I find it not all that fun to have to go several advances, saving them up, with no real change in your character, while trying to increase a characteristic.

I was thinking of allowing a player to invest a few of the points in your first career, and spend more in your next career to finish off the costs, spreading the cost of a characteristic increase between 2 careers.

Lets say a character uses up his last 2 open advances to place 2 points in strength (he needs 4 points to get his str up), he then finishes up his career. In his next career he spends the remaining 2 points, and increases his STR to 4.

Can you see any problems with this? You could still cap characteristic increase at 5 or 6, so you wouldn't have to fear them increasing something too high.

Romus said:

As long as you have a cap in place, I see no problems.

It gets wonky if their next career doesn't have the same career abilities. Do they have to pay the extra point if they complete paying in a career that doesn't have the attribute in-career? What if they split payment over 3 careers and one where it is out-of-career (maybe the middle one, so they start and end payment with it in-career)?

It gets really wonky if they start paying for an out of career ability, and then enter one where it is in-career.

I would say they have to pay the extra point.

Shouldn't the following be legal?

Career 1: Toughness and Willpower (Current Toughness 4)

OPEN CAREER ADVANCES:
Open Career Advance : Wound 2
Open Career Advance: Action Card 2
Open Career Advance : Fortune 1
Open Career Advance: Reckless 1
Open Career Advance : 1 point in Toughness
Open Career Advance : 1 point in Toughness

Non Career Advance: 1 point in Agility

Non Career Advance: 1 point in Agility

Career 2: Agility and Fellowship (Current Toughness 4, Current Agility 3)

OPEN CAREER ADVANCES:
Open Career Advance : Wound 2
Open Career Advance : Action Card 2
Open Career Advance : Fortune 1
Open Career Advance : Reckless 1
Open Career Advance : 1 point in Agility
Open Career Advance : 1 point in Agility [Agility Goes up to 4]

Non Career Advance : 1 Point in Toughness

Non Career Advance: 1 Point in Toughness
Non Career Advance : 1 Point in Toughness
Non Career Advance : 1 Point in Toughness [Toughness goes up to 5]

Romus said:

Wouldn't the Agility advance cost 5 total because they used non-career advances in that first career?

Otherwise they could have paid 3 non-career advances in the first career and then cap it off with only 1 career advance in career 2 (which seems off).

What happens if you split it over 3 careers, some paying out of career? Does it only matter which career they finish paying in?

--

I'm not saying it's a bad idea. I'm just trying to point out some of the cost issues you have to resolve if you split it.

Doc, the Weasel said:

Yes Agility would need one more point if it was ruled that any points spent in non career advances make you pay the extra point.

The main thing they bring up when reading the rules is that a career characteristics would be capped at 6, and a non career characteristic would be capped at 4. So how about:

- if any point falls into a non career slot, then you have to spend the extra point cost.

- on the flip side of that, if any points spent fall into a career open slot, the characteristic cap is considered a career cap -1 (5). Even if the final points were spent in a career that did not have the characteristic as a primary.

So the advantage of raising a stat within one career, is you can get it to 6.

How does that sound?

Just rule it so that one stat may be raised during a Rank. 1 advance for in-career 2 for out-of-career. It would also force players to take other option as well.

doc_cthulhu said:

The main flaw with that is not all stats are equal. Raising a 5 to a 6 is a lot more powerful than raising a 2 to a 3.

That is true. You could trust your players to raise only certain stats or allow them to make "six points worth of char raises in one rank". This way they could raise one to six or two to three. Etc.

You could also adjust the cost.

Maybe half it (round up). Going to 3 or 4 costs 2 advances, and going to 5 or 6 costs 3. 1 stat per rank.

Alternatively, you could reduce the cost to New Ability-2. So going from 2 to 3 costs 1, 3 to 4 costs 2, etc.

--

Of course, if you do any of this, then you probably want to alter how you buy stats in character creation. Right now, Creation Points match up with the costs in advances, so spending a CP is the same as an advance (with the exception of out-of-career abilities).

(since I didn't offer any suggestions with the last critique, I probably should this time )

I ran some numbers and the new CP if you halved the cost would be Reiklanders 17, Elves/Dwarves 15. If you go with Ability-2, then the CP should be Reiklanders 13, Elves/Dwarves 12. Both should balance mostly out, leaving players with roughly the same number of CP for Actions/Talents/Wealth/Skills as before the change (although it favors buying abilities more than RAW).

I find nothing wrong with the game's approach to requiring multiple-advance cost things be purchased off the same career's set of advances (per the lines on the sheet for advances). This fits with the caps on stats and requires choices by players - life is about choices. Choices have consequences and meaning. A real choice means giving up something else. That's fine by me.