I have conceded on multiple occasions but I would only do it if it's clear I have very little chance to win ( 1 ship left against 3 or 4 ). I really would rather sit and talk or go off somewhere else then play for another 30mins in a pointless attempt to win a clearly unwinnable game.

Have any of you experienced this? Do you always concede in these situations? My opponent got so torque off, he called the TO and complained that I wouldn't concede. I couldn't believe it.

Out of interest, what did the TO have to say about this?

He laughed, as he thought the player was kidding. When it became apparent that my opponent was serious, the TO informed him that so long as I desired to keep playing, and as long as their was time remaining, my opponent was obligated to continue the match.

The TO did inform him that if he didn't want to play anymore, he could concede.

So what happened? Did he eventually wipe you out? Or did you survive until the end?

You can be sure he chose not to concede ... and no, there were no miracles. Part of me (a small voice in the head) wanted to just try and fly and stall ... not because I would normally do that, but because my opponent was such a schmuck. But, then maturity got the better of me, and I just played as best as I could, until the bitter end.

The best part was, when it was all over, he couldn't help himself ... "I told you it was pointless ... next time perhaps you will know better". I told him probably not.

Don't concede, MoV will be hurt.

Etc etc.

I agree in tournaments I would never concede as long as I have a chance to at least kill some more points to help my standings.

For casual games, especially on vassal, I have a pretty decent 6th sense when it comes to winning or losing, so I'll often concede pretty early sometimes if things have gone badly for me quickly. Granted, there are always those rare cases where you pull off a win when way behind, but when my time is limited I rather just end the game and start a new one then drag out one where the ending is pretty inevitable.

I find that facing losing odds is not something to give up about; it is an opportunity to try something crazy that I would otherwise not risk if things had gone according to plan. After all, what is there to lose?

I find that facing losing odds is not something to give up about; it is an opportunity to try something crazy that I would otherwise not risk if things had gone according to plan. After all, what is there to lose?

I totally agree with this ... it leads to opportunities to try new things / crazy things / things you would never otherwise consider ... basically a learning / experimenting opportunity. You may surprise yourself and/or learn something ...

I've conceded in casual play before... in fact I've conceded after three rounds because I made awful movement decisions which decreased the fun of the game. I conceded and we quickly reset to go again. More fun was had.

I've also seen Soontir with upgrades take apart an entire list by himself in a tournament. (This was particularly funny for me as it was my brother on the wrong end.) As long as you play in a good spirit and want to continue in a tournament, go for it. If you can destroy a few more points worth of ships this could make a difference in your rank in the tournament. Play to the bitter end and congratulate the winner afterwards, knowing you gave it your all.

In tournaments, never. That's what the clock is for, in part.

Casually, I think it's reasonable. Mnx posted a video of a Vassal match with Wave 5 ships. It came down to Corran vs. Rear Admiral. That's tough. Corran was just running away. He never did anything but try to recoup shields via r2. I think at that point, he ought to have conceded.

There is a big difference between running around to be a ****, waiting for your chance to strike, and keeping full win out of a tournament opponents hands

Going to echo pretty much everyone else.

If I'm playing with friends and it's clear one of us is toast, 1 Tie with 2 damage left vs 2 X's with full shields or something. We call it so we can start another game.

In a tournament though, especially now with MoV being a factor. No never, in fact anyone who asks the other guy to concede is IMO borderline cheating. They're trying to avoid a lower MoV themselves by getting the other guy to give up before they take out another ship or two.

Or perhaps even worried they can't actually win and trying to trick the win.

If I were a TO and someone told me that the other person was trying to push them to concede I'd at least consider that 2 strikes against them.

Margin of victory makes conceding a pointless mechanich EXCEPT, you just don't want to play that game anymore and don't care about the points.

So you can't be a bad sport for actually playing the system. That being said, even tho i never say anything to my opponents, i really hate when i am playing practice/casual games and my opponent is left with stuff that he can't beat any of my ships and keeps playing around. For example, one game i had wes, wedge and luke untouched (i regen all shields), after killing a doomshuttle and whisper. And all he had was jendon with ST321 and engine upgrade. He made me chase it for 10 minutes (after the initial engagement i broke formation to keep ships alive), when he basically had no chance at killing any ship if i didn't want to.

But did i say anything ? No, i just kept playing. Bored, but respectful.

I can't imagine a situation where I would quit playing the game against my opponent. That's what conceding is right?

