Let s face it, the new field commander rule is a big change.

The only possible choice fir the empire so far is general weisz, which is also quite -well totally- useless now.

So with my group of players we theorized:

5 pts general weizs gains field commander, loses arsenal 4 and gains coordinate vehicle

Would it be too much?

Would it make it a viable choice (considering you should forfait the other two pilots)

Let's discuss

You're not talking about adding stuff, you're talking about making him a completely different upgrade. He's not totally useless, especially now that he's only 1 point. I'd be fine with him gaining Field Commander and going back to 5 points or so, but there's no reason to wipe the slate clean.

If you have to price something at minimum, it means it simply does not worth.

So just redo it.

Of course it would still be possible to give him field commander and arsenal4.

2 minutes ago, toffolone said:

If you have to price something at minimum, it means it simply does not worth.

So just redo it.

Of course it would still be possible to give him field commander and arsenal4.

That's not true at all. There's plenty of reasons for things to be 1 point (or 0 points). I think he's actually priced correctly at 1 point given that he taps. Also, he only grants Arsenal 2.

3 minutes ago, toffolone said:

If you have to price something at minimum, it means it simply does not worth.

I disagree with this. The Pathfinder's weapon for example was reduced from 6 points to 0 and is a great addition to the unit.

I think that reducing Weiss to 1 was because actually the only option to use it's effect at full strenght is if you fully equip your AT-ST in which you will be already spending a lot of points. Before he wasn't used much because adding 10 more points to that unit when you already have spent a lot wasn't always appealing, but for only 1 point you can seriously consider it.

This aside, I agree with you that it could be good for him to also have Field Commander.

I'd postulate the only reason Gen Weiss and Ryder or Wedge didn't get field commander is that FFG had planned on releasing the mini van transport wave for Rebels and Empire and didn't want to NOT sell as much as they could. Because CIS and GRepublic are newer, they have less command options and probably won't have a similar release for some time. (We'll see if they can fill out some of the other categories first)

50 minutes ago, buckero0 said:

I'd postulate the only reason Gen Weiss and Ryder or Wedge didn't get field commander is that FFG had planned on releasing the mini van transport wave for Rebels and Empire and didn't want to NOT sell as much as they could. Because CIS and GRepublic are newer, they have less command options and probably won't have a similar release for some time. (We'll see if they can fill out some of the other categories first)

I agree, the party buses are gonna come with a commander to get sales.

It also makes some amount of sense for a field commander to be inside a combat transport.

2 hours ago, toffolone said:

If you have to price something at minimum, it means it simply does not worth.

So just redo it.

Of course it would still be possible to give him field commander and arsenal4.

when has arsenal 2 with exhaust ever been useful? never.

he should have field commander and give arsenal +1 passively without any exhaust crap.

5 points would be fine.

9 minutes ago, Caimheul1313 said:

It also makes some amount of sense for a field commander to be inside a combat transport.

Weiss is actually an imperial field commander. It would make some amount of sense for him to actually have field commander.

https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Weiss <-note the multiple references to him being a field commander

But if any faction doesnt get a field commander at all it will be Imperials...

9 minutes ago, Khobai said:

when has arsenal 4 ever been useful? never.

he should have field commander and give arsenal +1 passively without any exhaust crap.

5 points would be fine

Weiss is actually an imperial field commander. It would make some amount of sense for him to actually have field commander.

https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Weiss <-note the multiple references to him being a field commander

They might rather give Field Commander to a more famous canon character rather than one that FFG made up for Imperial Assault.

1 minute ago, KommanderKeldoth said:

They might rather give Field Commander to a more famous canon character rather than one that FFG made up for Imperial Assault.

unless they made a pilot version of Veers I cant think who else it could be.

I think adding Field Commander would have been both an interesting way to get the general some play, and also for the ATST itself. Win win.

Removing arsenal is basically scrapping the card and creating a completely new one though, which defeats the purpose of this post.

Regarding the hypothetical "coordinate vehicle" I don't even think this would be a good option for him or any imperial vehicle pilot field commander to have. As he'd already be paying a heap for his own ATST or Tank, adding a second to coordinate is very expensive with diminishing returns as they'd have to stay close together to coordinate. And speeder bikes are not a good coordinate target as they are too fast and need to flank.

24 minutes ago, Khobai said:

unless they made a pilot version of Veers I cant think who else it could be.

Governor Pryce from Star Wars: Rebels could fit the bill. She is obscure enough to not get her own commander box release but still more well known than "guy from a now discontinued board game".

Well obviously general weisz should have never seen the light at all.

