Can we talk this squad over some more now that people have been getting practice on Vassal and in proxyland?

I've gotten in a couple of games with them, and they're still mind ****ing me. They seem difficult to play well, but so weird that it's still a lot of fun even when you're losing.

I've only tried one build so far, but I've swapped pilots around within it:

> Wingman

> Advanced Sensors

> Mangler Cannon

> Seismic Charge

> Inertial Dampeners

> Autothrusters

Used with the CD and BD pairings.

Of those two, I prefer the latter. I found that IG-88C, while having a nice action economy, tends to compel you to boost all the time for the bonus evade. That means you aren't taking actions to modify your attacks, which leads to a lot of whiffing and low damage output.

Pairing C with B for the Gunner-esque mulligans might help, but I find it difficult to take the field without D's hard-segnoring ability. It seems to me that you need to be segnoring or k-turning constantly to keep yourself pointed at targets, and having the choice between the hard/soft segnor's can be critical for not getting blocked or running into an asteroid.

On that note, so far I can't convince myself to take any EPT other than Wingman. Because the large ship base covers ground so quickly, it sometimes feels next to impossible to ever get consecutive shots on the same target without pulling a red -- you'll generally get one approach at range 2-3, after which you'll be bumping or overshooting them. To ensure that you can saturate the same target and actually achieve a kill (as opposed to spreading the damage around inefficiently) it seems necessary to seg or k almost every round, and Wingman is the only way to do it. Unfortunately, something like Rebel Captive or R3-A2 would throw a huge wrench into that strategy.

I'd love to try a PTL build, but I feel like it might have to be played completely differently from any other squad -- basically lining up for a joust one round, then flying by the enemy the next to turn around and do it over again.

Autothrusters have been a slight disappointment. They seem to kick in once during the initial range 3 tradeoff before everything becomes a range 1-2 furball.

Dampeners are great, but I'm not sure I'd feel the same way if I wasn't using the stress-clearing Wingman build.

I intend to stick it out with Dual Aggs for better or worse, 'cuz I'm a sucker for evil robot bros, but I'd love to hear another round of other peoples' thoughts and squad ideas.

I was thinking:

B and C

-HLC

-PTL

-FCS

-Autothrusters

For some crazy action economy ie 4 almost every turn, plus pseudo-gunner.

Or:

C and D

-advanced sensors

-predator

-autothrusters

Plus a 12 point Z

Using the red manoeuvres regularly. The advanced sensors make the likely boost more flexible when not dealing with stress.

I'll be running B/C with:

-PtL

-FCS

-Ion Cannon

-Mango Cannon

-Autothrusters

The reason why I like Ion and Manglers is that you can force your opponent to dodge the Ions or Crits by spending their focus or evades and then gun them up with the other cannon. It gives you control options while still capitalizing on damage output. It also makes the IG ability useful even after a "Weapon Malfunction" crit s dealt to you.

Anywho, I'm super excited for IGs. They'll definitely be shaking up the meta.

I'm going to try at some point B and D similar to yours

wingman

advanced sensors

HLC

autothrusters

I am concious it's going to be difficult to stay within range 1, but maybe it can be done with boost and the wacky S-turn.

I'll be trying out B and C with

- PtL

- HLC

- FCS

- Autothrusters

- IG-2000

Then you have the double HLC in case you miss on the offensive side, then you bank and boost away clearing stress and turtling with focus+evade and then you set up for another run. FCS aids you on the offensive side as well so you can turtle up in combat as well if you feel like it.

I don't have vassal and I haven't proxied so this is pure theory-wing, but I'm looking at:

B/C

-HLC

-PtL

-Adv Sensors

-Inertial Dampeners

-IG2000

I feel like B is mandatory on a dual aggressor build, so that speaks for itself. It's also the only counter to phantoms short of hoping they botch a roll.

On jousting turns, I boost/focus or TL and get an evade for my troubles. Wanna bump me? Cool, one less ship shooting at me. Next turn I K or S-loop with an action while you K without.

I'd like to include autothrusters but I feel like two HLCs with gunnery and action economy will deal with the ships I'd want thrusters for. Watch how quickly a decimators disappear when taking focus/TLed HLCs for a couple turns. And if I'm worried about taking damage, I'll focus/evade and cross my fingers.

I am worried about not getting enough mileage out of C because he covers too much ground too quickly, and D is my natural fallback plan.

I feel that B and HLC's will give you more than enough offense so that you can focus the rest of your build on defense and maneuverability.

Advanced sensors with VI on C or with Stay on target on D gives you lots of options. Giving yourself options (and limiting those of your opponent) is where you win matches and it makes for the most interesting games.

Stupid question:

Can you explain what

C and D

B/C etc etc all are?

It's the various pilots that exist, ranging from A to D. IG-88A, IG-88B etc.

The only difference is their pilot ability.

A - Recover one shield on killing another ship.

B - If you miss an attack you may attack again with a cannon.

C - When you Boost you may perform a free evade action.

D - You may perform a Segnor's Loop using the hard 3 templates.

Thanks for that Narcoleptic.

So I assume you will need 2 Aggressors if you intend to use them at all?

I have pre ordered 1 of everything so far.

You don't necessarily need two, but if you plan on running the dual IG strategy you will need two.

This worked well for me.

Ig88 c/d

Ptl

Hlc

Title

Fire control systems

Autothrusters

Only boost when needed

Or

I'll just evade and focus and save them for defense and rely on the fire control systems and the gunner option

Another build similar that I've done well

Ig88 c/d

Ptl

Hlc

Advanced Sensors

Inertial dampers.

This you can boost evade, and ptl to focus and do a green maneuver to clear the stress.

