Throwing things (fellow Marines and compact cars)

By Sandepande, in Deathwatch Rules Questions

The other day I was planning my, hopefully glorious, Deathwatch campaign, when I noticed that Space Marines are not only able to carry a small-ish sedan around, but also to throw it pretty far (with an excellent Strength roll, up to fifty metres). It might not be a very accurate throw, but it is the distance I'm interested in.

While this inevitably suggests interesting solutions as how to breach certain defenses (throw your squad mates over them), it also seems a tad unrealistic. The rule says that anything up to the Carrying capacity may be thrown, but makes no effort to separate a bottle of beer from an Assault Marine. I find this distrubing, because there clearly are situations where it would be beneficial for the characters to be able to toss things like ammo packs, weapons or medium-sized aircraft carriers to each other.

However, I am somewhat stumped as to figure out reasonable numbers. How far is far enough? Mass would need to affect this, too, obviously...

Bothersome stuff.

Unless your players are rolling up 20's for their initial strength and toughness I don't see it happening. "Whilst wearing their power armor, an unarmed space Marine typically stands slightly over 2.1 metres tall and weights between 500-1,000kg." Factor in the fact that the space marine is going to be armed to the teeth especially if he's carrying heavy weapons with ammo and your increasing alot of weight- not only for the object you need to carry, but also the the person already heaving plenty of equipment. Just carrying a Godwyn bolter adds 18, + 1.8 for each clip which can be anywhere from 6-20. Which, could add an extra 30 pounds. Heavy weapons would easily include ~100-140 extra kg, assuming the ammo pack also carries the 10% weight rule.

Until you start breaking the combined total of 18 TB, technically it won't really happen, as that is the max lifting weight/2 (or as you point out, simply the carrying weight) that is greater than 1,000kg. You can always make something that is going to be greater than his usual lifting weight to have a huge modifier to it.

On a low gravity world, well- they can have all the fun they want :P

The average starting marine has a Str + T bonus of 18. 41 Str 41 T, double both + 2 for power armor. Add in a Str/T advance (possibly just one, if you have a 45-49 in either Str or T) or the +Str armor history, and you're pushing 19-20. In a game I'm running the Storm warden started with str 60 Str, 50 T and the +Str armor after initial 1k xp. That gives a Str/T bonus of 25. Going by 450kg per point over 20 (continuing the pattern from 17-20), that's a carry capacity of 4500kg.

I'm pretty sure he could carry or throw a marine.

A marine is a strong, tough thing. They can throw grenades farther than some weapons can shoot. They can't, however, throw cars that far. If you want a simple solution, use the size table on page 249 and just invert the modifiers. Since they can only throw something up to half their lifting weight, it's not like they can throw tanks or rhinos (both are likely well above 5 tons), though they could throw bikes and such. Titans and Baneblades, for obvious reasons, are right out. If they try to throw things more than half their lifting weight, they take an additional -20 to the check.

Feat of Strength, however, still makes this messy, but then it's a once per day ability.

So they cannot throw Rhinos with their bare hands, but what about the Techmarine's servo arm? It has a Strength of 75 with Unnatural Toughness.

Could they launch a fellow Battle-Brother or transportation unit?

They might get said battle brother or vehicle into the air, but with what degree of accuracy? Neither is exactly aerodynamic or light.

Decessor said:

They might get said battle brother or vehicle into the air, but with what degree of accuracy? Neither is exactly aerodynamic or light.

Nothing made to Imperial specs is aerodynamic or light, not even the things meant to fly!

Not aerodynamic? True, but I'm glad I found this thread because my GM will totally go for this because it could be awesome.

We are all about the rule of cool, scene points and go epic or go home.

HappyDaze said:

Nothing made to Imperial specs is aerodynamic or light, not even the things meant to fly!

Well there are bullets. gui%C3%B1o.gif And those bulky aircraft generally have massive engines powering them.

