First of all I'd like to thank the nice dane who offered to sell me his entire collection. I has to decline simply because I don't want to go all in on a system I still don't know that we like. However, I have managed to get my grubby hands on the core box and it was marked as shipped this morning.

Now, we always tend to download the core book and read over as not every player buys the book but they still want to prepare so we've all been reading up what we can and since the cards aren't included we were rather...puzzled. Now, I'm presuming the careers and NPC's are on cards? I don't mind making my own NPC templates, but it's nice to have some idea how strong something is supposed to be. A baseline of sorts.


Also, as I'm GM: Any tips on a nice premade adventure I can start off with? Just so I have something to start with and the players hopefully get a nice experience. I don't mind changing stuff on the fly, in fact i have to due to my players running around like headless chickens, but having a nice starting point helps.

Last thing: We sneaked about in the players handbook and found careers, are they the same careers as in the core set? There seems to be a wide difference in powerlevel among the starting careers so any tips on limitations or suggestions?

And lastly: Any advice for supplements? I know we download and read but we buy anything we're going to be using in the RP. Both for convience sake and to support the developer....though that might be a tad late?

I'll asume we are talking about 3d edition...

There's always been a a bit of a powerlevel difference in the careers (il all editions of the game) you could roll a rat catcher, charcoal burner or a frog wife, and your buddy could end up with a chiurgeon, soldier, or pit fighter, and you would sit there and think "you lucky b*stard". Don't know how it goes with 3d edition but the "bad" careers were usauly easier to get out of into something better. Also in 2nd there are careers and advanced careers (last ones are obviously better but you cona't start as them)

For expansion i'd go with the Liber Carnagia, estatica, Infectus and Mutatus, purley because they are about chaos and i'm huge chaos fanboy (and asume everybody else is to ) Might i suggest the Tome of adventure (it's a guide to game mastery and adventure.

It's third, sorry, wasn't aware it was normal to have to mention editions.

Well, there's where I'm stumped. Should I tell everyone "pick low lvl noobs and live/die with it!" or let them pick freely? The "draw 3 choose 1" is great for people who have no idea what they want to play but it could easily ruin someone's great character idea. So maybe I should let my players choose and then we take it from there?

I couldn't find those expansions, are those the english names? If anything just throw me a url to the product pages

And thanks for the help so far!

In the box cards are included for the actions and talents that the characters can use, careers are also on cards. So that will be clearer when you get the box.

I mostly let my players pick among the basic careers, and it works fine. Certainly there are differences in power level, especially if your campaign focus on one thing (combat, social, investigation and so on).

But most careers have the same amount of skills to pick from, same amount of advances but distributed differently. So from that perspective they are quite even in power. However, a character starting as a soldier would be more powerful in combat than a character playing as a Burgher. But the Burgher would probably do a lot better in social situations.

So as a tip for you as a GM is to not focus on one area of the game. Different careers shine in different parts of the adventure. While it's easy to compare raw combat power, there are other aspects to the careers.

A good starting adventure would be "An Eye for an Eye" (included in the core box) gives you a nice mix of social, investigative and combat encounters. So it's an adventure where different careers get to use their skills.

I've played the various 40k lines so I'm well versed in switching who's in the limelight, and it tends to be fun for everyone. Investigative? Time to go dark heresy medieval style!

Well, I don't presume a Burgher and a Soldier will be even in combat or social, they'll both have their niche. But what's a commoner good at? What can a commoner ever be better then others at?

I'll have to read up on that adventure

Also, is the gear on cards as well?

Looking at the Commoner from a min/max perspective:

Main attributes are Thoughness and Willpower. This is a big thing. Th and Wp are the two most important characteristics because just about everything that tries to kill you in the game goes through either Th or Wp, mostly in the form of physical injuries or insanity. The Commoner is equipped to start as an overall durable character, which means he has a much better chance of actually lasting long enough to work his way through more careers.

With access to Nature Lore he can be handy as a improvised ranger.

With Resilience, he will resist damage and heal from injuries quicker.

With Athletics he can be good for all kinds of physical challenges, like climbing, swimming and jumping.

