12 minutes ago, salamar_dree said:

I did fire off a rules question about it to FFG, but whether or not they answer is a big "?" as they don't have an RPG department anymore.

I did the same thing Wednesday. Still no response, and a couple of my earlier questions also went unanswered.

1 hour ago, salamar_dree said:

I do feel that they could have worded the talent better.

They could have made it more clear, but the talent says what it means. The "before" clause applies to the entire statement. You have to assume the writer said exactly what he didn't mean in order to say that you choose the symbols after rolling.

I can't think of a great way to rephrase it that isn't unnecessarily long or clunky and doesn't sound like it's just repeating itself.

5 hours ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

They could have made it more clear, but the talent says what it means. The "before" clause applies to the entire statement. You have to assume the writer said exactly what he didn't mean in order to say that you choose the symbols after rolling.

I can't think of a great way to rephrase it that isn't unnecessarily long or clunky and doesn't sound like it's just repeating itself.

The way it’s worded may be a bit off, but I stand by my read of it, and the comma (while probably poor grammar) does help set the division of the statement. The first part of the statement says that you remove a number of boost dice from the pool before the roll. The second part of the statement says that you add any combination of Successes or Advantages to the result of the roll.

In order to add symbols to the result of a roll, you first need to have said roll made in order to have a result to which you can add Successes or Advantages. Then you choose what to add to said result. You need that result first.

Therefore, the steps are

1. Remove a given number of Boost dice from your dice pool.
2. roll the dice in order to get a result.
3. add your choice of Successes or Advantages equal to the number of Boost dice originally removed (in any combination) to the result of said roll.

Now, the main talent I was remembering, which I just checked on was Improved Shortcut which also swaps out Boost dice for a guaranteed result. However, the swap out is for guaranteed Success symbols equal to your ranks in Shortcut for the boost dice at the cost of two Strain. The base talent allows you to add a number of Boost dice to your piloting roll during a chase equal to your ranks in the talent. The Improved version changes those dice to automatic Successes at the cost of two strain.

That being said, the president set regarding when a player chooses whether to add Successes or Advantages to the result roll is still there. In order to add a given number of symbols to the result of a roll, you first need to roll and get a result. You don’t add the symbols before you roll. You add them to the result of the roll.
When you add Force dice to a pool, you don’t choose what symbols you’re going to add before you roll. The Force Dice only determine how many additional symbols you might be able to add. The choice of what specific symbols you add comes after the roll, once you have an actual result.

This is because the whole point of having that choice is to be able to pick the symbol(s)that is (are) lacking in the resulting roll. In the Autofire example given above, that means that if the player rolled plenty of Advantages but few, if any Successes, he can choose to add Successes to his roll, or, if he has plenty of Successes but not enough Advantages, he can instead add them instead. The rule does not say he must choose what symbols he’s going to add to the result. It says he must remove the boost dice before rolling and then add his choice of any combination of Successes or Advantages to the result of the roll. You need to have a result before you can add those symbols. That means you must roll first before choosing what to add, but, before anything, you must first remove a given number of Boost dice from your dice pool before even rolling.

1 minute ago, Tramp Graphics said:

It says he must remove the boost dice before rolling and then add his choice of any combination of Successes or Advantages to the result of the roll.

It doesn't, actually. It says "Before rolling, do X and Y." The "Before" prefaces both, and, very importantly, it doesn't say "then." It says "and."

7 minutes ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

It doesn't, actually. It says "Before rolling, do X and Y." The "Before" prefaces both, and, very importantly, it doesn't say "then." It says "and."

The Before does not preface both. It prefaces only the first, that’s why the comma is there. Yes, it is poor grammar, (a semicolon is what should have been used) but the intent is specifically to divide the sentence into two specific parts . You remove the boost dice before the roll, you then add your choice of Successes or Advantages to the result of the roll. And the wording of the talent does specifically state that you add the symbols to the result of your roll. You don’t have a result until you roll the dice. Therefore you can’t add any Successes or Advantages until you roll the dice . As such, you can’t choose what to add until you roll the dice. You need that result first.

6 minutes ago, Tramp Graphics said:

The Before does not preface both. It prefaces only the first, that’s why the comma is there. Yes, it is poor grammar, (a semicolon is what should have been used) but the intent is specifically to divide the sentence into two specific parts . You remove the boost dice before the roll, you then add your choice of Successes or Advantages to the result of the roll. And the wording of the talent does specifically state that you add the symbols to the result of your roll. You don’t have a result until you roll the dice. Therefore you can’t add any Successes or Advantages until you roll the dice . As such, you can’t choose what to add until you roll the dice. You need that result first.

