OptimusPrime21 said:

Only if you go through a door. Can't see how a person could safely use a jump pack in doors though

Well, we don't know how tall the ceilings are. It's low enough to hinder parabollic projectiles, but that doesn't mean it's too low for jetpacks.

And that once again shows how ridiculous it is that infantry with Jump can't jump over vehicles, but they can jump over buildings. So if you're inside a building and you need to jump over a tank, you should go outside and just jump over the entire building.

Major Mishap said:

The Allied troops with Jump are all in heavy armor. They could use the jump packs to build up some speed and simply go through any light walls inside. A Armor 2 soldier has enough protection to bust through normal walls without a worry.

That would leave only the heavy walls shown on the boards to have to go around.

I think of the jump troops working more like the writing from the Starship Troopers novel. They used their packs for speed along the ground, because jumping high in the air when you didn't need to tended to make you a sitting duck target, and dead soldiers don't accomplish much. Skimming the ground tended to work more like speed skating.

Extra speed in open areas indoors wouldn't be a problem. You'd need to go through openings to get through the bearing walls into or out of the building, but speed indoors would still be a benefit.

Would be better to call them hover packs instead of jump packs then

Major Mishap said:

Not really. Jump or rocket packs admits they can do large scale jumps and flight, just as the Axis rocket troops do in the comic.

Tactically, they train real world soldiers to never stay exposed more than three seconds, because that's how long it normally takes someone to acquire and fire on a target. That would hold true for jump troops even moreso, because they would be leaving all cover behind if they went very high. Being able to fly, or make large jumps, does not mean it is wise to do so, but it would still speed up a unit's movement.

Most jumps would be very short range, or simply skimming the surface for more speed. When you needed it, however, the extra power to fly would be really important.

I'm curious to see how jump packs interface with the multi-story buildings coming in Operation Cerberus.

OptimusPrime21 said:

Think of it like this (1 + [1) + (1] + 1) = 4. The 1's in the "()" are the move actions, 2 each. The 1's in the "[ ]" are the diagonal. You are moving a total of 4 spaces, but ending the first action in the diagonal movement square. That is where you determine LOS for reactive fire, in the diagonal movement square. When the reactive fire is finished then the squad finishes it's movement into the forward space. Nothing illegal or wrong about that. Otherwise how could a Hot Dog jump over a tank trap in a double movement? Or how can the Grim Reapers jump over a building or water in a double movement? You are combining move actions, but do not need to be in a "valid" square at the end of the first move action, only at the end of the second.

Remember, you have to call all of your actions before you do anything with the unit. So if you say: "I'm going MOVE-MOVE", then you obviously just double the MOVE value and go as far as that takes you.

Algesan said:

I think if anything, this discussion has proved that there isn't anything "obvious" about it at all.

felkor said:

Yes, it has. It's obvious that people have different opinions about how it works.

I go with interpretations that match the diagrams and examples. If something doesn't match, the interpretation is flawed.

According to the new Operation Cerberus rules, a unit with jump still cannot jump and land on top of or enter a higher level of a building. However they have not clarified if a unit, once it has reached the roof of a building, can jump off the top of it. I don't see why they couldn't, but there is no official rule released to date.

Also, it seemed that there is still some confusion or non-"obvious" rules regarding a double move. Gimp and most of them have it right, your just combining the movement point values, so a unit with a move value of 2, would have 4 movement points to use in their Move-Move action. This could be move 3 spaces, then 1 space to move off board, or moving 2 diagonals (1 + 2 = 3) and then forward/back/left/right (3 + 1 = 4). The Hot Dog in every rule book is a great example. A move value of 1, so 2 movement points when performing a Move-Move. When a Tank Trap is blocking it, the Jump skill combined with the 2 movement points (Move-Move) is what allows it to jump over the tank trap in 2 actions. So an Infantry squad of Move 2 and the jump skill could jump over a 3 tile spaced building in a Move-Move action and land on the other side. It only needs to be in a valid space by the end of the activation, not each action. Same goes for any unit performing a Move-Move, your just combining the movement values to give you an overall range of movement.

The question of reactive fire came up in the beginning. Since reactive fire can only happen if the target is withing range, and the unit has a valid LOS. As long as the target is in LOS when it reaches it's half way point of moving, then reactive fire can happen. Like with my previous threads, using the diagonal + diagonal + forward/back/left/right example, the reactive fire would happen if the firing unit has LOS when the unit is in the second diagonal move. When reactive fire finishes, the unit finishes it's final 2 movement points to finish it's movement in the second diagonal and then forward/back/left/right. I'm sure house rules can be discussed, but as of yet there is nothing stating whether or not a unit performing a double move with jump is in LOS.

Fairly straight forward until Reactive Fire is brought into the picture. And I'm sure other groups work reactive fire in this situation differently, but this is the best way our group and their talks on other boards have come up with. Any further constructive criticism and logical though processes are welcome.

I don't see a need for a clarification on jumping off of a roof. They added a single specific restriction when they said you can't land on a roof while jumping. So long as the landing point isn't a roof, there is no restriction.

When you consider the idea that not allowing landing on a roof could be because the unit was trained not to land on things they don't know will support the landing (a good idea to train soldiers with), the limitation makes sense, and fits all of the rules