So, I’m not looking to knock these things before they’re even printed, and I’m definitely looking forward to flying them, BUT...

Does anyone else find the idea of flying against them absolutely terrifying? I mean, the Delta-7 versions of Obi-Wan and Anakin are already incredibly hard to fight, and the Actis is even more maneuverable, with pre-positioning, and white Tallon Rolls. They also have access to a 3-die bullseye primary, and 150% of the health of the base Aethersprite... in short, they seem to significantly outclass that already-formidable ship in every way.

I mean, I guess you can fix a lot with costing, but are these (small!) ships going to come in at 90+ points? It sort of feels like they may need to...

Not really with only 3 hull. I know if I fly them, I will roll nothing but green blanks and they will order 66 themselves in no time

Could someone kindly link source(s) for the info on these? The details on the wiki seem to be lacking some things as yet. White Tallon rolls?

2 hours ago, Cpt ObVus said:

So, I’m not looking to knock these things before they’re even printed, and I’m definitely looking forward to flying them, BUT...

Does anyone else find the idea of flying against them absolutely terrifying? I mean, the Delta-7 versions of Obi-Wan and Anakin are already incredibly hard to fight, and the Actis is even more maneuverable, with pre-positioning, and white Tallon Rolls. They also have access to a 3-die bullseye primary, and 150% of the health of the base Aethersprite... in short, they seem to significantly outclass that already-formidable ship in every way.

I mean, I guess you can fix a lot with costing, but are these (small!) ships going to come in at 90+ points? It sort of feels like they may need to...

I think they will be good but not broken. This prepositioning you mention happens in the system phase, so absolutely everybody can react to that, even I1 vulture droids.

They have 3 hull, which is actually 75% of a delta-7's health, so they are less resistant.

Bullseye 3 dice is very equivalent to calibrated laser targeting on the Delta-7 (add 1 eye in the bullseye) and can potentially be worse if that third die you roll is a blank, specially since their lock action is purple.

They have a white evade so they will be great at defendind though, like inquisitors.

The "white maneuver" is actually a purple speed 2 talon roll, so they will really have to manage their force, specially since they only have 1 "regular" turnaround maneuver, a 4 or 5 speed red koir, I don't remember.

So... Good? Of course. Scary? They may be, but they may also pop like Soontir Fel when someone looks at them.

If you look to the dial you can see the 2 speed purple talon rolls, tho this image is very bad quality, sorry.

2 hours ago, Spinland said:

Could someone kindly link source(s) for the info on these? The details on the wiki seem to be lacking some things as yet. White Tallon rolls?

The Tallon rolls are purple which require a force charge to execute. They become a "stress maneuver" if you run out of force charges before you execute it. The Stress Maneuver is the same white 2 straight that you would perform if you had tried to execute a red maneuver while stressed.

27 minutes ago, 5050Saint said:

The Tallon rolls are purple which require a force charge to execute. They become a "stress maneuver" if you run out of force charges before you execute it. The Stress Maneuver is the same white 2 straight that you would perform if you had tried to execute a red maneuver while stressed.

Is this true if purple maneuvers generally or just this ship and maneuver?

Just now, TasteTheRainbow said:

Is this true if purple maneuvers generally or just this ship and maneuver?

It is true of all purple maneuvers. It's on page 3 of the Rules Reference should you need to look it up at any point.

1 hour ago, xanatos135 said:

I think they will be good but not broken. This prepositioning you mention happens in the system phase, so absolutely everybody can react to that, even I1 vulture droids.

They have 3 hull, which is actually 75% of a delta-7's health, so they are less resistant.

Bullseye 3 dice is very equivalent to calibrated laser targeting on the Delta-7 (add 1 eye in the bullseye) and can potentially be worse if that third die you roll is a blank, specially since their lock action is purple.

They have a white evade so they will be great at defendind though, like inquisitors.

The "white maneuver" is actually a purple speed 2 talon roll, so they will really have to manage their force, specially since they only have 1 "regular" turnaround maneuver, a 4 or 5 speed red koir, I don't remember.

So... Good? Of course. Scary? They may be, but they may also pop like Soontir Fel when someone looks at them.

Hmmmm... if this is true, then the LaunchBayNext app has an inaccurate spoiler. LBN lists them with 3 hull AND 3 shield, and doesn’t show the T-Roll as purple.

That sounds far less busted.

What is a good source for this advance intel on the features of the ship? I'd like to tap into that sort of thing if possible.

3 minutes ago, Cpt ObVus said:

Hmmmm... if this is true, then the LaunchBayNext app has an inaccurate spoiler. LBN lists them with 3 hull AND 3 shield, and doesn’t show the T-Roll as purple.

That sounds far less busted.

On the picture posted by Xanatos135 it looks like 1 hull, 2 shields, which seems crazy bad as their is a couple of ways to put damage under the shields.

Just now, Dwing said:

On the picture posted by Xanatos135 it looks like 1 hull, 2 shields, which seems crazy bad as their is a couple of ways to put damage under the shields.

Nooooo, no. That’s not an Actis, that’s a Hyperspace Ring.