No amount of excessive bolding will make you right.

26 minutes ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

No amount of excessive bolding will make you right.

Look the rule and how it’s worded again , and break it down. The rule is broken down into two distinct parts. The first part says that “Before rolling a combat check that targets a droid (including a droid vehicle or vehicle piloted by a droid), the character may remove Boost dicey to his ranks in Clanker Killer from his pool.” The second part of the rule says that, “add an equal number of Successes or Advantages (in any combination) to the results .”

And that is the key you are missing. The rule says you remove the boost dice from your initial dice pool, but you add your choice of Successes and/or Advantages to the result of the roll, not to the initial dice pool . That means you need to roll the dice after removing the Boost dice from the dice pool but before adding any Successes or Advantages. That is two distinct steps.

1. Remove a number of boost dice up to your ranks in Clanker Killer from your dice pool before rolling.
2. Add an equal number of Successes or Advantages in any combination to the result of the roll.

You cannot have a result without first rolling the dice, and the rule specifically states that you add your choice of Successes and Advantages to the result of the roll. Therefore, you remove the Boost dice before rolling but choose to add Successes or Advantages after rolling.

1 hour ago, Tramp Graphics said:

Look the rule and how it’s worded again , and break it down. The rule is broken down into two distinct parts. The first part says that “Before rolling a combat check that targets a droid (including a droid vehicle or vehicle piloted by a droid), the character may remove Boost dicey to his ranks in Clanker Killer from his pool.” The second part of the rule says that, “add an equal number of Successes or Advantages (in any combination) to the results .”

And that is the key you are missing. The rule says you remove the boost dice from your initial dice pool, but you add your choice of Successes and/or Advantages to the result of the roll, not to the initial dice pool . That means you need to roll the dice after removing the Boost dice from the dice pool but before adding any Successes or Advantages. That is two distinct steps.

1. Remove a number of boost dice up to your ranks in Clanker Killer from your dice pool before rolling.
2. Add an equal number of Successes or Advantages in any combination to the result of the roll.

You cannot have a result without first rolling the dice, and the rule specifically states that you add your choice of Successes and Advantages to the result of the roll. Therefore, you remove the Boost dice before rolling but choose to add Successes or Advantages after rolling.

Here is a breakdown from a professional editor, whose opinion I value far more highly than yours:

On 10/29/2020 at 2:05 PM, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

The word from a professional editor regarding the grammatical structure of the description:

The "before" clause modifies the entire rest of the sentence. "Before rolling a combat check, the character may remove Boost and add equal Success."
They have an erroneous comma in there, but the sentence is so long they might have thought it was necessary even though technically it isn't.
The only reason there's any doubt about the "before" clause is because of that comma.
But since there is no subject noun following the comma, no actor given, the actor for "add Success/Advantage" is the same as the actor for "remove Boost." That makes them equivalent in the sentence, which means the clause that modifies "remove Boost" also modifies "add Success/Advantage": "before rolling a combat check" comes before both actions.

And if you want to talk intent, @salamar_dree has references from the Order 66 podcast regarding intent.

13 hours ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

Here is a breakdown from a professional editor, whose opinion I value far more highly than yours:

And if you want to talk intent, @salamar_dree has references from the Order 66 podcast regarding intent.

No, it doesn’t and the reason why is because of what the additional Successes and Advantages are added to. The additional Successes and Advantages are not added to the dice pool. They’re added to the result of the roll . The rule itself explicitly states this.

The exact rule says:

Quote

Before rolling a combat check that targets a droid (including a droid vehicle or a vehicle piloted by a droid), the character may remove Boost dice up to their ranks in Clanker Killer from their poo l, and add an equal number of Successes or Advantages to the results.

(Emphasis mine)

The Successes/Advantages are added to the result of the roll, not the dice pool. They’re added after the roll is made. The Boost dice are removed from the pool before rolling, the Successes and/or Advantages are added to the result of the roll, there not added to the initial pool. In order to add Successes or Advantages to the results, you first need results to add them too . This means you must roll the dice before you add the additional Successes/Advantages. Each part of the sentence has a different subject which modifies a different object . And the latter “object” (the results of the roll) does not even exist until the dice are rolled.