Also remember that characteristics are more important than skills(although the combination of the two is obviously the best). Even though he doesn't have access to Weapon Skill, he will be a decent fighter if he takes a Melee Action Card or two.

A Commoner is not the most flashy starting point, but it is one of the most solid foundations for building a lasting character.

But really, the reward of playing a Commoner is playing some poor potato farmer who never thought he would leave his farm who is suddenly thrust into the role of a hero

Looking at the Commoner from a min/max perspective:

Main attributes are Thoughness and Willpower. This is a big thing. Th and Wp are the two most important characteristics because just about everything that tries to kill you in the game goes through either Th or Wp, mostly in the form of physical injuries or insanity. The Commoner is equipped to start as an overall durable character, which means he has a much better chance of actually lasting long enough to work his way through more careers..

But really, the reward of playing a Commoner is playing some poor potato farmer who never thought he would leave his farm who is suddenly thrust into the role of a hero

I gotta agree, high tougness is great! Oh yeah, don't underestamate pototto farmers from rustic villages, I mean, look at Frodo or Rhand al thor, and see what they ended up doing.

It's third, sorry, wasn't aware it was normal to have to mention editions.

Well, there's where I'm stumped. Should I tell everyone "pick low lvl noobs and live/die with it!" or let them pick freely? The "draw 3 choose 1" is great for people who have no idea what they want to play but it could easily ruin someone's great character idea. So maybe I should let my players choose and then we take it from there?

I couldn't find those expansions, are those the english names? If anything just throw me a url to the product pages

And thanks for the help so far!

Nah i figured it would be third edition but i tought it safer to ask, just incase you had 2nd edition. I got a bit more experience with that one you see. If you can get 2nd ed sourcebooks very cheap might be worth it for inspiration's sake.

Ah sorry about that, Tome of adventure should be Game Masters Vault.

And as for the chaos ones: this is what happens when you get your pdf's from a friend who got them from another guy who got them from a guy with an eyepatch and a parrot if you get my drift. Turns out they are spread across several modules, for instance the Liber Carnagia can be found in Omens of war. I checked the ISBN numbers and they matched) so don't bother with these and just get the game masters vault.

The chaos boxes are great (Winds of Magic, Signs of Faith, Omens of War, Lure of Power). Each box contains two books (plus all the cards and tokens for the expansion).

The two best boxes to start with would be (in my opinion) Winds of Magic and Sigsn of Faith. WoM for the Corruption rules and the expanded Wizard rules. SoF for the disease rules and the expanded Priest rules.

But Omens of War and Lure of Power are good expansions too. OoW focus on combat LoP on social. Having all four "chaos-boxes" gives the players a wide range of careers, actions etc. And it gives the GM a lot of fun to work with as well. Each box also contain adventures.

But if all (or many) of the players play dwarves, Black Fire Pass might be the thing for you.

The Adventurer's Toolkit is a nice addition to any gaming group (it adds some fun careers, actions and talents).

When reaching higher levels, Hero's Call is nice to have as it adds high level careers and actions.

If you're looking for adventures the Gathering Storm, Witch's Song and The Enemy Within are all good and fun adventures.

So it all depends on your group, but as a general advice Signs of Faith and Winds of Magic add a lot of stuff that almost should have been part of the core box. A warhammer game without corruption, mutation, disease? Nah.

While all expansions are nice to have, I'd consider these two a must have (for my games at least).

I also enjoy the permanent critical injuries from Omens Of War. Two of my players are starting to look a bit... ragged. One guy is down to one eye and one ear

It really depends on what you are going to play. All four Chaos God expansions are pretty much a must. Although I personally haven't had any use for Lure Of Power, that's mostly because I don't set my adventures in Imperial high society. I still think the social rules introduced in that expansion is the weakest though.

For making a new party only allow them Basic careers. Also, you might consider removing the Ironbreaker and Swordmaster careers. They are just a bit too powerful starting points. Particularly since they let players start with some really strong gear.

Since you only have the core set, which limits careers quite a bit, I would recommend just going with the "draw 3, pick 1" method. Allthough you might consider removing careers first that you do not want to see in your game. For example, I often remove priests and wizards careers, to keep the party more low-fantasy.

