that but not quite receiving it yet...

I am a person with lots of patience and I will leave it for FFG and others to try to fix a way that satisfies most parties involved in the situation and I would like to extend my gratitude to Antigoth and all the others who had put their effort to fix the issue...

Thanks

Kin

Antigoth said:

I expected they were made with other print runs - the ShadoWar foiling being the best clue. Seeing as I haven't seen the releases the champions have to sign, I'd imagine that there's a clause for such mishandlings. In which case it's all gravy, but something FFG might need to watch out for if at all possible. The thing is, the card we're talking about wasn't supposed to be released until the guy signs the release, at all. So... in all my non-law experience, I've no idea. I'm trying to understand the situation here.

Again, I don't know how it's handled over at the printer's, nor how they handle orders. I'm assuming it's "Print X copies of Y sheet" and Y sheet can be ShadoWar + that batch of Champion promos + Other promos that never saw the light of day + Staff cards (working in the delivery industry... somewhat, I know things screw up. Often. "*****, where my viennas!?" is something I have to say far more often than I care to admit), but I'm hoping, if they have the time and energy for such things, that they explore new printing avenues. This is pretty minor, as you said, but I don't think the game can afford anymore minor mistakes at the mo'. We're not out of the woods yet, after all.

I have no clue of what the graphics of the card before I read the first page of this thread. My face as well as my teammates' face were not in the card... Of course, I have sent FFG a couple of graphics, but, oh well... Don't know what to say again for this... and... if my face was not in it, they need my signature for what purpose?

I would suggest in the future, players that make top cut in card-awarding championship should sign their consent for the release of a card after the deck check... so less confusion in the future about releasing cards...

Kin

Homme Chapeau said:

The following is hypothetical as I do not have knowledge of which printers are used, or what agreements are in place with FFG for their printing. (And am speaking on this from my expereince with other CCGs)

• What if there is a contractual obligation for a certain amount of product to be printed before an agreement runs out? (I have seen companies on the hook to print a certain amount of product over X sets as part of their contract.)
• What if this was a new printer, after they left the previous printers due to the printing problems with those printers?

The only way to completely avoid the challenges of ever having a mix up like this occur, would be to have the championship promos run completely separately at a different point in time. As a reality, including it as part of the print run for a set is what makes it a viable financial option. <Every CCG I've been involved with does their promos at the same time as their sets. It's always been a costs issue.>

AwesomeDhalsim said:

Daniel's the guy in the front, Your face was most recognizable to me as the guy on the left in the silver armor. Matt's in the back under the hood.
<That was my impression upon first seeing it, and I agree they aren't the greatest likenesses of any of you.>

I've been asking for months why I have to get a release signed by Galaxy Comics. I still haven't gotten an answer on that one, as their name is no where on the card. So I totally understand where you're coming from on that one.

AwesomeDhalsim said:

Amusingly enough - one of the folks at FFG when we were discussing this indicated that in future they'd be sending the releases along to the event to be signed immediately by the winners to avoid this in future. So I think they're already on this one.

<That being said... there was no release sent up to Can Nats this year for Kirk to sign.>

Antigoth said:

I'm guessing there's a contractual obligation - FFG would stand to lose probably a lot of money if they didn't pursue that avenue - I'm not much of a businessman, but on-demand printing tends to cost a lot from what I hear. Now, if they had a contractual obligation with a particular printer, I'm guessing all their card games go through that particular printer, and thus they'd probably get a discount from it due to the quantity of printing they're doing through that printer. Again, this is all speculation.

The only way I'd see this being a solved issue would be to have the champion cards be a set by themselves alongside a lot more promos. Since these aren't supposed to hit packs, there wouldn't be a mistake. However, it would cost FFG more, and more costs is something FFG is trying to avoid at this point in time.

For all of you who like solving problems and logistics problems, it's a tough one.

EDIT: Also, as far as the releases are concerned, that'd be indeed the best solution to avoid this in the future. Glad to see FFG is on da ball.

Hey, why not just print this?

Ocean's Gratitude
3/5 +2M
Air Chaos Good Order
Breaker: 1 - Terrain
E Remove 1 momentum from the game: If you removed an attack, this attack gets +X damage. X equals double the number of attacks proceeding this attack in your card pool. Playable by either player.

R Commit 2 foundations, discard 1 card: After your opponent plays their second non-attack card this turn, both players add the top card from their deck to their card pool face up. Ignore any effects printed on this cards.

In Honor of 2008 Canadian Team Champions

I don't see this as a whole big issue. If there's anyone the team needs to be angry at is at the people who have not yet signed a release.

This is a simple sort error which has happened before and won't stop happening because of how printing goes, as Antigoth mentioned.

guitalex2008 said:

It's one guy. The rest all signed.

They should really just kill the dood and then they won't need a signature...

Jk don't really do that.

Homme Chapeau said:

Corrected for accuracy. Daniel was the lead for the entire getting of signatures, the team had elected him as the pointman for communication with FFG.

tannerface said:

That killed me, man.

It was like when Andre 3000 said "just playin'" on the song Roses.

So can they not reprint it with a different picture and just have the ones who will sign the release on it? or does that violate something as well?

i think the "problem" is the cards are ALREADY printed...

so any sentance starting with "can't they just print ...." is sort of null and void.

Smazzurco said:

But that doesnt mean they cant ditch those and print new ones.....