Is the grammar poorly done, maybe. Ideally, this rule should have been divide into two different sentences. However the very fact that the Successes/Advantages are explicitly added to the results of the roll, not the initial dice pool, means that they are added after the roll is made.

This is backed up by Improved Shortcut too, and other talents which add Successes or Advantages. You make the check then you add successes (or Advantages). Adding additional Successes or Advantages always happens after the dice are rolled. This is because they are always added to the results of a given check, not to the initial dice pool.

You add or remove dice to the dice pool before you roll, but you add or remove symbols to the results of the check after you roll. That is the precedent.

Clanker Killer is no different. The talent explicitly says that you “add an equal number of Successes or Advantages (in any combination) to the results. ” This is the exact same wording used with Intuitive Shot, Intuitive Strike, and any other talent which adds any combination of Successes and Advantages of your choosing to the results of a check.

How this talent is worded, the player must choose before the roll between adding sucess or advantages for each removed boost dice, makes it useless. I've n,ever met a player who'll accept to sacrifice dices for something that might or might not e useful. All prefer to to roll those dices if they can't get a guaranteed result.

2 hours ago, WolfRider said:

How this talent is worded, the player must choose before the roll between adding sucess or advantages for each removed boost dice, makes it useless. I've n,ever met a player who'll accept to sacrifice dices for something that might or might not e useful. All prefer to to roll those dices if they can't get a guaranteed result.

Exactly. In every talent which gives players a choice to add either Successes or Advantages (or any combination thereof) to the result of the roll they choose what to add after the roll. This is because you are adding them to the result of the check not the dice pool. This is also true of Clanker Killer. The player adds the Successes and Advantages to the result of the roll. As such while he makes the determination to remove the Boost dice from his dice pool before rolling (as would be appropriate), he chooses what symbols he wants to add to the result (in what combination) once he has a result to begin with.

And perhaps you are right. However, I'll reserve judgement until I have an official ruling.

It's no skin off my teeth either way, as I'm not running or playing in any Clone Wars era games.

I will say that I value @DarthGM 's opinion on it, and have asked him to reach out to someone involved in the design of the book.

Hopefully, we can resolve this soon, as I don't put too much stock in getting an answer through FFG's rules question process since the dissolution of the RPG department.

For what it's worth, I'm on the side of add the results before rolling.

2 hours ago, Tramp Graphics said:

Exactly. In every talent which gives players a choice to add either Successes or Advantages (or any combination thereof) to the result of the roll they choose what to add after the roll.

But you have offered zero examples of talents that remove dice before the roll in exchange for a choice of Success/Advantage. Every other talent I can think of that gives the choice of Success or Advantage can only be triggered after a roll because it is contingent on dice results or on the dice having already been rolled. Clanker Killer is resolved before the roll. If they were to make it more clear, they would say "and choose an equal amount of Success or Advantage to then add to the results." However they did not make it more clear as I imagine they thought it was clear and not in need of further clarification. That is a far simpler explanation than yours (see Occam's Razor). You have to dramatically reread the talent and ignore clear internal indicators in order to look at other, somewhat comparable external examples to reach your conclusion.

Okay, so "add to the results." Yes, you can't modify the dice results before you have them. However, there are various things that add symbols to the results passively, and are predetermined as to what they add. Heavy Hydrospanner, for example. Clanker Killer is much the same. The main difference is that the player gets to predetermine what it is as opposed to it automatically being determined. Same with Improved Shortcut. Those symbols are sitting to the side when you roll the dice, ready to be added once the dice are rolled. This is how Clanker Killer works. You set aside the symbols, roll the dice, then push the symbols into the pool. In fact, in one of the games where this talent was used, we actually set aside Boost dice turned to the relevant symbol, then added them to the rolled dice to calculate the pool.

6 hours ago, WolfRider said:

makes it useless. I've n,ever met a player who'll accept to sacrifice dices for something that might or might not e useful. All prefer to to roll those dices if they can't get a guaranteed result.

I disagree. I'm playing a couple characters with Clanker Killer, and despite my earlier misgivings it is actually quite useful.

