What the hell? Is there a typo here?

Force Bolt: Ordinary +10 WP (i.e., standard attack), 1d10+2 + (2xPR) Pen 0. Can knock things down.

OK, that's fine.

Force Storm: Difficult -10 WP (i.e., full auto), 1d10 + (3xPR) Pen 0.

THIS THING IS INSANE.

Psy Rating 9 : full auto burst each of which does 1d10+27 damage.

Is there a typo here? Should it really be afull-auto version of Force Bolt?

Unrelatedly, I just did some calculations as to what a Shadowseer can get up to with his psychic power.

Whoa.

What Little ol Shadowseer pushing his PR 8 to PR 11 (I think they are counted Bound, so max is +3).

Can maximum manifest 11 bolts, each doing 1d10+33.

I think overkill is the word you are looking for. Lucky that you can at least trie to Dodge those

Look what happens to his Dodge if he uses Precognition.

Yeah, you happened to check Precognitive Dodge.

Hmmm. Does the maximum -60/+60 to Tests rule exist in BC? I can't find it anywhere, but it occurs to me that it is a limiting factor if it does.

Yeah +/-60 is still the maximum modifier in BC. although only places I could find information about that is Summoning Ritual Modifiers and such.

Well I'm sure it's there, some where, under all that clutter.

Well, if you put it up against some of the daemonic weapons that players can make, I'm not really sure it's a problem to be honest.

Yeah +/-60 is still the maximum modifier in BC. although only places I could find information about that is Summoning Ritual Modifiers and such.

Well I'm sure it's there, some where, under all that clutter.

Great that means that on average the Shadowseer is not going to get his full 11 hits: ) More like 5 or 6.

By the way, I can't see this spelled out anywhere -- do BS modifiers (for size, lighting, target running, etc.) apply to psychic bolts/barrages/storms in BC?

Hmmm. Does the maximum -60/+60 to Tests rule exist in BC? I can't find it anywhere, but it occurs to me that it is a limiting factor if it does.

Yeah +/-60 is still the maximum modifier in BC. although only places I could find information about that is Summoning Ritual Modifiers and such.

Well I'm sure it's there, some where, under all that clutter.

Hmm.. I might be having a brain fart, could anyone throw me a page number on that rule? I don't recognize that at all, no matter what core rulebook.

The maximum total bonus that can be applied to a test is +60.
Conversely, the maximum total penalty that can be applied to a test is –60.

pg241

if you knock back force storm to 2x PR it's a little less stupid.

The maximum total bonus that can be applied to a test is +60.

Conversely, the maximum total penalty that can be applied to a test is –60.

pg241

if you knock back force storm to 2x PR it's a little less stupid.

Wow, thanks. I could've sworn that the limit was -90. That's definitely house ruled. +/-60 is way too small when it comes to certain actions and I hate to flat-out say "No" when there's a reasonable chance of success (which is sometimes achievable even with a -90 when stacking certain benefits... ripping bulkheads comes to mind).

Thanks.

Great that means that on average the Shadowseer is not going to get his full 11 hits: ) More like 5 or 6.

By the way, I can't see this spelled out anywhere -- do BS modifiers (for size, lighting, target running, etc.) apply to psychic bolts/barrages/storms in BC?

I think stuff like size, lighting and etc affect Psychic bolt/barrage/storm as they are not specifically tied to BS but are conditional effects.

Hehe, came into mind old "I throw magic missile into the darkness"

I don't have the book in front of me, but I could have sworn that force storm is an AOE (Psychic Storm or something it is classified as) so it isn't a bunch of bolts each hitting for 1d10 + (3xPR), but rather everything in the area takes that damage once...

Nope

psychic Bolt is 1 strike

psychic Barrage's are a couple of strikes

psychic Storm's are several strikes (force storm)

Psychic barrage is the area effected attack/psychic power

Well that does help things then. That means that a Psy Rating 10 WP70 unbound psyker pushing with force storm actually cannot get his PR-mandated 15 maximum possible hits, because his maximum chance is 130 (70+60). On average he will get 8 or 9.

as psy rating 10 and wp 70 that common in your games or just maxing the chances?

I'm just maxing the chances to get an extreme case.

I think stuff like size, lighting and etc affect Psychic bolt/barrage/storm as they are not specifically tied to BS but are conditional effects.