I just have an urge to attach a HL232 V12 engine block to a length of anchor chain as a proper, manly-mans space marines flail.

Hotfoot said:

A marine is a strong, tough thing. They can throw grenades farther than some weapons can shoot. They can't, however, throw cars that far. If you want a simple solution, use the size table on page 249 and just invert the modifiers. Since they can only throw something up to half their lifting weight, it's not like they can throw tanks or rhinos (both are likely well above 5 tons), though they could throw bikes and such. Titans and Baneblades, for obvious reasons, are right out. If they try to throw things more than half their lifting weight, they take an additional -20 to the check.

Feat of Strength, however, still makes this messy, but then it's a once per day ability.

Astartes grenades have a whopping SBx3 metre range. That means 90 metres at Extreme. However, when they can (according to the rules) throw a five-hundred kilogram boulder half that distance, my eyebrow twitches. If you ask me, Marines should be able to throw those grenades really, really far. The accurate range could be SBx3, though.

Reversed Size modifier looks like a good idea; just substitute Size with weight, and then give an according penalty to SB and calculate the throwing distance from that (I'm inclined not to require a Strength test, unless somebody wants to overexert themselves)... Lighter items could add to the SB, making the grenades somewhat more impressive (and "realistic").

Aerodynamic objects, like spears, could have a range of SBx6, grenades and the like could have SBx3 and everything else is SBx1. Normal rules for Extreme and Long ranges would apply.

I'll have to think about this. Thanks to everyone for their feedback!

A game session or two ago we actually did throw our fellow assault marines at the enemy (they didn't have jump packs for this mission)
needless to say throwing a frenzying blood angel at the enemy is surprisingly effective.
I want this put down as a squad power - angry marine assault.

we can get away with this but the gm draws the line at letting me surf on the back of the assault marines with my heavy bolter.

Urgh, this remind's of wolverines 'fast ball special' which immediately makes me hate it.

In my book if one marine is throwing another it's because he doesn't like him.

I ended up talking to my GM and with my group's Assault Marine and they were both down for the idea, so we concocted a plan to be executed eventually.

The Assault Marine and I, a Techmarine, are Space Wolves and we thought it would be AWESOME if one day I use my Servo-Arm to hurl my Battle-Brother towards the enemy and in mid-air he will ignite his jump pack, going the extra distance and wreaking awesome havoc.

im going with common sense not broken tables on this one.

lifting 4,5 tons is plain silly, if u can carry 2,250 kg on your self i wonder why u cannot carry quadrupled heavy bolters each hand? 8 heavy bolters weight around 500kg, lets take half tone ammo for each... or other mindless idea.

lifting 4,5 tons? not even power armour could withstand such weight lifted, it would end crushed like tin can.

For our gaming purposes marine in power armour can comfortably carry around 225-337kg, lift around 450-674kg and push around 1,5 tons. (withouth tiring himself too much in process and only in power armour).

gorezerker said:

I ended up talking to my GM and with my group's Assault Marine and they were both down for the idea, so we concocted a plan to be executed eventually.

The Assault Marine and I, a Techmarine, are Space Wolves and we thought it would be AWESOME if one day I use my Servo-Arm to hurl my Battle-Brother towards the enemy and in mid-air he will ignite his jump pack, going the extra distance and wreaking awesome havoc.

Then, you should paint yourself in green and shout WAAAGGGGHHH ! all the time... I think marines don't throw their comrades around because they are quite proud and dignified. Jump pack are part of the basic assault marine equipment and other can easily have one.

Still, the tremendous lifting / throwing capacity of a marine could be used for some dramatic and epic scenes. Like a tactical marine using a civilian car as a big shield to provide cover to his battle-brothers while the kill team is charging an heavily defended position (final sanction, my players taking back the astroport). I think the image of a charging Deathwatch Ultramarine with a car as shield followed by to other marines under the fire of an heavily defended heretic position is far more "Deathwatch like" than the same Ultramarine throwing his friends on the heretic position...