Hello fellow GM's. (And players!)

I need a clarification on modifications for Attachments. Can an attachment benefit from multiple unique modification options if the associated costs are covered and the dice rolls successful?

As an example I'll take the Ilum Crystal which has these modification options:

- 2x Quality (Vicious 1)

- 4x Damage +1

- 1x Decrease Crit by 1

So, does this mean a player can choose either the Vicious, Damage or Decrease Crit mods?

Or

Does it mean they can potentially have all three as long as they pay the component cost and succeed on their dice rolls? Essentially maxing it out or even mixing and matching.

So far, I've been using the first ruling, as it seems to lead to more creativity and personalization to a weapon or item. Where one player might make their blaster more accurate, another may want it to have pierce. If you can potentially have both, doesn't that defeat the purpose of customization?

Thoughts and rulings?

Here's a way of looking at it. An Illum crystal has all these mods available.

• Quality (Vicious +1)
• Quality (Vicious +1)
• Damage +1
• Damage +1
• Damage +1
• Damage +1
• Decrease Crit by 1

You can add any of these mods, so long as you pay for components and succeed at the ever-increasingly difficult dice rolls. If you fail a mod roll, you effectively "lock" that particular mod and can't attempt to add it to that exact attachment again.

In that way, you can get a depth of customization, especially on lightsaber crystals which tend to have a lot of mod options. You have to prioritize which mods you want since the rolls are easier early on.

That is a way of looking at it, much like how Oggdudes lays it out and I am aware that the ones of the same type are essentially stacked together, I.e, +1 damage, +1 Damage, +1 Damage, +1 Damage for a total of 4.

But I also noticed that program does not correctly charge you for each subsequent mod, it simply charges 100c every time. That is one inconsistency with the CRB. Is the program simply allowing you to get em all or is it RAW?

So my question, are you positive that is the ruling? If so, can you provide a source?

The decrease the Crit is also surely more valuable than a single point of Vicious?

1 hour ago, CloudyLemonade92 said:

That is a way of looking at it, much like how Oggdudes lays it out. But I also noticed that program does not correctly charge you for each subsequent mod, it simply charges 100c every time. That is one inconsistency with the CRB.

So my question, are you positive that is the ruling? If so, can you provide a source?

The decrease the Crit is also surely more valuable than a single point of Vicious?

Yes, that is the rule. Each mod adds to the existing mods, it doesn’t replace them. Mods which can be installed multiple times increase the bonus granted by one for each additional time that mod is installed in the attachment. So, for example, the Mephite crystal has three +1 to damage mods. If you install all three of them the weapon’s damage is increased by +3. The rules for modding attachments are on page 192 of the F&D CRB.

6 hours ago, Tramp Graphics said:

Yes, that is the rule. Each mod adds to the existing mods, it doesn’t replace them. Mods which can be installed multiple times increase the bonus granted by one for each additional time that mod is installed in the attachment. So, for example, the Mephite crystal has three +1 to damage mods. If you install all three of them the weapon’s damage is increased by +3. The rules for modding attachments are on page 192 of the F&D CRB.

I'm aware that they stack on top of each other.

Perhaps I wasn't clear. My question is about whether you can also add the other mods (Vicious, Decrease Crit) as well as the damage mods. Or can you select one type only?

As far as I can tell, that is not ruled on in the CRB. Perhaps I'm missing it though, is there a ruling on that and a source?

@CloudyLemonade92

I think that you are looking for a restriction that do not exist. If there were such a restriction, it would be included in the text (i.e.: You may only select a single mod option).

The only stated limitation is in the three paragraphs on page 192 of the F&D CRB under the heading "Modding Attachments". Some Attachments have no Mod options (Night Vision Scope), 1 option (Blaster Energy Damper), or any number of options (Lightsaber Crystals).

However, there is another implied limitation: the increasing Difficulty. The first Mod (unless reduced by Talents or other special factors, such as when a character Mods his own lightsaber, F&D page 196, top of first column) is a Hard [PPP] check and costs Cr100. The second Mod is a Daunting [PPPP] check and costs Cr100. The third Mod is a Formidable [PPPPP] check and costs Cr100. Once you have to increase the Difficulty beyond Formidable, per RAW it becomes Impossible (still PPPPP, but requires the character to use a Destiny Point just to attempt the check).

Some people instead apply Upgrades beyond Formidable (i.e.: Formidable +1 Difficulty = RPPPP), but that is a houserule.

Cheers!

@salamar_dree

I think I must have been now that I think on it. Thanks for the clarification. However, I did note one inconsistency with what you said compared to the CRB.

On page 192, it says:

"Each additional mod installed in an attachment be­yond the first increases the difficulty of the Mechan­ics check by one, and costs an additional 100 credits
beyond the base cost."

That would mean that your second Mod would cost 200c, not 100c.

This has been clarified by the Devs.

It is +100 per Mod.

The Base Cost is the cost of the Attachment, so each "additional 100 credits" is to the Base Cost of the Attachment, excluding any other Mods (as they aren't part of the "Base Cost").

