Hi, I have two questions about the Survival game mode (broodwar expansion):

1) The rules state "The game modes in this section may not be used with the “Optional Rules” (page11), [...]" (Game Modes, p. 11) - I suppose this restriction doesn't apply to the Survival game mode, right?

2) In the Survival game mode, there are no special victory conditions - does that mean that only the SVC leadership cards are removed, or all leadership cards, or how is it handled?

We played Survival with the Leadership cards, but I wouldn't recommend playing it at all. It's long and doesn't come to an end; classic StarCraft is much better IMHO.

@Hell: Willkommen zurück Hab ich dich angefixt?

It took my 5 hours to finish a Survival game with only 2 players.

I wouldn't recomend it at all.

That's exactly what I meant. It takes too much time for no more fun at all.

HëllRÆZØR said:

I think what they mean is that you could play with leadership cards, but if you choose the one with special victory, the special victory part doesn't apply. You still get the starting workers and units and such.

Stefan said:

There are lots of ways to shorten the game; for example forbid Defend Orders, reduce the number of available bases to 3 or 4, remove some event cards like reinforcements or perfect defense plan etc. - you get the idea.

Stefan said:

@Hell: Willkommen zurück Hab ich dich angefixt?

Ja verdammt - ich hab' mir die ganze Nacht um die Ohren geschlagen um mich ausreichend über die Erweiterung zu informieren! ^^

BTW, I just realized that it may happen that all players run out of extra bases and cannot build new ones. Then, it's possible that no player is able to destroy an enemy base, because none can reach planets which are not adjacent to planets where they have a base, so the Survival Game Mode may end in a draw.

Problem is that the players are fast down to one or two bases, so the game speed slows down really much. In the beginning of survival, the players attack each other hard and all is cool, but when a player has only one base left, it becomes really hard to get him. Another option would be that the players start with all their bases on board and loose if the last one is destroyed. That would also skip the expansion phase, so you could go right in the action and after the other players throats. I have to test that one if I have the possibility.

I concur, there is no reason to expand in Survival mode until you have teched to teir three units. So victory always goes to the guy that turtles. You know, after a 12 hour game...

That's why I would give incentives for aggression like bases pre-set, and you just can't rebuild them.

What do you think about a game mode where base "frags" are counted? The first player to destroy x bases wins, no other victory conditions (except everyone else eliminated). This would give an incentive to attack, instead of having a cold war for the first rounds, and the game often ends before all but one player is eliminated. To ensure that the weakest player isn't robbed of his bases over and over again, I'd rule that a player must destroy bases of as many different owners as possible; so if the "frag limit" is 3, we have the following:

- 2 players: Destroy 3 bases from your opponent

- 3 players: Destroy 2 bases from 1 player + 1 base from the other player

- 4+ players: Destroy 3 bases from different players

If players are eliminated, the required distribution of destroyed bases changes, so it's not impossible to win if a player is eliminated, and you didn't destroy a base from that player. E.g., if you destroyed 2 bases from one player and 1 base from another player in a 4 player game, and the player from which you didn't destroy a base is eliminated, you would immediately win, because now the victory condition for 3 player games also applies.

Edit: Since CPs are useless, the same rules as in Survival games should apply to them.

That is certainly a creative idea, but I would play that as a turtle and techer just as I would any other survival game. Sure, attacking early has it's advantages, but it leaves you all the more open to be attacked as well. where as I don't think it would be a Cold War, it would all depend on starting with a resource rich planet, like Braken Ro, and holding it down while you tech to Archons and Templars and then rolling over your weaker enemies.

Who has destroyed the most bases at the end of turn X wins?