First, I want to point out that the results are guaranteed, unlike the results of the Boost dice. As for usefulness, I'll address it at the end. Now some data (some minor rounding):

With a Boost die, you average 66% of an Advantage and 33% of a Success (AKA 1 symbol). You have a 33% chance of rolling two symbols on the die, but a 33% of rolling no symbols. If you really need to succeed, you can guarantee a Success for the potential loss of one Advantage, but you change a 33% chance of a Success to guaranteed.

It's a 50% chance to roll one or more Advantage. If you really want some Advantage, you can sacrifice some additional potential for a guaranteed Advantage.

With two Boost dice, you average 133% of an Advantage and 66% of a Success (AKA 2 symbols). You have a 16.5% chance of rolling four symbols and a 16.5% chance of rolling three, but a 45% chance of rolling one or fewer symbols and a 22% chance of rolling two symbols. That's a 70% chance of rolling 2 or fewer symbols, meaning that at best, Clanker Killer is a wash.

Further, the dice are not smarter than you (apologies capricious, pernicious dice gods, please have mercy) so you are better positioned to ensure that the results are useful. You know what you need, and choosing the symbols ahead of time gives you a better shot of getting what you want than trusting it to the dice, especially if you really need Success since there is only a 33% chance of getting max success on a single die, a 16.5% chance of getting it on two, and a 2.7% chance of getting it on three.

1 hour ago, P-47 Thunderbolt said:

Further, the dice are not smarter than you (apologies capricious, pernicious dice gods, please have mercy) so you are better positioned to ensure that the results are useful. You know what you need, and choosing the symbols ahead of time gives you a better shot of getting what you want than trusting it to the dice, especially if you really need Success since there is only a 33% chance of getting max success on a single die, a 16.5% chance of getting it on two, and a 2.7% chance of getting it on three

I admit that trading a 33% chance of getting a success for a guaranteed success might be a good choice if there's more purple / red dices than green / yellow dices in your dice pool. But other than that case it's better to keep your boost dices in the dice pool. You have 2 / 6 chance to obtain two symbols or the same chance to obtain nothing. Perhaps my players have a gamblers mind but they really prefer to roll the dices.

And to be clear I'm not agreeing with Tramp Graphics. For me it's clear that given how Clanker Killer is written, the choice must be made before the roll. But I strongly disagree with that and I think that if the talent choose after the roll it'll be better.

46 minutes ago, WolfRider said:

But I strongly disagree with that and I think that if the talent choose after the roll it'll be better.

More powerful? Sure. A better talent? I disagree. What it does is add more consistency. That consistency is quite important.

47 minutes ago, WolfRider said:

I admit that trading a 33% chance of getting a success for a guaranteed success might be a good choice if there's more purple / red dices than green / yellow dices in your dice pool. But other than that case it's better to keep your boost dices in the dice pool. You have 2 / 6 chance to obtain two symbols or the same chance to obtain nothing.

That guaranteed success is always going to be better than rolling for it when you need success, whether that's for higher damage or increased accuracy. Sometimes you only need the accuracy, in which case Clanker Killer is invaluable regardless of the dice pool.

The Advantage is a bit more sketchy, but I'll outline the reasons why I believe it is still worth it below.

Like I said, you average 1 symbol per roll of the Boost die. That lines up directly with Clanker Killer. If you need Advantage, there is a 16.6% chance you get more than one, and a 50% chance that you get no Advantage. That means that 83.4% of the time, you get no Advantage benefit from rolling the die instead of saving it with Clanker Killer. What you lose out on with Clanker Killer is the potential for an additional Success or a Success instead of an Advantage.

Sometimes it may be best to throw a hail-Mary and leave the dice in the pool with the hope of getting a ton of extra Advantage, but the added consistency of being able to pick what you get is really important.

Is it the perfect choice in all circumstances? No. Do I use max Clanker Killer at almost every opportunity? Also yes. The more control you have over what you roll, the better.

On 11/3/2020 at 8:15 PM, Tramp Graphics said:

That being said, the president set regarding when a player chooses whether to add Successes or Advantages to the result roll is still there. In order to add a given number of symbols to the result of a roll, you first need to roll and get a result. You don’t add the symbols before you roll. You add them to the result of the roll.

When you add Force dice to a pool, you don’t choose what symbols you’re going to add before you roll. The Force Dice only determine how many additional symbols you might be able to add. The choice of what specific symbols you add comes after the roll, once you have an actual result.