@CloudyLemonade92

An example, using a Jedi Modding an Ilum Crystal in her own Lightsaber (remember that she reduces the Difficulty of Modding Attachments on her own Lightsaber by 2, so instead of starting at Hard [PPP] for the first Mod, it starts at Easy [P]):

The Ilum Crystal has 7 Mod options: 2× Vicious +1, 4× +1 Damage, 1× Reduce Crit Rating.

She attempts them in the following order:

1st = Easy [P] Reduce Crit

2nd = Average [PP] +1 Damage

3rd = Hard [PPP] +1 Damage

4th = Daunting [PPPP] +1 Vicious

5th = Formidable [PPPPP] +1 Vicious

6th = Impossible [PPPP + flip a DP] +1 Damage

7th = Impossible [PPPP + flip a DP] +1 Damage

The GM may use DP's to Upgrade the Difficulty.

A failed check means that Mod slot is lost (cannot be retried). A Despair ruins the entire Attachment).

@salamar_dree

Oh, seems I was way off base then. The language they used is rather misleading.

Also, thanks for that breakdown of the steps, I took a screenshot because thats coming up soon in my homegame.

[ Removed for Innacuracy]

@Sear_Clone

The wording of that is misleading.

It states "upgrade" when it means "increase difficulty". They are very specific terms.

"Upgrade" means turn a Purple Difficulty die into a Red Challenge die.

"Increase Difficulty" adds an additional Purple Difficulty die to the dice pool.

Per Rules As Written ("RAW"), difficulties above Formidable [PPPPP] are not Upgraded, but become Impossible (still [PPPPP], but requires a player to spend a Destiny Point just to attempt the check.)

As I stated above, Upgrading after Formidable Difficulty instead of using the Impossible Difficulty is a house rule that everyone in a specific gaming group would have to agree to.

13 minutes ago, salamar_dree said:

@Sear_Clone

The wording of that is misleading.

It states "upgrade" when it means "increase difficulty". They are very specific terms.

"Upgrade" means turn a Purple Difficulty die into a Red Challenge die.

"Increase Difficulty" adds an additional Purple Difficulty die to the dice pool.

Per Rules As Written ("RAW"), difficulties above Formidable [PPPPP] are not Upgraded, but become Impossible (still [PPPPP], but requires a player to spend a Destiny Point just to attempt the check.)

As I stated above, Upgrading after Formidable Difficulty instead of using the Impossible Difficulty is a house rule that everyone in a specific gaming group would have to agree to.

@salamar_dree You are correct. Thank you for pointing it out, I didn't realize my mistakes. I will have to change my notes on the rules, I reread the section and I definitely didn't understand it correctly.

I couldn't figure out how to delete my comment so I just edited it to remove confusion.

Yes, it gets confusing for sure!

Cheers!

14 hours ago, CloudyLemonade92 said:

I'm aware that they stack on top of each other.

Perhaps I wasn't clear. My question is about whether you can also add the other mods (Vicious, Decrease Crit) as well as the damage mods. Or can you select one type only?

As far as I can tell, that is not ruled on in the CRB. Perhaps I'm missing it though, is there a ruling on that and a source?

You can add all of them provided you succeed at the Mechanics checks required for each.

I was coming back to comment the corrected examples I had when I saw this:

From page 17, Under Difficulty : " There are six basic difficulty levels (See the Impossible Tasks sidebar on page 18 for an optional seventh level). Some modifiers or situations may warrant checks higher than formiddable, based on the GM's discretion ."

So it seems you can add more purples than the basic difficulties would normally have you do (so essentially you can have 8, 10, 20 purples in a pool)

Am I reading that correctly? If I am then I would follow this when modifying attachments rather than use a house rule.

@Sear_Clone

Only thing is you can't get Despair from purples, which is why I like the Upgrade to red.

42 minutes ago, CloudyLemonade92 said:

@Sear_Clone

Only thing is you can't get Despair from purples, which is why I like the Upgrade to red.

Situations and Destiny Points can also upgrade the difficulty, but I agree. It also makes sense, as the more adjustments you've made, the more likely the attachment is to break.

@CloudyLemonade92 and @P-47 Thunderbolt I agree, which is why I think it would be valid to say that the GM may upgrade the difficulty by flipping a destiny point, otherwise there would be no reason to include the despair rule in the first place. I think after the PC has modded it quite a bit it would only be fair.

I fixed my previous post that was in error, it should be corrected this time. I corrected my confusion with upgrade/increase. I also corrected it to show the difficulties beyond basic and input the rules for impossible difficulty if that is preferred.

I believe I have it correct with mod options not resetting the difficulty if you switch to a new one and failure only affecting that specific mod option (not the whole attachment). If I am wrong please let me know so I can reflect it correctly here.

Modding Attachments

Explained in depth

If the attachment has a listed series of mods, you may select one to work on at a time. The number beside them (if listed) indicates it can be ranked that many times. Each time requires a new check.