2 minutes ago, Spinland said:

What is a good source for this advance intel on the features of the ship? I'd like to tap into that sort of thing if possible.

The info we have are from FFG's live streams which are on YouTube now, but originally streamed on Twitch.

3 minutes ago, Cpt ObVus said:

LBN lists them with 3 hull AND 3 shield, and doesn’t show the T-Roll as purple.

We honestly don't know the shield count as that portion of the cards are obstructed. Conjecture is that there are none as there are only two shield tokens in the pack, and those would be needed for the Hyperspace Ring. As for the purple T-Roll, since it is the first purple maneuver, Andre probably hasn't added the coding/images for purple maneuvers yet.

1 minute ago, 5050Saint said:

The info we have are from FFG's live streams which are on YouTube now, but originally streamed on Twitch.

We honestly don't know the shield count as that portion of the cards are obstructed. Conjecture is that there are none as there are only two shield tokens in the pack, and those would be needed for the Hyperspace Ring. As for the purple T-Roll, since it is the first purple maneuver, Andre probably hasn't added the coding/images for purple maneuvers yet.

Ah. I assumed LBN must have another spoiler source, as they usually put a “?” on unknown info.

Anyway, no Shields would make a LOT more sense. You can see why I might have thought this thing was freakin’ crazy, at 3 Agility, 3 Hull, 3 Shields, AND 3 Force charges, with 6 initiative and pre-positioning. Who’d ever hit it?

If you go to the x-wing wiki, the eta-2 actis expansion page has a picture of the full Anakin pilot card, which I also think was shown in their streaming.

3 hull, no shields.

20 minutes ago, Cpt ObVus said:

Nooooo, no. That’s not an Actis, that’s a Hyperspace Ring.

Ah right you are, peeew 😅

Very interceptor-like, so cool 😃

High risk, high reward

Edit: Nevermind, answered my own question!

We're not going to know until points and upgrade slots are known, but honestly I'm struggling to see the Eta-2 replacing the Delta-7 as the Republic's ace ship.

System phase pre-positioning is nice, but limiting. While it lets them block and then maneuver, which is potentially scary - that's a limited return if you're running a low ship count list of aces. More importantly, they can't double reposition. Ask Wedge and Luke how easy it is to be an I6 or I5 ace when you can't double reposition. That double reposition for the cost of only a Force token is 100% the strength of the Delta-7, and I just don't see the Eta-2 being as good an option because of it.

Beyond this, these ships are going to be Force starved. That's a good thing for the game in general, but unfortunately they're entering a game where the Delta-7 already exists. Purple tallon rolls seem cool - no stress to worry about so you still get your actions and the full dial next turn. But we also know from the Delta-7 that the Jedi live and die by their Force tokens. If the purple tallon roll was the only expenditure they needed to make, it would be no problem. But if you want to start abusing the pre-position and easy turn around maneuver, you're burning two Force tokens. Obi-Wan and Anakin can get away with that, just. But other pilots won't be so lucky.

And then you come to the crucial addition no one else seems to be talking about: purple lock action. This is huuuuge . It's honestly the thing that I think will just kill this ship unless they're way cheaper than most would be comfortable for a chassis offering an I6 3 Force pilot. The Delta-7 was so successful because for the cost of just one Force token, you can either double reposition and arc dodge or take a lock and single reposition and in both cases still have focus type modification on eye dice results. That's arc dodging or double dice mods for barely any cost. The Eta-2 can't do either.

You lose a focus type mod to gain re-rolls.

No Eta-2 pilot is going to able to pre-position block, turn around to engage the target they blocked and have both re-rolls and eye mods. One of those has to go. Taking a lock is also always going to cost you a post maneuver reposition too. When you consider that they only get 3 attack dice with a bullseye, this all starts to stack up and hurt. Their offence is always going to have to be a compromise. Take a post maneuver barrel roll to line up the bullseye and you lose out on the lock for re-rolls. Take the lock and you might well be stuck with only 2 dice anyway.

Now, this could well get mitigated somewhat if they have a sensor slot and can take FCS, but I don't think that's guaranteed. Expect to see R3 Astromech stapled to most of these guys, unless they come with a particularly impressive new astro of their own.

Looking at Anakin, I honestly imagine he's going to be both worse than Soontir Fel and more expensive.

I think the Eta-2s track very closely to CLT Jedi, but basically worse in every way. Jury's still out on purple tallon rolls. In a vacuum, I think they're better than red tallon rolls. But on the Eta-2, with all its other potential costs I kinda feel like they'd prefer the stress. With R4-P and R4 astros out there and available, I don't think they'd hate stress.

Expect the Eta-2s to be cheaper than their CLT Delta-7 counterparts, but not discounted enough to actually be worth taking compared with the CLT Deltas.

Speaking on this, have we had Yoda's full card spoiled? There was a tweet today:

Any chance he'll have slightly different stats than the rest, I wonder?

Also, might be our preview article this week?

57 minutes ago, GuacCousteau said:

We're not going to know until points and upgrade slots are known, but honestly I'm struggling to see the Eta-2 replacing the Delta-7 as the Republic's ace ship.