These are both bad examples as

1, shortcut only adds succes so no choice on part of the player (it doesnt matter you add it before or after)

2, force dice make you roll first, then you swap 1 symbol to another. Its totally different. Not exchanging die to symbol. You change results to other results.

10 hours ago, Rimsen said:

These are both bad examples as

1, shortcut only adds succes so no choice on part of the player (it doesnt matter you add it before or after)

2, force dice make you roll first, then you swap 1 symbol to another. Its totally different. Not exchanging die to symbol. You change results to other results.

Neither are bad examples. The point is that every time you add actual symbols to a roll, it is done after the roll. When you remove dice from a pool it is done before rolling.

Not only that, but in the case of Intuitive Shot and Intuitive Strike, both say the exact same thing as Clanker Killer regarding when you add the Successes and Advantages. You add them to the results of the check .

If you read Clanker Killer, it does not say “swap out boost dice for your choice of Successes or Advantages.” It says, “the character may remove Boost dice up to his ranks in Clanker Killer from his pool ”. It goes on to say that he may, “ add an equal amount of Successes or Advantages (in any combination) to the results .” Those are the key phrases, which are all consistent with the mechanics of the game. You remove boost dice from the pool before you roll the dice. You add any combination of Successes/Advantages to the results of the roll after you roll. It is two distinct steps:

1. Remove boost dice up to ranks in Clanker Killer from dice pool.
2. add Successes or Advantages (in any combination) to the results of the check.

Intuitive Shot and Intuitive Strike both say that you, “add Successes or Advantages (character’s choice) to the result. ” That is virtually identical to what Clanker Killer says regarding when you add the Successes or Advantages.

In no instance do you ever add symbols to the dice pool before rolling the dice, whether they are a set specific symbol or a choice of my combination of two symbols. You always add the symbols to the result of the roll. You add them after the roll . That is the rule for all of these types of talents. You always add or remove dice from a pool before rolling. You add symbols to the results of a check after rolling.
Clanker Killer specifically says you , “add Successes or Advantages (in any combination) to the results. ” That specific phrase makes it absolutely clear that you roll the check before adding the Successes or Advantages. The opening half of the sentence says when you remove the Boost Dice . And that too is consistent with the rest of the RAW. And was really unnecessary. You always add or remove dice before rolling.

The talent Mission Critical also allows a character to add any combination of Successes or Advantages to the results of his check (by flipping a Destiny Point). Once again, the symbols are added to the results after the roll ( but before resolving the check). It says that he may, “add Successes or Advantages to the result equal to their ranks in that skill. (The character may divide the result between Successes and Advantages in any combination .)”

Once again, the character adds the symbols after rolling . What the source of the symbols are is irrelevant . In every case where a character can any combination of Successes and Advantages to the results of a check, they are always added after rolling . That is the precedent. This is because they are always added to the results of the check, not to the initial dice pool .

After answering a question about Coordination Dodge, I may have altered my opinion of how this works.

I still want an official answer, but I noted a key difference in wording.

As @Tramp Graphics has pointed out, Clanker Killer says, "add to the results".

Coordination Dodge says, "add to the check".

So maybe it is after the check is made (i.e.: add to results).

I'm not sure.

1 hour ago, Tramp Graphics said:

Neither are bad examples. The point is that every time you add actual symbols to a roll, it is done after the roll. When you remove dice from a pool it is done before rolling.

Not only that, but in the case of Intuitive Shot and Intuitive Strike, both say the exact same thing as Clanker Killer regarding when you add the Successes and Advantages. You add them to the results of the check .

If you read Clanker Killer, it does not say “swap out boost dice for your choice of Successes or Advantages.” It says, “the character may remove Boost dice up to his ranks in Clanker Killer from his pool ”. It goes on to say that he may, “ add an equal amount of Successes or Advantages (in any combination) to the results .” Those are the key phrases, which are all consistent with the mechanics of the game. You remove boost dice from the pool before you roll the dice. You add any combination of Successes/Advantages to the results of the roll after you roll. It is two distinct steps:

1. Remove boost dice up to ranks in Clanker Killer from dice pool.
2. add Successes or Advantages (in any combination) to the results of the check.

Intuitive Shot and Intuitive Strike both say that you, “add Successes or Advantages (character’s choice) to the result. ” That is virtually identical to what Clanker Killer says regarding when you add the Successes or Advantages.