It is still a dice game so you really never know how the outcome will be despite the odds. Maybe your opponent doesn't get a full win based on you sticking it out. Then, you are cheating other players in this regard for not giving it your all. I look at it in the perspective that you would also have bad etiquette by cheating your opponent out of the fun of destroying you. If the shoe was on the other foot, I would rather win by defeating my opponent than merely them quitting. Robbing me of victory, though someone who wins via their opponent conceding gets a full win I understand.

That's my take.

In a tournament, you have every right to continue playing if there's any chance of success (or just improving your margin). Since this game hinges on luck in many cases, anything is possible. Flying casual doesn't mean you have to surrender, nor does it mean you should give away a full win when your opponent has only earned a modified win. Hit-and-run tactics won't make you popular, but they are no less valid than ramming with Anti-Pursuit Lasers, bombs, ions, miraculous synergies or any other way it's possible to win in this game.

If time is running out, and you're on the ropes, the sporting thing to do is play very quickly so your opponent has the best chance of beating you fairly. At that point, it's a game of "come get me" so if your opponent is going to fail, let them do it because of their own haste, stumbling over their own ships and mis-guessing your actions or whatever. Stalling is unsporting, but playing to the bitter end is not.

I happily concede games if I know I don't have a chance of coming back. I do it in tournaments too, but nobody at my lgs really cares too much about the prizes, since we all have plenty of tokens already. If we were playing for ships and what not, I would play games out.

Trying to force someone to concede in a tournament is pretty shady though.

Conceding may be considered a courtesy to allow you and your opponent more time to get set up for the next round. But it is not a requirement. I wouldn't consider anyone who waits till the last turn call from quitting a poor sport.

Never give up, you never know how bad the other person may be doing, they might be thinking about giving up too.

Also being a dice game. You might roll very well and them all blanks, might not happen. But would make a great ending.

[insert "Eye of the Tiger" here]

In tournaments you should never concede. The margin of victory is determined by the relative amount of points you and your opponent destroy. By you conceding they get maximum Margin of Victory (which helps them) and you would get 0 (which is bad).

This is incorrect.

If a player concedes, all his remaining ships are considered destroyed, but it doesn't change your opponent's losses. If (using the OP's numbers) I've killed 20 points of your ships and you've killed 80 of mine when I concede, the result is 100 to 20, with the calculated MoV as 120 vs. 80.

To the OP's issue... This may be part of the problem. Tournament rules, page 2:

It is considered good sportsmanship to concede defeat when there is no reasonable chance of victory.

I think it's a silly statement, and will never have a problem with someone wanting to play out a game (as I will). Comebacks happen.

But for whatever reason, FFG put that in there, and someone may take it a bit too much to heart.

If I were playing competitively or helping my friends to practice for a tournament, I believe I would fight to the last plastic mini. if there was a chance of a miracle comeback.

Playing casually with friends I have conceded if there was no possible way of winning. The last game I conceded was an epic game where I had only a crippled corvette and two x-wings on the table against, lets just say too many imperials (and my poor flying in the match).

In tournaments you should never concede. The margin of victory is determined by the relative amount of points you and your opponent destroy. By you conceding they get maximum Margin of Victory (which helps them) and you would get 0 (which is bad).

This is incorrect.

If a player concedes, all his remaining ships are considered destroyed, but it doesn't change your opponent's losses. If (using the OP's numbers) I've killed 20 points of your ships and you've killed 80 of mine when I concede, the result is 100 to 20, with the calculated MoV as 120 vs. 80.

To the OP's issue... This may be part of the problem. Tournament rules, page 2:

It is considered good sportsmanship to concede defeat when there is no reasonable chance of victory.

I think it's a silly statement, and will never have a problem with someone wanting to play out a game (as I will). Comebacks happen.

But for whatever reason, FFG put that in there, and someone may take it a bit too much to heart.

Wow...that IS unfortunate. That makes me question my stance actually...

I don't see why it's such a silly statement. Let's say you have a HWK with its turret destroyed against a full-HP C-3P0 Falcon with the title card. To even attempt to roll dice to damage it you need to get to range 1 AND block/asteroid it to deny the evade action AND manage end up out of contact so you're allowed to shoot. Fail any of those conditions and it is literally impossible to damage the Falcon. Even if you somehow succeed you still need to roll two hits. And after all that you've still only done one point of damage out of the 13 you need.

So, in that situation it's pretty safe to say that you have no realistic hope of winning. You will probably never do any damage, and eventually the Falcon will finish off your HWK. And your opponent is ahead of you by enough points to get a full win, so you can't even stall until time runs out. Your best chance of winning is for your opponent to make a maneuvering mistake and fly their ship off the table, something that is incredibly unlikely. So is it really worth making your opponent go through the formality of finishing off your last ship in the desperate hope that they somehow throw away the win?