Again this has worked well for me

Boosting is great way to get out in front of the higher ps ships like Han and etc and hopefully blocks them

So far I'm liking the first build better due to having the extra defense from autothrusters

Thanks for that Narcoleptic.

So I assume you will need 2 Aggressors if you intend to use them at all?

I have pre ordered 1 of everything so far.

You can run one at a time, and some people certainly are. What compels people to use 2 in a list is the IG-2000 title which, for 0 points, lets all Aggressors equipped with it share pilot abilities (listed in brief above).

Autothrusters have been a slight disappointment. They seem to kick in once during the initial range 3 tradeoff before everything becomes a range 1-2 furball.

This might be obvious already, so I apologize if I'm being capt. obvious - but fwiw, autothrusters are much more valuable on the C + A/B (basically anything not D) because being able to make use of all those s-loops is far too tempting and so you will almost always be fighting in close. When you forego the s-loop and use hard turn + boost to turn around, you will find yourself at range 3 more often.

My thoughts on the matter:

http://community.fantasyflightgames.com/index.php?/topic/131762-a-modular-14/

I would say that Cannons are unnecessary if you're flying CD, as you don't need the boost in kill potential for A, and you don't need the cannon to re-roll for B.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldnt daredevil be good use of your EPT? You have the boosy action, so no damage, and you were gonna take the stress anyway to turn around via s-loop, so why not whip 2 straight 1hard maneuvers and call it a zero speed i turning barrel roll?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldnt daredevil be good use of your EPT? You have the boosy action, so no damage, and you were gonna take the stress anyway to turn around via s-loop, so why not whip 2 straight 1hard maneuvers and call it a zero speed i turning barrel roll?

Better: as you chose to do it in Activation rather than Planning, so you can use it reactionary.

Daredevil triples the angles and positions of all of your non-red maneuvers. It's one of my favorite EPTs.

Considering its status as a large ship with lots of green, I'm planning to experiment with Expert Handling on it next. Seems like it should be a great combination, especially paired with either Advanced Sensors (Barrel Roll before revealing dial) or FCS (BR without losing combat action).

The secret to any Double Aggressor list:

A third ship.

The secret to any Double Aggressor list:

A third ship.

That being what? A Binarye Pirate? Naked, two cost you 72 points. This doesn't leave you with much in the way of a third ship AND upgrades.

But I agree, I think double Aggressor lists with that Z-wing will do better than those without.

The secret to any Double Aggressor list:

A third ship.

That being what? A Binarye Pirate? Naked, two cost you 72 points. This doesn't leave you with much in the way of a third ship AND upgrades.

But I agree, I think double Aggressor lists with that Z-wing will do better than those without.

That's the thing. Maybe I'm cheap, but even the Aggressor, with its 1.3 bajillion upgrade slots, should be given upgrades sparingly. The title alone and the combinations it provides will make it quite versatile. I think the only upgrade the IG's all NEED is Inertial Dampeners. Add one more option to its crazy maneuver capabilities. Beyond that, your preferred flavor of modification or EPT at most, and leave 20ish points for another ship like Serissu or N'Dru with Lone Wolf and Dampeners. Dual IG lists have been being played in the Vassal tournaments on list juggler, and they are not performing well. I think the secret to cracking them is be sparing with your upgrade choices, choose ones you KNOW you can use every turn (or cheap 1-offs like Dampeners), and give yourself another ship as a security net.

My 2 cents, admittedly offered before the majority of us have seen how they really perform on the table. However, I feel the same way about Double Firespray lists, and I LOVE my Firesprays. Any Double Firespray list is improved by a third ship to increase damage, defense, or distract.

http://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Scum%20and%20Villainy&d=v3!s!110:27,-1,-1,-1,-1,108:20:-1:;111:27,-1,-1,-1,-1,108:20:-1:;126:0,-1,-1:-1:-1:

For those worried about phantoms or other high pilot skill ships, there's Torkil Mux With Ion Turret. If you still want higher PS, put VI on the Aggressors.

Edited because: I forgot to add the IG-2000 title

I'm interested in trying the "slim" Aggressor build eventually, but I'm not convinced yet that it's the best way forward. If you're not slapping upgrades all over it you've just got a ship with the offense of an X-Wing, the defense of a TIE fighter, and the hit points of a B-Wing. Which would be an *amazing* package on a small-base ship, but on a large-base your overclocked speed is going to prevent you from applying those stats with the consistency and reliability you'd hope for.

I'm interested in trying the "slim" Aggressor build eventually, but I'm not convinced yet that it's the best way forward. If you're not slapping upgrades all over it you've just got a ship with the offense of an X-Wing, the defense of a TIE fighter, and the hit points of a B-Wing. Which would be an *amazing* package on a small-base ship, but on a large-base your overclocked speed is going to prevent you from applying those stats with the consistency and reliability you'd hope for.

The best dial in the game compensates somewhat for the problems of the large base.

But more importantly, you're right that the large base creates problems for the really superb stat line, but the problem is that adding upgrades generally puts more stress on the stat line that supports them, not less.

I'm interested in trying the "slim" Aggressor build eventually, but I'm not convinced yet that it's the best way forward. If you're not slapping upgrades all over it you've just got a ship with the offense of an X-Wing, the defense of a TIE fighter, and the hit points of a B-Wing. Which would be an *amazing* package on a small-base ship, but on a large-base your overclocked speed is going to prevent you from applying those stats with the consistency and reliability you'd hope for.

I would like to forward the point that those three things together in one package, IE X-wing attack, TIE Fighter Defense, and B-wing HP together on one chassis, even a large base chassis, is no small thing. Mathematically, assuming just the statline without upgrades or the like, its overall durability rivals that of a Decimator. 8 HP with 3 evade is a big deal and is impressive for the price.