I have to admit, I don't use 90% of the stuff that comes with this game for MY END as the GM. I've bought the creature vault, guide, GM's toolkit, etc. I don't use nemesis tracking cards, npc organization tracking, party tracking cards (mainly b/c my players arent' interested in it), I wing the use of ACE (I don't sit there and account every..single..extra..die..used), "storm trackers", and _most_ action cards. I'm tending just to use basic actions and add a descriptor instead of an expertise die or critical (so rather than do a critical, I have the character get knocked down, dragged into the bushes, weapon disarmed or whatever I feel is appropriate for the roleplay of the situation).

This get's a bit ranty and I've found much of the GM-as-Accountant getting a little too D&D4e for my taste. I would however LIKE to use some of this stuff if I could find a way to make them more useful to my game. I just don't see the point to most of it and would like to hear opinions about how you guys are finding those components useful and not taking extra time from the game doing accounting. I'm also doing a bit of research for what would be neat to add to our scenarios in LF9.

Any suggestions?

jh

I use nearly all. I use coloured stone counters instead of the chits provided with game for stress or fatigue and also for wounds, using draws of cards only for crits.

I use ACE budgets as set out, with the Fatigue/Stress goes against A/C option (never much liked wounds to run a bit further)

I use the NPC organization rules sparingly, for Swarms and occassionally other times (you only get Daemon Instability via the group card).

About the only things I wing are:

- the Nemesis rules where I mostly just give the "nemesis" a bigger A/C/E budget with a mental note to reserve a chunk of the A/C for absorbing Fatigue/Stress.

- NPC's having to channel etc. for power to work spells - often they give NPC's that don't have to, but I don't like slowing down for that.

Storm Tracker - in a clear upright business flyer stand using an eraseable marker to show status - worked great, constant reminder to group (I use those stands instead of a screen to show whatever's relevant at moment). Such extra trackers usually get that "under plastic marker" treatment or a paperclip instead of chits.

I don't find it complicated, but that's just me. I left D&D for it being complicated but that is "complicated with constant rule look ups" etc. which I don't find Warhammer.

Emirikol said:

I use most of it. I don't find it "accountant-y" at all. The only things I feel I work to track is ACE, but since that's per-group rather than per-creature it's not bad. Sometimes I forget to handle party tension, but I never worry about missing it.

Emirikol said:

This is telling.

I'm no fan of 4ed, but one thing it isn't is a GM-as-Accountant game. There's a lot less for the GM to track than in 3.xed (and many other games for that matter).

If you see 4ed that way, then yes then WFRP's stuff is going to seem like a lot as well.

--

In the end, though, play it in a way that is fun for you. You're not doing anything wrong if you are having fun.

I tend to wing ACE dice, adding with a party has good combat-prowess, and never use nemesis cards.
I find that I just use nemesis characters as an excuse for me (if only quickly) to actually "play" the game. And that means I sort of track their goals myself, without needing to move markers on how far they are with their goals. I just roll as a player would for some checks and let that be the outcome. Sometimes during the game, sometimes while preparing the session.

Storm tracker though, as well as reputation (Witch's Song) with factions, are great, as is the party-sheet. Those trackers are a clear reminder to players when they did something "wrong" or "right".

I've yet to use diseases however, I think those will come into play when the dwarven mercenary goes ironbreaker

I use most everything; though I also tend to create my own tracker cards and other play aids, using the published content as springboards for things I want to do.

I do wounds like valvorik for everyone at the table, tossing out cards for crits only. Tracking wounds with hatch marks on a post-it or chits or beads is up to the individual ( I use a jug of glass beads that has survived my ownership for about 13 years or so because they tend to scatter less than the card stock chits ).

For trackers I use a combination of paper-clips and scribbling on post-its ( I think I have probably kept 3M in the green on my use of post-its, sticky tabs and other miscellany in my gaming through the years...thank the dark gods Romy and Michelle invented them in the 80's ). However, some trackers I just ignore and rely on the savvy of my players ( the Investigation tracker in Eye for an Eye seemed wankish so I left it out ).

For monsters/adversaries/NPC's/Santa Claus I like using the monster group sheets, and I like the tactical side of having actions locked out by NPC/monster type. It keeps me focused on the encounter, and I find that I actually try to use my monsters/adversaries better when I know that a certain ability is only available to one poke in the pile. I know a lot of people hate the henchmen rules, but I ran a quick scenario last month after watching Gangs of New York again that involved a riot in the streets of Altdorf ( with a few Sham 69 tracks on in the background)...no one thought my mobs were timid and weak :-)

I leave it to my players how they want to arrange their characters on the table. As long as they are able to track their own cooldowns, compile their skill pools, etc I don't care if they write it all down or tape the cards to the wall and throw darts at them ( however, I am spoiled by the fact that our group has been gaming together for a long time, we all truly love gaming of all kinds, and we have been playing WFRP for long enough that we get into fights about the logistics and economics grain shipments on the Reik vs creating an aggriculture guild to dispense it all locally ). Emerikol it sounds like your players are actively chaffing against the system to a certain extent which can really wear on any GM. Sorry dude that sucks. Come on out to Portland, OR sometime :-)

As far as the tracking load required for the GM in v3 versus other roleplaying games ( any edition of D&D...pick your favorite ). You aren't going to get away from accounting and tracking in any game. Thems the breaks with pen and paper rpgs. The thing I like about WFRP in its current incarnation is that the tracking IS the end result. In other games you are tracking just as much in-game and then have to dig through rule books, custom rule refferences or other miscellany to actually adjudicate the situation. WFRP v3 makes you actively track a lot of things, but that's the end of it. It helps keep me focused on the story and adjusting events to the group ( since you are either a mouse or a man, and in both cases your carefully laid plans will go awry )

Here's an example (from another thread I posted in) of the 'stream lining' I've done for my own game. This is for tracking Wounds and ACE values for NPCs and Henchmen.

I print out sheets of these on cardstock and cut to size. I just keep a pile of them nearby for an ad hoc encounters (that don't already have their own sheets prepared in advance). Makes for easy tracking.

HedgeWizard said:

I do this too.

I've stripped the wounds deck to half and left doubles from conditions (as well as spells, miracles and tokens) to storage as I've no use of them most of the time. I use colored glass jewels instead of card board tokens and my players have collecting card-sheet for their cards (those with 9 pockets) mainly because we used to play outside. We're also using my character sheet that usually keeps the trackers in minimum.

I have however introduced the bitz and pieces in several session. The patron sheets weren't there before the characters reach "the green line" and my group saw them as simple gaming enchanment and were quite happy to check what they could offer.