1. T he PC spends 100 credits on supplies.

2. He has to have a toolkit.

3. He has to be able to have a few hours.

4. He has to be able to work at a workbench.

5. He has to make a hard (3 purple) Mechanics check. ( Increased by 1 per mod)

Each time he wishes to mod that same attachment, he has to increase the check one time. He also has to add an additional 100 credits. (100 credits each time, does not mean 100 cr, 200 cr, 300 cr….)

S uccess means that it was installed correctly and it will now provide the bonus.

Failure means that it wasn’t installed, and that specific mod option cannot be attempted to be increased. (It keeps its current bonuses however, and you can attempt to upgrade the other mod options listed, if any) *

*If it is ranked, you may attempt the next rank of the mod option. [As pointed out by @P-47 Thunderbolt ]

Failure w/Despair means that it wasn’t installed, and the whole attachment is lost (it loses its bonuses).

Remember that you can buy the same attachment or find one and try again.

Example:

Posh wants to mod his Augmented spin barrel so it is more powerful. It has the following mod options:

Damage +1 (2)

Weapon Quality Accurate +1 (1)

Weapon Quality Pierce +1 (1)

Posh also wants to mod his grenade launcher to carry more grenades. His weapon has two hard points so he can have both on his weapon at the same time. The grenade launcher has the following mod options:

Weapon Quality Limited Ammo +1 (5)

P osh will first choose to mod his damage. He has 4 Intellect and 3 in Mechanics . He can also use any talents or special abilities. He deducts 100 credits from his inventory, and goes with the proper tools to a workbench on the ship. He has plenty of time as the group is having the ship fixed which will take some time to do.

He will make a Hard Mechanics check . The pool is 3 purple, 1 green, 3 yellow.

He rolls, and receives a failure with a threat . Posh can no longer attempt to mod the damage with that attachment . If he wanted to buy a new augmented spin barrel he could try again. The threat can be spent narratively to indicate more time or resources were spent or it was a frustrating task.

However, he can still mod it’s accurate and pierce qualities. He will now try to mod the accurate quality. He has the same pool as before (as no mods are installed yet), and he rolls, deducting another 100 credits from his inventory.

He gets a success with three advantages , so he successfully installs it and the advantage can be spent narratively to indicate he got it done quickly or efficiently. His attachment will now boast the accurate quality.

Posh now wants to try the pierce quality. He will increase the difficulty once as even though it is a different mod, it is still on the same attachment. He deducts 100 credits and rolls.

His success and failures even out, and is left with one advantage. While he failed the check and cannot attempt to upgrade this mod option again, he still boasts the accurate quality, and he can use the advantage narratively.

He now wants to try modding the grenade launcher. A player comes over and decides to help him. The player, Ana, has better skills rank in mechanics - 5. So he will use her skill and keep his characteristics. The new pool looks like this as we are now working with a new attachment/weapon entirely:

He rolls and gets a success. He gets the mod so now he can fire the grenade launcher twice before needing to reload. He continues to go, let’s see what happens:

Paying 100 credits, he goes again with the following pool:

He rolls and gets two successes. He gets the mod so now he can fire the grenade launcher three times before needing to reload. He continues to go, let’s see what happens:

Paying 100 credits, he goes again with the following pool:

He rolls and gets one success . He gets the mod so now he can fire the grenade launcher four times before needing to reload. He continues to go, let’s see what happens:

Now we can increase the difficulty, using the rule from page 17: "There are six basic difficulty levels (with an optional seventh level page 18 sidebar). Some situations/modifiers may warrant checks higher than formidable, based on the GM's discretion."

Optionally, the GM may utilize the optional 7th basic difficulty (Impossible difficulty)

(Flip a destiny point to attempt, cannot provide any benefits . 5 purple/formidable difficulty)

Paying 100 credits, he has the following pool:

However the GM upgrades with check with a Destiny Point, resulting in this pool:

He rolls and gets two successes , but one despair (which don’t have any effect here except narratively since he succeeded ). He gets the upgrade so now he can fire the grenade launcher five times before needing to reload. He continues to go, let’s see what happens:

Paying 100 credits, he goes again with the following pool:

He rolls and gets 1 failure . Since it is only a failure, he keeps all the current bonuses and can’t continue to upgrade that mod option anymore. So he leaves off with limited ammo 5, where he could have gotten as far as limited ammo 6 if he succeeded.

He now has two upgraded attachments:

Augmented Spinning barrel with an additional modifier of accurate 1 and the under barrel grenade launcher attachment which has the modifier of limited ammo 5.

Upgrades to mod options on armor follow the same rules.

Page 187 Core EOTE

1 hour ago, Sear_Clone said:

Failure means that it wasn’t installed, and that specific mod option cannot be attempted to be increased. (It keeps its current bonuses however, and you can attempt to upgrade the other mod options listed, if any)

If you've got 2 Damage +1 options, you've basically got two chances to increase the damage. If you fail at the first, you can still try the second. But no matter how many times you succeed or fail, you can attempt the mod the number of times in the description.

Ah, I see.

Damage +1 (Rank 1) if fail, can't install

Damage +1 (Rank 2) if previous rank failed, may still attempt to install this rank.

Fixed it in my previous post. Thanks @P-47 Thunderbolt !