I'm looking at the Medic spec from AoR, with 3 ranks of Stim Specialization , you can heal 8 wounds on the first Stimpack. To get the same effect from the Heal power , you need the basic power and first control upgrade, with 4 intellect and 4 medecine. The only problem is that taking a stimpack is a manoeuver, and using the Heal power is an action...

I know that the heal power becomes a monster heal when you finally get many upgrades and lots of Force Rating to fuel it... but low to mid level XP characters, heal simply feels weaker then even a normal stimpack...

I think that making the Heal power a manoeuver would make it feel better then the usual stimpack.... just add a line that says that Force Dice used to fuel Heal cannot be used for another Force Power this turn.

Is it just me ???
Why would I invest into heal when a normal stimpack is better ??

For one, stimpacks cost money. For another, they take up space (albeit a small amount of space). And lastly, you can run out.

Besides that, really, all powers are like that, and the argument can be made for everything. Why should I invest in Unleash when I can just buy a Heavy Blaster Rifle? Why invest in Bind when I can toss Stun/Glop grenades?

It's because down the line, the Force is more powerful than blasters, lightsabers, or any sort of physical invention - but it obviously requires that massive amount of dedication to really achieve it.

At first I had a similar opinion, but now I think it was a smart move to balance things out, especially for low/mid level characters. Like you said, Heal really jumps ahead later, when you can heal multiple people at range... though you really have to invest in Force Rating to make it happen. I'm currently playing a Force Sensitive Doctor, and all in all, I like the balance.

I guess it also synergises well with Supreme Reflect and Supreme Parry because a heal power isn't a combat check...

Heal will heal the same amount each time, so you can actually heal more than a Stimpack overtime. Plus, it's always ready, and can heal rather than enduce Strain. Perhaps a better question is, why WOULDN'T you get Heal if you're a doctor type?

I thought the uses of Heal power caused diminishing returns on Stimpacks and future heals uses.

As in you only get 5 applications total of both. One of Heal or Stim for 5, The next of Heal or Stim for 4... etc.

Heal does cause diminishing returns on Stimpacks. However, the Heal power itself remains constant for all five uses, as RAW mentions nothing about 1 less per use when activating the ability. So the way I've played it, the following occurs.

Player A (Int 4, Med 2, Med Ctrl Bonus) heals Player B five times over the course of the session: Stimpack 5, Heal 6, Stimpack 3, Heal 6, Heal 6.

Also, another thing in Heal's favor is how it plays out with the action economy. At first glance, Stimpacks might seem superior, since it only takes a maneuver to use. However, that isn't taking into consideration that you have to draw a stimpack first, which also takes a maneuver, unless you have Quick Draw. Heal is an action, but it is always available.

Common scenario:

Player A needs to heal Player B, who is 1 range band away.

Player A uses a maneuver to reach Player B, then uses a 2nd maneuver to draw a stimpack.

vs.

Player A uses a maneuver to reach Player B, then uses an action to activate Heal.

I really have no problem with a dedicated mundane healer being way better at healing then a dedicated Jedi healer. Your mundane healer isn't going to also automatically be Dr. Death with a lightsaber.

Jedi should be the best at fighting with lightsabers and using the Force. That's their thing even if they have specialties. Let's don't make using the Force a catchall for being better at ANYTHING you want to be. Please allow the other professions to be the BEST at being a mechanic, sharpshooter, doctor, etc.

Adding:

Just think of this. A player started out with a medic for his party. He's expanded on him. He's now a full fledged battlefield surgeon who can keep his friends alive through anything but an ATAT stomp and is handy with a blaster pistol to boot. Doc has become an affectionate contributor to the party and his player is having a blast.

Then a Jedi joins the party. This Jedi, like any, is a death-dealing melee Fighter. With the Force, he's also a Mage of sorts with tricks to get out of many situations. So far so good. Now the Jedi starts delving into being a Cleric healer since that's his latest thing...........and if his healing ability comes anywhere near Doc's, Doc's player may start rightfully rolling his yes and hoping Doc gets to die a glorious pre-reroll-death.

Yes the D&D references are obvious. If there is a single class that combines the powers of Fighter, Mage, and Cleric, and is nearly as powerful in each of those areas as the base classes are themselves, why would anyone be just a Cleric? Even if they do so anyway for the role-playing fun of it, there will still be some resentment that the uber-class guy is just as good as him at his one specialty.

PS: Not a Jedi hater at all. Really.

I really have no problem with a dedicated mundane healer being way better at healing then a dedicated Jedi healer. Your mundane healer isn't going to also automatically be Dr. Death with a lightsaber.

Jedi should be the best at fighting with lightsabers and using the Force. That's their thing even if they have specialties. Let's don't make using the Force a catchall for being better at ANYTHING you want to be. Please allow the other professions to be the BEST at being a mechanic, sharpshooter, doctor, etc.

Adding:

Just think of this. A player started out with a medic for his party. He's expanded on him. He's now a full fledged battlefield surgeon who can keep his friends alive through anything but an ATAT stomp and is handy with a blaster pistol to boot. Doc has become an affectionate contributor to the party and his player is having a blast.