Talking frankly, where there is weizs there should be veers (as field commander)

And instead of the actual veers we all know there should be a certain gran admiral (no wonder I m using his IA model to proxi veers).

But FFG decided differently. So we have to do with what we have.

A closed transport for empire is not so necessary.

And sincerely speaking a commander on an atst makes more sense. It would make even more sense inside an ATAT, but we will never see an ATAT in the game.

Actually i said coordinate only to give an interesting rule. And I said vehicle and not trooper because coordinate trooper may trigger too much shenanigans with shores, mortsrs and gideon hask.

34 minutes ago, toffolone said:

Well obviously general weisz should have never seen the light at all.

Talking frankly, where there is weizs there should be veers (as field commander)

And instead of the actual veers we all know there should be a certain gran admiral (no wonder I m using his IA model to proxi veers).

But FFG decided differently. So we have to do with what we have.

A closed transport for empire is not so necessary.

And sincerely speaking a commander on an atst makes more sense. It would make even more sense inside an ATAT, but we will never see an ATAT in the game.

Actually i said coordinate only to give an interesting rule. And I said vehicle and not trooper because coordinate trooper may trigger too much shenanigans with shores, mortsrs and gideon hask.

We're just going to have to agree to disagree with almost all of that. You seem to have a habit of stating your opinions as if they are facts.

How can you not agree?

Is general weisz ever mentioned outside of IA? No. So of course he should not exist - fact

In his place, as an upgrade card, there should be veers (who only appears in TESB as leading from inside an ATAT or on the deck) - fact

VEERS should never have been an independent character. You know this as I do. He does not have so much screen time. His place (even with same rules) could easily be taken by a more active thrawn. - opinion

I understand you may not agree on the last, but the first two points are facts. Or at least they look so to me.

Of course I m saying what I think should have be done. Now it is not possible to do as I propose.

Also, ok weisz is now 1 pt. Still he will never see a game, just because the other pilot is better.

In order to make it a viable choice you have to give its card some interesting rule. The new field commander rule would be good.

This way you can play double ATST in a very powerful list. Just like double AAT.

For rebels we'll have to wait for the transport. But again I don't see a candidate for the field commander role

4 hours ago, KommanderKeldoth said:

Governor Pryce from Star Wars: Rebels could fit the bill. She is obscure enough to not get her own commander box release but still more well known than "guy from a now discontinued board game".

Governor Pryce is definitely not a field commander type. I could definitely see her as a support operative like Padme though.

And I have to agree Weiss still wont get used even at 1 point. Giving him field commander made a lot of sense.

If they deliberately left Weiss as being useless just so they could introduce a new pilot that does what Weiss should do in order to sell more Imperial space buses a lot of people are going to be mad lol.

@toffolone It doesn't matter if he wasn't mentioned outside of IA (another FFG property), his inclusion could have been intended solely to attract IA players to Legion. Or at the very least, FFG carrying over one of their created characters. FFG made the character, and the LFG approved them using the character on an upgrade card, so in their opinion, he should exist in the context of this game. ("He shouldn't exist" is an opinion, not a fact.)

Veers is never seen in an AT-ST, but is seen leading an army in one of the original trilogy films. "Veers should be an upgrade card instead of an model" is an opinion, not a fact, and again, not one shared by FFG or LFG.

Grand Admiral Thrawn was from a cartoon as opposed to one of the major motion pictures (where most of the early models came from). It isn't until 2019 that we first got a unit that never appeared in a film (while the AT-RT and Wookiees were not shown in film to be working with the Rebels, the were shown in the prequel films). Introducing Thrawn as the second commander for the Imperials wouldn't have been as recognizable as Veers, and the two commanders (in my opinion at least), should play VERY differently.

So your conclusions are not facts. Weisz not appearing outside of IA is a fact, as is Veers only appearing inside an AT-ST. Anything beyond that is an opinion you have formed from that fact, not inheriently a fact.

Theres absolutely no reason Veers cant be both a commander and a pilot upgrade card. But as a unique character you couldnt include both in the same army.

56 minutes ago, Caimheul1313 said:

Grand Admiral Thrawn was from a cartoon as opposed to one of the major motion pictures

Thrawn's origin predates the cartoon by quite a bit. Thrawn originally appeared in the Timothy Zahn sequel novels that came out like 25 years ago. And he was canonized in games like TIE Fighter. Thrawns been around for a while.

And Thrawn is definitely more recognizable as Veers as a character. Veers is in one scene in ESB. Thrawn has a whole anthology of novels written around him, and cameos/mentions in multiple games and tv shows.

