Technically these guys break the rules for minions as their stats are too high, but does anyone think it would blow things wide open if you allowed a player to have one as a minion?

As the GM of my group I had a discussion with my players a while ago about this subject.

Let's first quote page 139 of the core rulebook, there stands under the example minions a CSM for a greater minion, now try to build this one with the minion creation system. This won't go well, so we've ruled that the generic Space Marine from the Adversaries section can be taken as an Greater Minion with no extra cost.

In the next step one of my players asked me, how we should handle the dark eldar incubbi, a god **** stylish bodyguard if you asked me. Comparing him to the generic SM you see, that he's quite a bit more capable in melee, because he has swift attack, and a high agility to dodge anything coming for him. But he will just dodge once a round and then he's quite a bit mre fragile than the SM. Additionaly he's quite bad at shooting (ne real talents for that, low BS…). So I decided to allow this one as an Greater Minion.

I mean, just look at the creation rules. You can easily biuld an mechanical monster with 4 arms, Lightning attack, ambidextrous, Blade Dancer and two Weapon Wielder and give him 4 Power Swords (assuming you character has the infamy). That monster could use 3 Lightning attacks per combat round and dodge/parry a second time…… Imho quite a bit stronger than the CSM and the INcubbi, because these ones aren't minmaxed minoions but somehow complete personalities.

Regarding the characteristic point allocation: my group uses for this part the rules from deathwatch first founding, so you get 300 points with a maximum of 50 to allocate to your minions characteristics. This makes the build minions a bit stronger and they can now compete more easily with the CSM and the Incubbi from the book. Also you should take note, that my group is a pure CSM group, so the extra characteristic points don't matter as much as when human heretics are in the group.

Now looking at the Kabalite and his overall skills I would put him in the Standard Minion of Chaos section, but that opinion is quite a bit influenced by the above changes, so if you feel more comfortable with it, go for the greater minion.

When you feel that the minion of chaos is a little bit to low and greater too high use the following technique:

Look at the difference between a normal and a greater minion, look at the difference between normal minion and the minion your player wants to use and determine the difference in experience points (with this you can also determine costs for minions like posessed CSM, which are stronger than greater minions, when you build him on top of the generic SM). Now say you feel the Kabalite Warrior should cost around 150 points more than an normal minion. Just divide the point difference of 150 roughly by 2, so you get 75 - 100 points (the 100 feels better to me and doesn't look so confusing on the advancement track like the 75). Now add this 75 to the 500 points from the MoC so you get 600 points as cost for the Kabalite warrior.

Seems a little bit little as cost but here is the clue: if the Kabalite warrior dies (which would normally happen sooner or later), your player gets just the 500 points from the minin talent back, the additional 100/75 points are lost forever.

Hope you find some information you can use for your game in the way my group plays the game.

Mr. X