To the OP's issue... This may be part of the problem. Tournament rules, page 2:

It is considered good sportsmanship to concede defeat when there is no reasonable chance of victory.

I am pretty much a rules maven, and I must admit I had forgotten this little tidbit. Of course, I just blame it on the lesion in my brain (one side-effect is it hammers my short-term memory).

Still, that sentence leaves much to desire. "... no reasonable chance of victory". How exactly are you going to define this, apart from some of the extreme examples given in this thread.

I guess I just don't see it as bad sportsmanship if I want to play something out to the bitter end ... especially if I feel I do have a reasonable chance. It is not as if there isn't a hard and fast time limit. And I am not attempting to stall ... I am making a very strong effort to compete and remain engaged.

At the very least, if my opponent feels that I am being unreasonable, then the situation (at least to him) must be very dire for me. If that is the case, he should have no problem with continuing play, and finishing me off.

When someone asks me to concede (and basically demands it by calling the TO), it smacks of someone running scared.

I will judge it off of my opponent and see if they wish to contine.

I don't see why it's such a silly statement. Let's say you have a HWK with its turret destroyed against a full-HP C-3P0 Falcon with the title card. To even attempt to roll dice to damage it you need to get to range 1 AND block/asteroid it to deny the evade action AND manage end up out of contact so you're allowed to shoot. Fail any of those conditions and it is literally impossible to damage the Falcon. Even if you somehow succeed you still need to roll two hits. And after all that you've still only done one point of damage out of the 13 you need.So, in that situation it's pretty safe to say that you have no realistic hope of winning. You will probably never do any damage, and eventually the Falcon will finish off your HWK. And your opponent is ahead of you by enough points to get a full win, so you can't even stall until time runs out. Your best chance of winning is for your opponent to make a maneuvering mistake and fly their ship off the table, something that is incredibly unlikely. So is it really worth making your opponent go through the formality of finishing off your last ship in the desperate hope that they somehow throw away the win?

If there are 5 minutes left in the round, I'll take my chances that the HWK lives. I remarked several times a Nationals that it is kind of a shame that MOV basically makes us play every game to the bitter end.

In tournaments you should never concede. The margin of victory is determined by the relative amount of points you and your opponent destroy. By you conceding they get maximum Margin of Victory (which helps them) and you would get 0 (which is bad).

This is incorrect.

If a player concedes, all his remaining ships are considered destroyed, but it doesn't change your opponent's losses. If (using the OP's numbers) I've killed 20 points of your ships and you've killed 80 of mine when I concede, the result is 100 to 20, with the calculated MoV as 120 vs. 80.

To the OP's issue... This may be part of the problem. Tournament rules, page 2:

It is considered good sportsmanship to concede defeat when there is no reasonable chance of victory.

I think it's a silly statement, and will never have a problem with someone wanting to play out a game (as I will). Comebacks happen.

But for whatever reason, FFG put that in there, and someone may take it a bit too much to heart.

Wow...that IS unfortunate. That makes me question my stance actually...

It doesn't say that he must concede, just that if there is no perceived chance and the player chooses to, it should be looked at as good sportsmanship.

I think the tone of this line is to ensure that those who choose to concede at such a juncture are not looked at negatively. It's nice to see a game developer take into account the judgmental nature of us gamers and put a line in there to guide our reactions. (because it's not saying that a player should, just how people should treat them if they choose to, in that situation)

In tournaments you should never concede. The margin of victory is determined by the relative amount of points you and your opponent destroy. By you conceding they get maximum Margin of Victory (which helps them) and you would get 0 (which is bad).

This is incorrect.

If a player concedes, all his remaining ships are considered destroyed, but it doesn't change your opponent's losses. If (using the OP's numbers) I've killed 20 points of your ships and you've killed 80 of mine when I concede, the result is 100 to 20, with the calculated MoV as 120 vs. 80.

To the OP's issue... This may be part of the problem. Tournament rules, page 2:

It is considered good sportsmanship to concede defeat when there is no reasonable chance of victory.

I think it's a silly statement, and will never have a problem with someone wanting to play out a game (as I will). Comebacks happen.

But for whatever reason, FFG put that in there, and someone may take it a bit too much to heart.

If Player A had conceded, then A destroyed 20 and B killed 100 for a delta of 80 and MOVs of 180 and 20.

I believe the statement about concession is probably just an oversight carried over from the old rules. It was in the rules when SOS determined tiebreaker and a loss was a loss. It is silly because it is imprecise, but even more silly with the change to MoV.