Wow, I don't even know where to begin. I remember reading the ragefilled reviews when this first game out and reading some of the threads here I was rather spectical to the community but you guys have really helped me and my friends out alot!

I KNOW we'll have a wizard cause two twins are playing in the group and one either plays a wizard or a huge warrior. That's his favorites. The other one tends to go for scheming/talkative/sneaky characters. I don't know if we'll have any priests, which I find weird cause I find the priests of sigmar so iconic to warhammer fantasy. I'm not too far into fantasy fluff, but something tells me they have their fair share of firebrand priests in the old world and those are ALWAYS fun to RP.

So I'll defineatly keep my eyes open for what the group moves towards and buy accordinly.

I don't mind it being "classical fantasy", I just don't want it going total D&D with magic items all over the place.

So I take it the omens of war adds mostly combat careers, lure of power social ones, and the rest are also rather self explanatory. Or?

Is there a GM screen? Is it needed? I have screens from other games so i can "hide" my dice rolls and GM notes.

Ralzar, the ironbreaker and swordmaster was some of the balance issues I had. I LOVED how you described the commoner, my worry wasn't about the burgher and soldier being balanced. It's being within the same niche being somewhat balanced. I only have the pdf book so I have no cards to look at and all i know apart from that is the tabletop and pictures in the players handbook. And the the imperial soldier looks weaker then the dwarven ironbreaker. So thank you! JUST the advice I wanted.

I'm sorry for not making myself clearer, english is not my primary language.

And again, thank you for taking your time in helping me

No problem

Some general advice:

Check out Gitzmans gallery (just google it). It has the best character sheets out there (the ones in the box are terrible). It also contains a bunch of helpful aides that makes looking up the rules during play much easier. Not to mention understanding the rules.

Don't bother with the official GM screen.

Most people seem to agree that the party sheets just doesn't work. I have tried using it loads of times, but it just keeps being forgotten. At this point I usually don't even place it on the table.

If you have any wizards or priest, make them learn the rules for spells/invocations. You do not have the time to keep track of it for them. If they can't be bothered, they don't deserve to play the career.

WFRP uses a funky turn system. A turn is as long as the GM says it is. A turn in combat is very short. But while shopping for items in a town, a turn could be an hour. Or a day, or a week. Just make sure people aren't insisting that all their abilities are constantly refreshing because they are out of combat.

WFRP is extremely open to being played in a number of different flavours, to a large degree based on what careers are being played. But the default gaming style is basically an investigation with some combat.

One thing to remember, is to make sure everyone doesn't always get to only play to their strengths. Min/maxed wfrp characters are extremely good at what they are specialized in, but they are very weak in other areas. Don't let your max strength and thoughness warrior just stand in the background outside of combat. Have him get put in situations where he has to talk or think his way out. Maybe he has to persuade someone to join him in a fight? Or maybe he has to figure out who to fight? Have him witness mind-warping chaos magic and watch him break down to a gibbering loon.

The same goes for "social" characters. Have them not always be able to talk their way out of fights. Set up fights where they can't just stand behind the warriors until it's over.

Half the fun of WFRP is watching the warhammer world grind the characters down. Watch the noble knight accumulate insanities until he's just a pile of armour, drooling in the corner. Watch the social butterfly catch a disgusting disease which slowly accumulates more sympthoms until he finally expires in a ditch, covered in boils and pus. Watch the though fighter survive one wound after another until he starts loosing limbs and is over time grinded down to a scar-cowered, mutilated beggar, no longer fit to fight. Watch the righteous priest accumulate corruption as he gets too close to the chaos he fights one too many times and he sprouts an extra arm and a pair of horns, gets discovered as a mutant and is burned at the stake the way he burned chaos scum himself.

There is lots of fun to have in this game, both for the player and the GM

Yeah I gotta agree with Ralzar, those crit injuries from Omens of war, are one of the things that make this game diffrent from D&D. It's not as hardcore as 1st edition- in wich each combat was a fight for your life. Some of those crits were stuff like heads flying off and limbs getting hacked and mangled.