Then a Jedi joins the party. This Jedi, like any, is a death-dealing melee Fighter. With the Force, he's also a Mage of sorts with tricks to get out of many situations. So far so good. Now the Jedi starts delving into being a Cleric healer since that's his latest thing...........and if his healing ability comes anywhere near Doc's, Doc's player may start rightfully rolling his yes and hoping Doc gets to die a glorious pre-reroll-death.

Yes the D&D references are obvious. If there is a single class that combines the powers of Fighter, Mage, and Cleric, and is nearly as powerful in each of those areas as the base classes are themselves, why would anyone be just a Cleric? Even if they do so anyway for the role-playing fun of it, there will still be some resentment that the uber-class guy is just as good as him at his one specialty.

PS: Not a Jedi hater at all. Really.

At first it won't be quite so bad. Every additional trick will cost XP, so it will be a while until the generalist becomes as adept as the specialist.

With enough XP, you are absolutely correct, there will be a point when there isn't quite as much of an incentive based upon the efficacy of each ability. Thankfully, that is why the current system for "jedi" works so well. They are massive point sinks.

Heal does cause diminishing returns on Stimpacks. However, the Heal power itself remains constant for all five uses, as RAW mentions nothing about 1 less per use when activating the ability. So the way I've played it, the following occurs.

Player A (Int 4, Med 2, Med Ctrl Bonus) heals Player B five times over the course of the session: Stimpack 5, Heal 6, Stimpack 3, Heal 6, Heal 6.

Also, another thing in Heal's favor is how it plays out with the action economy. At first glance, Stimpacks might seem superior, since it only takes a maneuver to use. However, that isn't taking into consideration that you have to draw a stimpack first, which also takes a maneuver, unless you have Quick Draw. Heal is an action, but it is always available.

Common scenario:

Player A needs to heal Player B, who is 1 range band away.

Player A uses a maneuver to reach Player B, then uses a 2nd maneuver to draw a stimpack.

vs.

Player A uses a maneuver to reach Player B, then uses an action to activate Heal.

If you purchase the Ranged upgrade, you may not even have to spend a maneuver to move up to them And with Magnitude to boot, you could be healing multiple targets at range.

I'd view it as more of an issue with the choices of the players rather than the game mechanics if a PC Jedi became a better healer than the group's Doctor.

It has more to do with the choices the players make. It's also possible for a different character to take the Doctor or Medic specialization and start putting all their XP into their Medicine skill and talents. In such a case, the original Doctor player would be completely justified in having a word with that player or the GM about the balance of specializations across the group.

If you've already got a slicer in the party, it's just kind of rude to start spending all your XP so you become the best slicer. Likewise with combat skills, with social skills, with any kind of focus you could mention.

Really helps when you are captured by savages, stripped and whipped.

Where would your stimpacks be? How are you going to heal, and amazing the savages as to your godlike abilities and should not be eaten?

That is where the force comes in

Really helps when you are captured by savages, stripped and whipped.

Where would your stimpacks be? How are you going to heal, and amazing the savages as to your godlike abilities and should not be eaten?

That is where the force comes in

I'm fine with that. As long as that Jedi healing is nowhere as effective as Doc's. Doc needs more time and tools, but Doc's healing is oh so much better then the Jedi's. I would hope it remains similar to Doc being the Cleric while the Jedi might have some Lay on Hands Paladin-like ability if he starts putting XP in it. Doc is still going to be the main healer even if the Jedi has some minor healing ability. Again, I'm fine with that.

I wouldn't be fine with the "Paladin" being as good of a healer as the "Cleric". I probably should have started with that analogy in the first place.

If a doctor spends as much xp as a jedi in just healing they can have the doc spec and the medic spec and maybe even the healer spec (I know now we are back into jedi territory) and still be atleast as good healer as the guy that just dumped everything into the heal power especially. Better than him if that guy also decides to be good with a light saber and have any other force power.

If you specialize you will always be better at that thing then someone who is doing more then one thing. The thing about this game is if you don't atleast have some generalization you are either going to be really bored during most parts of the night or you are just going to really suck at them. Unless you are really good at figuring out how to use what you are specialized in during every type of encounter.

Tanarri my character is essentially a force-using version of mcguyver. He'll try to out-tech and out-force move his enemies, lifting grenades, throwing things around and activating random contraptions.
Too bad he's so squishy.

If you specialize you will always be better at that thing then someone who is doing more then one thing. The thing about this game is if you don't atleast have some generalization you are either going to be really bored during most parts of the night or you are just going to really suck at them. Unless you are really good at figuring out how to use what you are specialized in during every type of encounter.

This also depends on the GM. When I look at group composition, I'll often tweak things in an adventure to make sure everyone has a way to contribute. I'm also always open to less combat-oriented characters using their skills in unorthodox ways during a fight. If a someone wants to make a Knowledge (Xenology) check to discover an enemy's weakness, sure! If a character wants to use Charm/Coercion/Leadership to get NPCs to join a cantina brawl on the PCs side, sounds good to me.

I'll be curious to see how the heal power balances out vs somebody with the doctor or medic specializations. You don't want one power to trump an entire specialization, but you still need to keep the power worth taking.

I think it's currently ok as written, but that's why we playtest. My Jedi Healer is still to low level to have even taken the power, all she has so far is the base Move. Heal will probably be added to my list in the next few sessions.