By the way, I can't see this spelled out anywhere -- do BS modifiers (for size, lighting, target running, etc.) apply to psychic bolts/barrages/storms in BC?

No. We had fights in the group about it and I have an email from Tim Huckelbery confirming that in BC Psychic Attacks are different from weapon attacks. Only a Focus Power Test for Psychic Powers, no Darkness/Size/Range/etc. modifiers.

Same goes for quote on p. 241 about +/-60, it addresses only melee and ranged attacks. There's nothing on this limit for Psychic Powers (see Focus Power Test p.208) and there shouldn't be.

Before you start throwing stones in my direction, consider this: what's the worst outcome of failing WS/BS tests? What's the worst outcome of "failing" Focus Power Test?

Can you please post the email from Huckelbery. I would like to see it myself. Not that I wouldn't believe you but like the saying goes "Seeing is believing"

Sure. That's an email chain, so pls read it from the bottom up.

On 2013-06-02, at 6:50 PM, Tim Huckelbery < [email protected] > wrote:

No worries Player2. Technically, no there are no modifiers other than ones the power calls out. Some groups feel that makes some powers too, well, powerful though, so you can try adding in modifiers as if it was a regular shooting attack, but this may swing too far the other way (this is my experience, for what it's worth). Given psykers can potentially kill themselves when using their ranged attack (versus a gunman who isn't too worried about his weapon killing him), I've been fine with allowing psykers to not have any normal modifiers to their "shots."

Is your group having problems with psykers being too powerful when hurling Warp-blasts around? Let me know; I'd love to hear the group's experiences.

Tim Huckelbery

RPG Producer

Fantasy Flight Games

[email protected]

Visit us at http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/

On May 29, 2013, at 8:31 PM, Player2 wrote:

Hi Tim ,

I play Black Crusade with Player1 and appreciate you taking the time to answer our questions. Unfortunately even with your response we're still debating. Could you please help settle the issue for us?

When using psychic powers of the Psychic Bolt category, should the Focus Power test be modified by any and all Combat Circumstances ( p. 245 ) that normally affect Ballistic Skill tests, in particular ones such as:

1. Shooting into Melee combat

2. Size of enemy

3. Range (point blank, short, long, extreme, etc)

4. Darkness / Fog, Mist, Shadow or Smoke

5. Prone / Stunned / Unaware

6. Weather

Thanks in advance for your help in clarifying the issue.

Cheers,

Player2

Sent from my iPad

Begin forwarded message:

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Tim Huckelbery < [email protected] >
Date: Sun, May 26, 2013 at 1:27 PM
Subject: Re: Fantasy Flight Games [Rules Questions] - Black Crusade
To: Player1

Hi Player1! Treat psychic powers that attack like a ranged weapon way the same way as you would a ranged attack. Unless the power says the psyker needs to make a BS test to hit the target, though, there are no modifiers to hit on the attack - if the power works, it is treated like a successful BS test, with the DoS worked out as per page 209.

Tim Huckelbery

RPG Producer

Fantasy Flight Games

[email protected]

Visit us at http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/

On May 23, 2013, at 3:09 PM, Player1 wrote:

Message from:
Player1


Rule Question:
Hi,

Question is, do we treat psychic attacks as ranged ones, regarding bonuses?

Three teammates are engaged in melee combat with single Hulking enemy. Psyker, being 10m away uses Doombolt (Psychic Barrage). Heretek, staying next to Psyker, uses semi-auto attack on the enemy.
According to the rules
- Psyker gets his PR*5 bonus to Willpower to use Doombolt and that’s it. Attack can be dodged like a usual ranged attack.
- Heretek gets Size (+10), Short Range (+10), Shooting into melee combat (-20). Attack can be dodged like a usual ranged attack.

Am I right?

Does Psyker get any bonuses for the size of enemy? Does he get penalty for using power into melee combat?
Are bonuses for Helpless targets applied only to Weapon Skill tests? What about Psykers/ranged attacks?

Thank you!

Thanks

No probs.
And yes, Force Storm is a cool toy for psyker. For the new shiny psyker, without mental disorders, drug addictions etc

Man if you can fire straight into a swirling melee combat, that's one accurate storm of bolts.

Someone posted a note here that once a Psyker one-shotted The Great Unclean One with Force Storm . Might be true