In no instance do you ever add symbols to the dice pool before rolling the dice, whether they are a set specific symbol or a choice of my combination of two symbols. You always add the symbols to the result of the roll. You add them after the roll . That is the rule for all of these types of talents. You always add or remove dice from a pool before rolling. You add symbols to the results of a check after rolling.
Clanker Killer specifically says you , “add Successes or Advantages (in any combination) to the results. ” That specific phrase makes it absolutely clear that you roll the check before adding the Successes or Advantages. The opening half of the sentence says when you remove the Boost Dice . And that too is consistent with the rest of the RAW. And was really unnecessary. You always add or remove dice before rolling.

The talent Mission Critical also allows a character to add any combination of Successes or Advantages to the results of his check (by flipping a Destiny Point). Once again, the symbols are added to the results after the roll ( but before resolving the check). It says that he may, “add Successes or Advantages to the result equal to their ranks in that skill. (The character may divide the result between Successes and Advantages in any combination .)”

Once again, the character adds the symbols after rolling . What the source of the symbols are is irrelevant . In every case where a character can any combination of Successes and Advantages to the results of a check, they are always added after rolling . That is the precedent. This is because they are always added to the results of the check, not to the initial dice pool .

Adding something to the result does not mean it is added after the roll. You seem to assume it, but it's not definitive. Obviously, everything's gonna add to the result, otherwise it woulnd't change the roll at all. Doesn't mean it is added after just that it is added. Just because you bold out the result, doesn't mean you cannot add symbols to them before rolling.

None of these talents mentions that you need to do anything before the roll, so it wouldn't even make sense to add it before the roll. Also, removing a dice is a totally new mechanic. So unless you can show another talent that removes a dice before roll and adds symbol, you cannot compare them.

That's why Clanker killer is different.

You just want to make it more powerful. As someone who plays tabletop games frequently can say that a fix result is always worth more than trying your chance. Even if it might not be optimal. It is still a powerful talent.

5 minutes ago, salamar_dree said:

After answering a question about Coordination Dodge, I may have altered my opinion of how this works.

I still want an official answer, but I noted a key difference in wording.

As @Tramp Graphics has pointed out, Clanker Killer says, "add to the results".

Coordination Dodge says, "add to the check".

So maybe it is after the check is made (i.e.: add to results).

I'm not sure.

Everything says "Add to the results" because that's the resolution of the dice. Why couldn't you add symbols to it preemptively?

On 11/2/2020 at 8:59 PM, salamar_dree said:

Order 66 Podcast Episode 130, minutes 35 to 37 minutes in discusses Clanker Killer. GM Phil specifically mentions that the choice is made before the roll.

I'm going to re-listen to Episode 126 to see if they answer it definitively in that episode.

@Tramp Graphics

1 hour ago, Rimsen said:

@Tramp Graphics

Did GM Phil write the book? No . He’s the host of the pod cast. He’s making an interpretation of what he thinks it means. He’s not one of the writers, he’s not a member of the FFG staff nor a developer. I’m also just listening to the podcast, and they don’t even begin talking talents until well after the 37 minute mark. It isn’t until deep in to the 38 minute mark he makes his claim.
However that is not what the rule itself says . It says that you remove the boost dice before you roll and you add the symbols to the result of the roll. You can’t add symbols to a result until you have a result to begin with . That means you need to roll the dice before adding your combination of Successes and Advantages.
The rules as a whole are very consistent when you add or remove dice as well as when you add symbols to a check. You add dice before you roll , you add symbols after you roll. That is the rule of the system as a whole . It is consistent in every talent where dice or symbols are added or subtracted. Dice are added or removed when assembling the dice pool before rolling the dice. You add Successes or Advantages to the results of checks after you roll the dice. There is no rule, no talent, no Force power, nothing which adds symbols before rolling. Thus, there is no precedent for Clanker Killer to suddenly add the Successes and Advsntaged before rolling the dice. The rule says you add the Successes and Advantages to the result of the roll , not to the dice pool.

One thing I need to make clear. I don’t play Clone troopers at all. I have no vested interest in this particular talent. I’m looking at this purely from a rules perspective. The rules for when you add or remove dice are very consistent, as are when you add or remove symbols. You add or remove dice from a dice pool before rolling and you add or remove symbols after rolling. That is how the game as a whole does it. Every talent that adds or removes dice or adds or removes symbols does it the same way. You add or remove dice before rolling, you add or remove symbols to the result of a roll after rolling.