I enjoy the WFRP magic system as is, but during a conversation with my wife on the subject of wizards I began to think that perhaps they could/should be able to learn spells from different winds. My idea was this: during character creation and all through the Apprentice Wizard career you would use RAW, then upon moving in the career of Acolyte you may choose to start learning spells from one different wind, then again at Wizard, and so forth. Any thoughts on how I could flesh this out further would be appreciated. I realize this goes against the setting of Warhammer itself, but if anyone has any mechanical considerations that I might be overlooking please let me know. Again this is just a fresh idea that I just wanted to put out there and see where it goes.

Amani said:

Well, if You already decided to go against the setting, then my first thought would be add a challenge, or misfortne to any spell beyond your starting order, 2 challenge or misfortune for another, and so on...

"Well, if You already decided to go against the setting..."

Maybe I'm reading to much into this, but the way you capitalize "You" in that sentence makes it sound like I'm a home-wrecker or something. I hope this isn't sacred territory for anybody. Lol.

Moving on to the added difficulty idea, yeah I could see that; especially the misfortune die. Alternatively or possible along with this I was thinking of only allowing spells of one rank lower. So an amber acolyte, for instance, could choose to learn a rank 1 Jade spell but not a rank 2.

Thanks for the input.

Amani said:

I'm actually try to use capitalised first letter when spelling "You" every time I use it, when I turn to someone on the forum.

Where I live a capitalised first letter is a form of salutation and politeness.

A bit formal, but I use it anyways.

Sorry if You felt offended.

Sunatet: Naw, its cool.

English is probably one of the few languages that capitalizes 'I' instead of 'you'. I wonder if that means anything...

(Dutch used to capitalize 'you' ('U') too, but nowadays it's considered old fashioned.)

The Winds of Magic gives the rules for learning spells of a different Wind. Basically, it is hard to learn them, they are dangerous to cast and even attempting it is a capital offence. Wizard's discovered even seeking grimoires outside there own college will probably be executed.

Unless you are playing a wizard-on-road-to-corrupt character concept, you would be mad to do it.

Yeah I read those rules, and admit thet fit within the flavor of Warhammer as written, but I was just contemplating changing that flavor slightly to accommodate players who want to use multiple types of spells. Seems like a small concession, limiting spells from different schools to a new Career Rank is still a fairly significant limitation compared to how magic works in most other fantasy games. Also might still be able to use the rules from the Winds of Magic if a caster still chooses to learn from another school and he has not reached his next Rank.

Imo the issue is that the current (including WoM) spell-list is very limited.

We also need more guidance on what is possible with Cantrips and magical 'Perform a Stunt'. For instance, are Cantrips/Magical Stunts limited to effects within the domain of the wizard's College - can only Bright wizards light candles? I think the scope of what a Wind can do is/should be a little wider than the headlights suggest. I think some of the published spells underline this - but we have no real guidelines on this.

I would like to see a set of petty/lesser magic cards that any wizard can learn. In actuality each college knows into own version - power by its own Wind - but all colleges know how to achieve a few common effects.

Unfortunately I don't think this is a direction we shall see.

Fresnel said:

For cantrips, i've dug into my massive pile of D&D books and basicaly said "if its a 0 level spell, and the flavor fits, you can use it as a cantrip" which has made them much more interesting, though not rly all that powerful. I don't worry too much about Winds when it comes to cantrips, i figure the effects are small enough to fit under the 2E headings of petty or hedge magic, any pretty much anyone can use them.

I don't see an issue with allowing it, but bear in mind you'll be greatly increasing the power of Wizards in your game without a counterbalance. I would probably say you can cast spells from one other related wind (A Light Wizard likely isn't going to learn Amethyst spells, as they're opposed Winds), as long as it is one rank lower than your primary wind. So if you can cast Rank 2 in your primary Wind, then you can cast Rank 1 of another related Wind. When you advance to Rank 3 in your primary, you can cast Rank 2 of your selected secondary, and add Rank 1 in a tertiary.

Next, I'd probably add a Challenge to each cast outside your Wind, with an additional misfortune for each rank of spell beyond 1. So a Rank 2 Grey Order spell cast by an Amethyst Wizard would add an additional Challenge and Misfortune to the roll.

If Corruption is generated, I'd add an additional Corruption for each "step" away from the primary Wind, as well as for each Rank of spell. I'd also draw two miscast cards in the case of a miscast and apply one of the GM's choice.

Personally, I wouldn't change the rules at all, but if you're wanting a more magic-heavy setting, then I'd probably add in what I have above.

Fresnel said:

The way my group does it at least, is that it must fit the wind somewhat, but then again, we are a creative bunch. For example, our Bright Wizard tried to prevent some klutz from dropping his Merschaum pipe to the floor, likely smashing it. He used a Cantrip to heat up the air below the pipe, making it expand and thus pushing the pipe back up in the air, enabling him to grab it before it hit the floor.

A gold wizard might use Chamon to harden the pipe, prevent it from shattering when it hits the floor. A Jade wizard make a summer's breeze blow it towards him. A celestial wizard could make a wind from the heavens do the same. Or maybe he would have foreseen it happening, thus acting before it was dropped. An amber wizard make a bird fly down and save it for him.

And don't ask how a light, grey or amethyst wizard would prevent this from happening >.>

ZexionII said:

Creative and loose with physics. A clay pipe would have a terminate velocity of 50+ mph. To achieve such an updraft, the superheated air would kill the klutz and all those around him...

Better stick to mystical arguments imo.

For example: Aqshy encompasses a fire's motion and fluidity. It is the nature of fire to jump up to the heavens. Its smoke and sparks gain the same quality and thus rise through the air... By the mystical arts the Bright wizard can imbue the pipe with this quality - causing it to rise like a spark from a flame.

In any case, as you note amethyst wizards are screwed.

This assumes that the updraft in question would be used to not only halt the momentum of a pipe which has somehow reached terminal velocity in a short distance, but reverse the trajectory.

I read it as a draft used to slightly slow the fall, which would still require a huge amount of heat considering the shape of a clay pipe and the lack of wind resistance it offers in a freefall. Of course, the Emperor rides a Griffin, the Dark Elves survive with seemingly little food sources, and Dwarfs cannot be mutated (except for those that can!) so a certain amount of disbelief can be employed to reward players for ingenuity.

Darrett said:

To clarify - I wasn't suggesting it had reached terminate velocity. However, you would need an updraft at that speed to get a drag equal to gravity.

Fresnel said:

An Amethyst wizard just looks at the pipe sternly and it behaves

Conversely to some of the above opinions, one could allow cantrips to do just about anything, to underscore the fact that magic really does not follow the rules that humans have imposed on it.

If you want a wizard PC to have a broader selection of spells, I would suggest you have the player come up with an 'order-version' of a spell using one of the other wind action cards as a template. The results/effect lines can possibly be similar (or even the same) but the fluffy description is different.

For example, a BW wants to make a version of Pool of Shadows. Hmm... Instead it is a flash-burned cloud of smoke and cinders that is summoned/created. The effects could be the same, [bB] for those in it and messes with LOS, or slightly modified with GM agreement.

I would do something like this, rather than just directly allow a wizard to manipulate a different Wind. As has been mentioned by others, it is a *serious* infraction to dabble in other winds unless you're a high ranking Wizard in the College.

Well the point behind this is that I am contemplating a change to the game in that all winds are accessible to wizards, I'm just looking for ideas on implementation. I'm not concerned that it is supposed to be taboo because I'm thinking of a Warhammer in which it isn't. That being said your idea is great and can be implemented in my alternative Warhammer and the original. Thanks.