I understand FFG's decision to release Thrawn later though. Because Thrawn's rise to power comes five years after the death star explodes. When he unifies the shattered remnants of the empire under one banner.

Which unfortunately means Ezra is probably back too. Much to my chagrin.

50 minutes ago, toffolone said:

Is general weisz ever mentioned outside of IA? No. So of course he should not exist - fact

The first part may have been true before he was in Legion, but saying that he should not be in Legion is in no way a fact.

50 minutes ago, toffolone said:

In his place, as an upgrade card, there should be veers (who only appears in TESB as leading from inside an ATAT or on the deck) - fact

This is also in no way a fact, this is your opinion on how Veers should have been implemented. Fun (actual) fact: if you use the word should , it is automatically not a fact.

8 minutes ago, Khobai said:

Governor Pryce is definitely not a field commander.

I could see her as an operative like Padme.

I don't think she would work as an operative. Operatives (so far) are individuals who operate outside of the normal command structure, or at least don't specifically command other people, and are generally combat heavy or spies, neither of which apply to Pryce. Governor Pryce is, well, a Governor , ie. someone who is in direct command of a lot of people, including members of the military. Also, she directly (poorly) commands attacks on the Lothal Rebels towards the end of Rebels. I don't think she would work well as a full Commander, but Field Commander seems like a decent spot to put her, especially as vehicles were always involved in her combat actions. She would also be a good fit for the ITT, but she could also come with the Imperial Patrol Transport if we ever get that.

a governer should not be a field commander theyre too important lol

field commanders work for governers

kallus for example couldve been a field commander.

and kallus being both a commander and a pilot with field commander wouldve been fine. you just couldnt use both in the same army.

same goes for any character really. luke skywalker could be an airspeeder pilot for example but then you couldnt use commander or operative luke in the same army.

I dunno why FFG didnt just do something like that.

1 hour ago, toffolone said:

How can you not agree?

Is general weisz ever mentioned outside of IA? No. FACT

So of course he should not exist - OPINION

In his place, as an upgrade card, there should be veers OPINION

(who only appears in TESB as leading from inside an ATAT or on the deck) - FACT

VEERS should never have been an independent character. You know this as I do. OPINION

He does not have so much screen time. FACT

His place (even with same rules) could easily be taken by a more active thrawn. - FACT or OPINION (I’m willing to err on the side of FACT with this one)

FIFY...

1 hour ago, Khobai said:

Governor Pryce is definitely not a field commander type. I could definitely see her as a support operative like Padme though.

And I have to agree Weiss still wont get used even at 1 point. Giving him field commander made a lot of sense.

If they deliberately left Weiss as being useless just so they could introduce a new pilot that does what Weiss should do in order to sell more Imperial space buses a lot of people are going to be mad lol.

Governor Pryce seen here commanding troops in the field from a vehicle...

yeah the show took liberties to make the villains more menacing

realistically an imperial governor would never be commanding troops in the field though

shes a planetary governor, she administers the ENTIRE PLANET, its not realistic for her to be in a skybus commanding troops. she has field commanders to do that for her.

rebels has a lot of ridiculous things in it. like helicopter inquisitors and thrawn losing to space whales. lol.

if inquisitors are added to legion are they going to have the ability to fly? because it was in rebels!!!!

what about helicopter darth vader. would he still be speed 1?

50 minutes ago, Khobai said:

yeah the show took liberties to make the villains more menacing

realistically an imperial governor would never be commanding troops in the field though

shes a planetary governor, she administers the ENTIRE PLANET, its not realistic for her to be in a skybus commanding troops. she has field commanders to do that for her.

rebels has a lot of ridiculous things in it. like helicopter inquisitors and thrawn losing to space whales. lol.

if inquisitors are added to legion are they going to have the ability to fly? because it was in rebels!!!!

what about helicopter darth vader. would he still be speed 1?

I mean... Rebels is canon, so despite your opinions to the contrary it is direct proof that Imperial Governors command in the field.

In a lot of ways the Empire in Star Wars is modeled off of Imperial Rome. In both the republic and imperial eras of Rome's history political power directly equated to military command. In fact they even had just one word for it: Imperium. So you saw military commanders at all levels of government. They didnt see a distinction between the two and a career in one by necessity often meant a career in the other.

Her role is much more akin to a Roman governorship than the civilian civil service role that we associate with the word in modern times. A Roman governor of a province had the power (and indeed was expected) to command legions in the field, put down local rebellions, and had practically unlimited authority on the local level.