It's always tough creating a good description when a player wants to use magic sight and there isn't anything to see. I don't like to have to tell them "nothing odd about the winds" after they go through the effort of a making a dice pool and rolling.

Looking for flavor on describing the winds, I opened up my Realms of Sorcery book from the previous edition. On page 35 is a diagram with the 8 winds. I printed this out to keep on the table for when a wizard uses magical sight. I copied this page, and use it thusly:

The diagram is tidily broken up into a circular diagram with 3 "stages" deep into each wind. By default, a token is placed on the middle level of each spoke. If a wind is deficient in an area, I move the token inwards. If the wind is pervasive in an area, I move the token outwards. If the wind is absent, the token is removed. This gave the wizard a very accurate visual that I could supplement with descriptions.

Because the winds of Azyr were pervasive, that token was placed in the outside row. Because the players were in an urban environment, I opted to pull the Ghur and Gyran winds in towards the center.

It is a tool I will definitely use again. I imagine arbitrarily shifting some winds in or out creates some great opportunities for the players to investigate -- whether it helps the task at hand or serves to segue way into a red herring or side quest, It also keeps the names of all of the winds visual on the board at all times to help immersion -- but can be covered up by relevant material until the caster actively turns on his sight.

Just thought I'd share. I'm excited about how this tool turned out.

Sounds like a great idea. Plus, you could give the Wizard player fortune/misfortune depending on if the state of Wizard's particular wind in the area.

I really like this, now I just need a copy of that page...

Sounds very cool indeed. I'll take a look at it, because I've got a wizard apprentice doing exactly that: using magical sight again and again, with me running out of descriptive ways of putting "nope, nothing here"

Amehdaus said:

Totally stealing this idea.

Very Nice, I have that book too and consider idea stolen (never noticed that subtlety to diagram, doh)

Got the page scanned now (**** it's freaking hard to get a good scan on books), just need to print it, perhaps on some thick paper.

Just a small question or two... or three (4...6...)! I know no rules tells this, so really just after how you (and others using this now) go about it

1) Does the players roll affect the way the winds are positioned, I mean do you move their wind inwards/outwards with stars/comets?

2) Do you keep track of the winds "secretly", so the player can risk suddenly getting penalties on his wind (which you have moved inwards), if he doesn't use Magic Sight? And does the position affect the opposed winds? So Hysh and Ulgu can't both be in outmost/inmost position at the same time?

3) Does the position of the other winds affect the players magic rolls? Example Light Wizard trying to cast, Hysh is at center, but Ulgu is in furthest position, thus Ulgu makes using Hysh more difficult, and thus getting 1 misfortune dice?

4) Do you let the winds affect only Channeling/casting, or both? I assume I'll let it affect channeling only, as I've always seen magic in warhammer as an "Inhale" of the wind, followed by an "Exhale" of wind (with accompanied magic), this is also why to much power is stressful, just like if you inhale to much air, it's hard to keep it in your lungs.

5) Which benefit does the player get from knowing the position of the winds, can he compensate for lack of Hysh, thus eliminating penalties, etc...?

6) Can the player make his magic sight check easier/harder by only wanting to know certain knowledge? 1 Challenge dice for just wanting to know about his own wind, 2 Challenge dice for wanting to know about other winds (2 challenge dice+1 misfortune for his own and another wind), 3 Challenge dice for wanting to get the whole picture...?

7) Any punishments for "abusing" it? "I check the wind every round!" Does the player have to close his eye, and spend a full round focusing? It's not like he can anger any Gods, and neither does he risk corruption like when he uses magic. I guess the best solution would be to rely on the player being a good role-player, and not abuse it

In keeping with the relative easy of use for most of the mechanics in WFRP3 instead of tracking all the winds with tokens I suggest using the beautiful table as a sort of Juju board.

1) As i've used it, the player's roll does not affect how they are positioned. To me, it shows how the winds are and what is visible on even a failed check when the sight is toggled "on."

2) The beauty is that I don't have to keep close track of the winds, secretly or otherwise. If one or two winds are relevant to the plot, I'll take care that those are in a correct position. Personally, I arbitrarily place the other winds. The players don't know it's arbitrary, but they get a visual and an unforseen story progression can rise from that unplanned information (my GM-style emphasizes running where the players' minds wander rather than intense pre-planning).

Generally, in a city, I make sure Jade and Amber are reduced, while in a dense forest Jade will almost always be strong -- so the setting does play into my choices a little.

3-4) For me, it's too much book-keeping to have that much interaction of winds. I will grant a white or inflict a black to Channeling if the caster's wind is strong or weak. Also, I will allow a broader range of cantrips to be cast more easily if a wind is strong (i.e. lighting the campfire cantrip is simpler if Bright is dominant, but the miscast if it comes up will have related consequences -- there go your eyebrows).

5-7) My players, fortunately, have not tried to get too much more than a presence-detector out of magic. I always set it at 2 Challenge regardless of what there is to see. Before I found the chart, I'd give false wind readings tied to random objects on a star, but the player never caught on and I felt bad that his cache of random "magical items" was just trash (a player who gets frustrated easily).

A player has never yet needed to maintain magical for any duration. The rules from this edition and previous tend to treat it as a toggle. I generally describe the Matt Parkman or Hiro (Heroes) expressions when they focus on the magic sight. They generally want a glimpse to get their bearings and then move on. I view the act as unfocusing your eyes to view the auras around and permeating objects of the world. I imagine something like Predator or Alien vision modes from the AvP video game and attempt to relay information through such lenses.

As long as the player is willing to spend a maneuver each round (the cost of making a skill check), I would allow them to maintain a constant vision. Conveniently, this allows them to maintain it at no cost if idle and at building stress if they are not. I truly do love the stress/fatigue aspect of this game.

It might be a cool thing to combine with tracking or investigation. "Another wind is revealed as you follow it past the old gnarled, tree."

jh