Need help with epic 500pt list rebels

By player3719000, in X-Wing Epic Play

500 Gavin

(146) Alderaanian Guard [CR90 Corellian Corvette]
(8) C-3PO
(7) Hotshot Gunner
(9) Targeting Battery
(6) Ion Cannon Battery
(3) Damage Control Team
(8) Comms Team
Points: 187

(37) Horton Salm [BTL-A4 Y-wing]
(2) Veteran Wing Leader
(8) Veteran Turret Gunner
(6) Afterburners
(2) Expert Handling
(5) Ion Cannon Turret
Points: 60

(31) Gray Squadron Bomber [BTL-A4 Y-wing]
(8) Veteran Turret Gunner
(5) Ion Cannon Turret
Points: 44

(31) Gray Squadron Bomber [BTL-A4 Y-wing]
(8) Veteran Turret Gunner
(5) Ion Cannon Turret
Points: 44

(41) Blue Squadron Escort [T-65 X-wing]
(0) Servomotor S-foils
(6) Adv. Proton Torpedoes
Points: 47

(41) Blue Squadron Escort [T-65 X-wing]
(0) Servomotor S-foils
(6) Adv. Proton Torpedoes
Points: 47

(61) Gavin Darklighter [E-wing]
(2) R4 Astromech
(2) Fire-Control System
(1) Marksmanship
Points: 66

Total points: 495

Or

500 sperado

(146) Alderaanian Guard [CR90 Corellian Corvette]
(8) C-3PO
(7) Hotshot Gunner
(9) Targeting Battery
(6) Ion Cannon Battery
(3) Damage Control Team
Points: 179

(37) Horton Salm [BTL-A4 Y-wing]
(2) Veteran Wing Leader
(8) Veteran Turret Gunner
(6) Afterburners
(5) Ion Cannon Turret
Points: 58

(31) Gray Squadron Bomber [BTL-A4 Y-wing]
(8) Veteran Turret Gunner
(5) Ion Cannon Turret
Points: 44

(31) Gray Squadron Bomber [BTL-A4 Y-wing]
(8) Veteran Turret Gunner
(5) Ion Cannon Turret
Points: 44

(48) Kullbee Sperado [T-65 X-wing]
(2) R4 Astromech
(2) Veteran Wing Leader
(0) Servomotor S-foils
Points: 52

(41) Blue Squadron Escort [T-65 X-wing]
(0) Servomotor S-foils
Points: 41

(41) Blue Squadron Escort [T-65 X-wing]
(0) Servomotor S-foils
Points: 41

(41) Blue Squadron Escort [T-65 X-wing]
(0) Servomotor S-foils
Points: 41

Total points: 500

For the second, the xwings are docked with liberator. For the first where can I invest 5 points? Overall I would like feedback and advice for which is better in your opinion.

First list: In my opinion, the CR90 does emphatically NOT want to coordinate. It's a combat ship. Trike the Comms team. I would also install a Point Defense Cannon, since it allows you to shred enemy fighters that hunt you down. I also don't feel the torps on the X-wings are worth it. I'd kill C3PO and Expert Handling and Afterburners and downgrade the Ion to Dorsal, then add another X-Wing and make it a wing.

Second list: Same for the CR90 as above. The Kulbee wing is great, but I personally like flying a band (3 fighters in a row) more than a box (4 fighters in a square), since you can align them parallel with a huge ship and get 3 range 1 shots, whereas the square will most likely only get two. But try how it works for you!

1 hour ago, Stefan said:

Second list: Same for the CR90 as above. The Kulbee wing is great, but I personally like flying a band (3 fighters in a row) more than a box (4 fighters in a square), since you can align them parallel with a huge ship and get 3 range 1 shots, whereas the square will most likely only get two. But try how it works for you!

In the case of 4 fighters, in a wing, it would be 3 front row and one in the middle back row (I checked as I was wondering if you could morph back & forth into a 4-box w/o breaking the wing, when tactically advantageous, but 3-and-1 seems the only way!)

Edited by mcintma
3 hours ago, Stefan said:

First list: In my opinion, the CR90 does emphatically NOT want to coordinate. It's a combat ship. Trike the Comms team. I would also install a Point Defense Cannon, since it allows you to shred enemy fighters that hunt you down. I also don't feel the torps on the X-wings are worth it. I'd kill C3PO and Expert Handling and Afterburners and downgrade the Ion to Dorsal, then add another X-Wing and make it a wing.

Which hard point should I swap for point defense cannons? I see strong arguments for each. Second, why C-3PO, that double calc is strong, even for 8 points. I just want to know why you think that.

I think C-3PO is good. I struggle with the idea of Gavin changing his to crits, while the Y-wings have ion cannons that don't care about that. I know he's probably there for the X-wings and the CR90, so it's probably okay.

@Stefan had some great comments about squad 1, which I mostly agree with, but here's a slightly different take. Drop the torps and Comms Team for a total of 25 points to work with. 5 points to equip Liberator title; 4 points to upgrade Ion Cannon Batteries to Point Defense Batteries; you now have 16 points to upgrade one of the X-wings to Wedge, and dock him to the CR90 until it's safe for him to come out and play. Or just send him out early and let the opponent choose between targeting Gavin first or Wedge first. The extra energy that Liberator supplies should be helpful for the point defense.

7 hours ago, mcintma said:

In the case of 4 fighters, in a wing, it would be 3 front row and one in the middle back row (I checked as I was wondering if you could morph back & forth into a 4-box w/o breaking the wing, when tactically advantageous, but 3-and-1 seems the only way!)

You define all the positions, so you can't change them, even in a box. Are you sure 3-1 is the only way? Then I played it wrong!

5 hours ago, player3719000 said:

Which hard point should I swap for point defense cannons? I see strong arguments for each. Second, why C-3PO, that double calc is strong, even for 8 points. I just want to know why you think that.

Because 8 points, simple as that. My thought was that they're better spent elsewhere.

Perceptive copilot is just a better 3PO on a CR90, imo.

1 hour ago, TasteTheRainbow said:

Perceptive copilot is just a better 3PO on a CR90, imo.

Almost. C-3PO let's you Reinforce into two calculates, and then you can take another action (lock, repair a faceup damage card, Tibanna Reserves, etc.). Perceptive Copilot means one of your actions is focus, so you have to choose between Reinforce or some other action. Maybe you're right that most of the time you're better off with Perceptive Copilot.

I think C-3PO works well to power Bombardment Specialists by giving them a calculate they can spend to adjust range of one of its attacks.

He also has that defensive bonus he can use while the huge ship defends at range 3, but that's kind of a stretch, and uses a huge resource (calculate token) for a random outcome. Not wild about that. Feels about as good as Ruthless.