One thing to bear in mind with wizards: In D&D people (npcs) don't have problems with spellcasters and don't hate and fear them. In Warhammer, people fear and distrust wizards and spellcasters. Witch hunters scour the land burning witches and mutants. (Usualy they'll leave wizards alone as your average wizard will have some sort of licence with him that proves he was trained in Altdorf and therefore a good guy.) But it's up to you as the Gm if you want to play it more wizard friendly.

Gitzman's gallery is pretty neat.

I'll have to look into it, defineatly!

I'm used to 40k with the fear and hatred of psykers, i take it it's something of the same so no worries there. That, and being european I got to learn about the ye old witch hunts people did...yay. I take it it means they're "legal", doesn't mean the witch hunter likes him. Do wizards have any strict rules to follow? I mean, psykers are feared both by the informed and ignorant. They can potentially burst out demons afterall. I take it wizards so something akin to the same based on the "mishap table" from the tabletop game?

What's the problem with the party sheet? That it's never used or?

Also, a friend of mine asked if 3rd edition is playable on roll20? Any tips or would he be better off with 2nd?

Yeah, it's basically the same as psykers in 40k. They are state trained and sanctioned, but to a witch hunter they are messing with stuff that should be left alone and it might only be a matter of time until he falls to chaos. To peasants it's impossible to tell the difference between a warlock and a sanctioned wizard. One of them has some papers on him, but they can't read anyway. They just know that magic is the stuff of deamons and they want no truck with it.

Apopros hostile and bigoted peasants: remember that to some degree dwarfs and even more so elves are also looked at with a mix of fascination, fear and envy. Racism is a very real thing when there are several intelligent races trying to co-exist. Don't be afraid to give out misfortune dice on social tests when interacting with another race.

Dwarfs atleast have a bit better standing with empire folk who know their history. Fighting along Sigmar at Black fire pass, forging Gal maraz and the runeswords and stuff. Elves are seen as mysterious but very foreign.

I checked Roll20 for "warhammer" and can't find anything (except black crusade) so I doubt you can use it with 3d editions special dice. But as the saying goes "there is an app for that." Just google "warhammer roleplay 3d edition dice app" and stuff will turn up.

Would you be better of with 2nd? Hard to say: 2nd is a traditional RPG, books, sheets, ten sided dice (D10). 3d edition is FF throwing its component factory at you: tokens, cards, 7 types of dice, character cards, distance tokens, etc...

Example: when you get a serious disease it will take up the slot of one of your skill cards- reperesenting you being to sick to do something. But this can lead to the odd efect of a character having a disease that affects his mind sudenly not knowing how to swing a two-handed sword properly because he has a headache.

One thing about the dice, that my group found a bit odd is this: you can make a succesfull roll but still have something (minor) go wrong. As a GM you will have to think up (fast) what exactly has happened.

Gm: "you dodged the blow, but you stepped back badly and twisted your ankle"

Gm "euh, you charmed the burgomeister's daughter, but eh..lemme think, you let slip that you like blondes better, and she's a brunette." Stuff like that.

2nd is D&D in the warhammer world, with stats based on the statblocks of the minatures game (M WS BS S T W I A Ld) and simple dice.

Regardless of wich systhem you choose, (if you want to set your adventure in the empire) I sugest you track down a copy WHFRPG 2nd edition Sigmar's Heirs . It describes the provinces in amazing detail , from the history and landscape and places and people of intrest to local customs and sayings to history and regional specialities and exports! it's like a travelers guidebook to the empire!

I'll try to look for that online Robin, I kinda need to get myself into the setting and the landscape. I know it mostly from the tabletop and then as a skaven player which only mentions when the skaven screw with the empire and other surface factions.

Alrighty, I'll mention it to the guy. Just thought that since 3rd has alot of physical components running it online would be difficult.

Yeah I don't think it's one of the easiest games to run online, with all the components (but maybe via skype and the Gm controling the set up of the tokens?) Then again i haven't looked into it much for all i know somebody made warhammer 3d edition app somewhere. Also 3d has this odd mechanic where you put tokens between your character tokens to indicate distance. Our Gm chucked that out before game one, and we just drew a map like we used to do in D&D.

