How does this work. Counter attack allows you to make an attack at minus 20 after parrying. Iron hands doesn't allow you to wield a weapon in that hand yet sheaths your hand in a field of energy tough enougth to parry with. How do you handle the counter attack? is it a basic unarmed attack at d5-3 plus strength even though you are punching with a power armoured hand sheathed in practicly indistructable energy!

dean said:

I'd rule that, if you have a melee weapon handy, you can use that for the counterattack. IIRC, nothing in the Talent description says that you must counterattack with the hand/weapon that you used to Parry. I just take it to mean that you're so good at defending that you can take advantage of the opponent's brief opening in his guard to make some sort of melee attack back at him, which could be a chainsword slash, punch, kick, or even spitting acid in his eye. I'll have to double check when my book is handy to see if there are any rules or conditions I'm forgetting.

I would indeed make it unarmed, although for a space marine an unarmed attack is something like 1d10+str bonus which is only marginally less deadly than a combat knife

Combat knife is now only str +1d10. The only advantage of it over melee is Pen 2.

After checking the book, which says you have to use the weapon you used to Parry, I'd keep the counterattack confined to an Unarmed strike, which isn't all that bad as has already been pointed out. All the more reason for Librarians that rely on that ability to wear a Power Fist or Lightning Claw on that hand.

I womdered if they did more unarmed damage. Were does it say that anyway and does it still suffer the minus 20. and is it primitive? according to the rules you cant use power fist or lightning claws as they are weapons

Space Marines have Unarmed Master (or whatever the name is) and so their Unarmed attacks are not primitive

dean said:

dean said:

All DW start with the Unarmed Master Talent, which says the characters do 1d10-3+Strength Bonus in damage and isn't counted as Unarmed (so no -20 to attack armed opponents). The attack is still Primitive.

If you read the rules for Iron Arm, it says you can't wield a weapon, climb, etc. The emphasis is on the word "wield," which I take it as you can't hold on to a weapon to use it because your arm is surrounded in energy. If you are already wearing a Lightning Claw or Power Fist, you can't use them to attack.

Here's where it gets kinda tricky. My group couldn't find anywhere in the book where it said how long it took to turn off a sustained Power, so we ended up settling on using the same action as it takes to activate it (or just not paying the cost when your turn comes back up, of course). In this case, it came up when the Librarian with Iron Arm active leapt from a collapsing building and wanted to climb to safety on a nearby tower. Because Iron Arm can be activated as a Reaction, we agreed that it could be deactivated with a Reaction. In this case, I'd allow the field to be deactivated to allow a counterattack with a PF or LC. The upside is that the character can do more damage. On the other hand, the character can't reactivate Iron Arm until the next round, so he's in trouble if there are more attacks coming his way.

Brand said:

no thats unarmed warrior talent. unarmed master is 1d10+strength and the attack is not primitive

My mistake. I quoted the wrong Talent. Who knew Unarmed Warrior and Unarmed Master would be so close together?

Brand said:

lol **** you alphabetical order DAAAAAMMMNNN YOOUUU

Darn, it would take a tactical genius to hide those talents one near the othe...

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