System phase pre-positioning is nice, but limiting. While it lets them block and then maneuver, which is potentially scary - that's a limited return if you're running a low ship count list of aces. More importantly, they can't double reposition. Ask Wedge and Luke how easy it is to be an I6 or I5 ace when you can't double reposition. That double reposition for the cost of only a Force token is 100% the strength of the Delta-7, and I just don't see the Eta-2 being as good an option because of it.

Beyond this, these ships are going to be Force starved. That's a good thing for the game in general, but unfortunately they're entering a game where the Delta-7 already exists. Purple tallon rolls seem cool - no stress to worry about so you still get your actions and the full dial next turn. But we also know from the Delta-7 that the Jedi live and die by their Force tokens. If the purple tallon roll was the only expenditure they needed to make, it would be no problem. But if you want to start abusing the pre-position and easy turn around maneuver, you're burning two Force tokens. Obi-Wan and Anakin can get away with that, just. But other pilots won't be so lucky.

And then you come to the crucial addition no one else seems to be talking about: purple lock action. This is huuuuge . It's honestly the thing that I think will just kill this ship unless they're way cheaper than most would be comfortable for a chassis offering an I6 3 Force pilot. The Delta-7 was so successful because for the cost of just one Force token, you can either double reposition and arc dodge or take a lock and single reposition and in both cases still have focus type modification on eye dice results. That's arc dodging or double dice mods for barely any cost. The Eta-2 can't do either.

You lose a focus type mod to gain re-rolls.

No Eta-2 pilot is going to able to pre-position block, turn around to engage the target they blocked and have both re-rolls and eye mods. One of those has to go. Taking a lock is also always going to cost you a post maneuver reposition too. When you consider that they only get 3 attack dice with a bullseye, this all starts to stack up and hurt. Their offence is always going to have to be a compromise. Take a post maneuver barrel roll to line up the bullseye and you lose out on the lock for re-rolls. Take the lock and you might well be stuck with only 2 dice anyway.

Now, this could well get mitigated somewhat if they have a sensor slot and can take FCS, but I don't think that's guaranteed. Expect to see R3 Astromech stapled to most of these guys, unless they come with a particularly impressive new astro of their own.

Looking at Anakin, I honestly imagine he's going to be both worse than Soontir Fel and more expensive.

I think the Eta-2s track very closely to CLT Jedi, but basically worse in every way. Jury's still out on purple tallon rolls. In a vacuum, I think they're better than red tallon rolls. But on the Eta-2, with all its other potential costs I kinda feel like they'd prefer the stress. With R4-P and R4 astros out there and available, I don't think they'd hate stress.

Expect the Eta-2s to be cheaper than their CLT Delta-7 counterparts, but not discounted enough to actually be worth taking compared with the CLT Deltas.

I think you are right, but being used to playing phantoms, I really like the system phase repositioning, as it results in weirder moves and allows low init pilots (who said Yoda?) to actually do something.

Purple target lock sucks, sure, but white evade is really good to me, double mods for defense can be quite useful on a ship this fragile.

I'm really expecting for the upgrade slots to be revealed since the pack comes with the same talent as trifighters so... Will that mean every pilot has force+talent? That would be reeally gamechanging, you only need predator to make these guys great. It would also make them feel quite different from the delta, even if they have to priced a bit high for this.

1 hour ago, xanatos135 said:

Purple target lock sucks, sure, but white evade is really good to me, double mods for defense can be quite useful on a ship this fragile.

Purple lock can be bypassed by Tarkin, Sync'd console, and LAAT reroll. I can't see it being super harmful to the Eta. The white evade worries me as Inquisitors have proven to be tanky with it.

9 hours ago, 5050Saint said:

Purple lock can be bypassed by Tarkin, Sync'd console, and LAAT reroll. I can't see it being super harmful to the Eta. The white evade worries me as Inquisitors have proven to be tanky with it.

What Saint said, there is enough Republic upgrades coming out that you don’t need to lock. I’m seeing the ETA concentrating on not being hit, support ship/crew giving the rerolls.
You fly Obi and Ani together and they can shed red tokens and get focus tokens fairly easily. You put Ghost Coy and Wolfpack on the 212 pilot for 60 pts, leaves 140 for your aces. Enough? No idea, could be though.

4 hours ago, Archangelspiv said:

What Saint said, there is enough Republic upgrades coming out that you don’t need to lock. I’m seeing the ETA concentrating on not being hit, support ship/crew giving the rerolls.
You fly Obi and Ani together and they can shed red tokens and get focus tokens fairly easily. You put Ghost Coy and Wolfpack on the 212 pilot for 60 pts, leaves 140 for your aces. Enough? No idea, could be though.

You can even use Hound to get rid of Wolfpack's strain and potentially patiente's deplete (if you use that upgrade)

Well, FWIW, this thread was part of the process that's had me re-thinking my previous dismissal of the subject ship, and adding a couple to my pre-order for a pair of V-Wings. Since I've added Republic to my factions of interest, might as well keep up with the New Hotness. 😎 🍺