If you are familiar with the tabletop you will like 2nd.

Ah since you are a skaven player: have you come across any background stuff that says the people in the empire don't believe that skaven exist? Ive read it in some book but can't remember wich one, and it always struck me as incredably odd.

Alright, that's an...odd selection of stats but fun

Yes, i did. The thing is: The higher ups are mixed, some KNOW, others suspect but most dismiss it as rumour and superstitious peasants. Most peasants just assume it's a myth as well. It doesn't make alot of sense when you play the tabletop game as you have large scale battles with skaven and the dwarves fight skaven regularly and probably should have told them. "we lost a hold to skaven". It's kind of hard not to believe dwarves would lie about that.

It's probably a mix of disbelief for those not directly involved and people refusing to believe even more horrors then they already know about lurk around in the old world. And most people in the warhammer universe haven't seen any of the horrors, because when they do they die. Beastmen? Sure, they've heard about them and seen what happens to villages they raid. But seen one? Few, and many probably don't fully believe they are actual beastmen either.

It's the same in 40k, no one has seen a xenos species firsthand, they're just told they exist.

Any pitfalls or shortcuts I should make with the system? I've already noticed the one you mentioned about the range tokens, I'll have the players remember that or suffer the consequenses. Party sheet I only understood wasn't effective, so it's simpler to just exclude it?

When it comes to skaven, remember that in fantasy battles you might be playing that one time where an empire army met a skaven army. It's not something that's happening all the time, but it's only interesting to play the bits where the skaven boldly go above ground.

As to believing in skaven: It's not really about beliving in "ratmen", but skaven society. Basically, people can buy the concept of rat-like mutants and beastmen. But not the Underempire.

Compare it to "Albino aligators in the New York sewers":

Could there be one or more aligator in the sewer? Perhaps.

Albino? Maaaaybe..?

A technologically advanced civilization of albino alligators spread through the sewers of the world, plotting the ruin of man? You need to be locked up and have your head examined.

So, when someone mentions "the Skaven" they're not just talking about a sewer-dwelling mutant. And even if they call them "rat men", they will still be associated with the crazies ranting about the under empire.

Yup. In WHFRP the skaven are that what the ratcatchers wishper about. Giant rats walking on two legs glimpsed from the corner of their eye. Marienburg dockhands seeing them skiiter across the rooftops during a full moon. Tales from a lonely dwarf ranting about his home in the mountains overrun with such creatures.

And then the characters run into a hooded beggar in the streets. "Can-can you spare me a few-few copper pieces, good sir?"

@ Ralzar. Thanks for clearing that up. Because there once was an emperor named Manfred Skaven-slayer. and If the burgers of the empire didn't believe in skaven, what did they think he slew?

Well, still, the dwarves SHOULD know that the skaven are not just simple mutants. They fight wars against them, loose and/or try to recapture old holdings from them. I get not knowing the full picture of the horrible realm just beneath their feet, but not know that they're butchering the dwarves from below is...weird.

Sure. The dwarfs in the mountains know. Dwarfs in the city.. probably. But they are just some among the many stories they hear about their ancient mountain homes.

As I said, there is a lot of racism. That some out-of-town dwarfs come by and claim that some place they've never heard of was overrun by the skaven means little to the common folk. The nobility might care if it disrupts trade, but the skaven, or whatever they were called, is obviously the dwarfs problems. If they shaped up and moved into the cities, like good Sigmar-fearing folk do, they wouldn't have all these problems with monsters overrunning their homes.

Dwarf: "That's what i keep telling them manling! But your leaders have grobi dung in their ears! It's all "oh sure master dwarf, they are in the dark caverns of your lost holds, but surley there can be no tunnels under glorious Altdorf!" Pah fools, the lot of them!, **** Umgi! No respect for the wise words of a longbeard, your buildings are shoddy and your beer is no good! Now where is me book of grudges?"

By the way, one question came up yesterday. How easily recognized is a wizard? I know he gets a staff, no idea if it looks...special? And robes denoting his school of magic, but do peasants know? Or is it just fancy'ish clothes? I know witch hunters will know, but what about other folk?