So with my collection the only ship type I have enough off to actually play a wing are the Z95s. But this is ok, the way wings work can potentially make them useful, because my main issue with z95s and missiles I have in general is that moving in ini1 means you hardly ever get a target lock. Now with wings I can drag the pirates up to wingleader initiative.

So until Bossk is released for the Z95 N'dru will have to do. His ability won't count for anything though.

Z-95-AF4 Headhunter - Binayre Pirate - 30 x 5
Binayre Pirate - (24)
Concussion Missiles (6)

Z-95-AF4 Headhunter - •N’dru Suhlak - 41
•N’dru Suhlak - Hunt Saboteur (31)
Expert Handling (2)
Veteran Wing Leader (2)
Afterburners (6)

Total: 191

Between expert handling and afterburners you abuse all the wing movement. And then after placing the wing you can make use of the higher initiative to get target locks for the missiles. Still not ini 5 or 6, but a far cry better than trying to get ini 1 target locks.

Any good?

(And I realise Cracken is way better for the Rebels, Stupid illicit tax makes Cracken + 5 rebel z95s actually come out at the same cost. Higher initiative and have a potentially useful leader ability.)

Alternatively you could give a fully loaded Kaa’to Leeachos a wing of expendable pirates and use double modded concussion missiles.

I prefer this because nothing protects your Z-95-wingmates from getting one-shotted as usual, so equipping them with expensive missiles seems like a waste.

3 minutes ago, Singulativ said:

Alternatively you could give a fully loaded Kaa’to Leeachos a wing of expendable pirates and use double modded concussion missiles.

I prefer this because nothing protects your Z-95-wingmates from getting one-shotted as usual, so equipping them with expensive missiles seems like a waste.

Yeah, is probably better to just use them as a bunch of extra wounds for a wingman.

To be honest.... I haven't had any luck playing any variant of z95 in 2.0, so this was just another (probably failed) attempt to get something useful out of them.

1 minute ago, Bort said:

To be honest.... I haven't had any luck playing any variant of z95 in 2.0, so this was just another (probably failed) attempt to get something useful out of them.

They pair well with Kath Scarlett but a single Firespray may melt fast and you have to bump the wing to get her ability bonus.

More hp to soak with using Kaa'to. 6x 2 die attacks is nothing to sneeze at.

Kaa’to Leeachos (29)
Expert Handling (2)
Shield Upgrade (6)
Veteran Wing Leader (2)

Binayre Pirate (24)
Shield Upgrade (6)

Binayre Pirate (24)
Shield Upgrade (6)

Binayre Pirate (24)
Shield Upgrade (6)

Binayre Pirate (24)
Shield Upgrade (6)

Binayre Pirate (24)
Shield Upgrade (6)
Total: 189

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

Alternatively so the Z-s all engage at the same init (wings only use the wing leader's init in the Activation Phase, they engage individually at their own init) :

Kaa’to Leeachos (29)
Expert Handling (2)
Hull Upgrade (5)

Black Sun Soldier (27)
Hull Upgrade (5)

Black Sun Soldier (27)
Hull Upgrade (5)

Black Sun Soldier (27)
Hull Upgrade (5)

Black Sun Soldier (27)
Hull Upgrade (5)

Black Sun Soldier (27)
Hull Upgrade (5)
Total: 196

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

Honestly you could drop Kaa'to to a BSS with EH/Hull and be fine.

Alternatively, keep the initial wing, and swap all the Concussion Missiles for Homing Missiles (for a trivial savings). What's that, Mr. Wing Leader? You can shift damage you take? Well, you can't shift the auto-damage from Homing Missiles, so you're saying you want to eat a bunch of 4-dice shots? That works too!

Yes, the Z-95s may pop, but at 29 points each they're cheap, and presumably you have other things that can take advantage of the distraction.

1 hour ago, Singulativ said:

Alternatively you could give a fully loaded Kaa’to Leeachos a wing of expendable pirates and use double modded concussion missiles.

I prefer this because nothing protects your Z-95-wingmates from getting one-shotted as usual, so equipping them with expensive missiles seems like a waste.

1 hour ago, Bort said:

Yeah, is probably better to just use them as a bunch of extra wounds for a wingman.

I would not sell your Z-95's short. 6 with Ordnance will do well in Epic. I was going to try it at some point. There are a number of things to think about.

1) With Afterburners you could deploy a bit away and in the flank. They might not turn to face you. You could get close enough to surprise them on a flank and not face too many shots.

2) Target priority is still a thing. If you place out enough other threats they will have to decide what to shoot at. Get a cheap Dreadnaught Hunter and put it on the same approach. Put a Y-wing with Torpedoes or similar nearby. A combat CROC (yo yo) is a nice distraction.

3) In the beginning, most people will make lists to fight Huge ships and load up with anti-capital ship stuff, like Turbo Lasers. They won't be prepared as much to face massed small Fighters.

24 minutes ago, ChahDresh said:

Alternatively, keep the initial wing, and swap all the Concussion Missiles for Homing Missiles (for a trivial savings). What's that, Mr. Wing Leader? You can shift damage you take? Well, you can't shift the auto-damage from Homing Missiles, so you're saying you want to eat a bunch of 4-dice shots? That works too!

That is actually a really good move. Being able to take out the Wing Leader is pretty good. I might have to try that.

Cluster Missiles are also a good option as you can hopefully spread a bit of damage to more than one target before the Concussions hit. Not Range 3, though.

Well, any way to damage ships in the Wing is good. I had a Wing where half of them were damaged and my opponent started to throw out Concussuon Missiles. It got ugly real fast with everyone flipping crits. Some of them will be Direct Hits. If you can get the Huge ship to flip crits, it will really hurt it.

On 11/26/2019 at 7:12 AM, ChahDresh said:

Alternatively, keep the initial wing, and swap all the Concussion Missiles for Homing Missiles (for a trivial savings). What's that, Mr. Wing Leader? You can shift damage you take? Well, you can't shift the auto-damage from Homing Missiles, so you're saying you want to eat a bunch of 4-dice shots? That works too!

Yes, the Z-95s may pop, but at 29 points each they're cheap, and presumably you have other things that can take advantage of the distraction.

I forgot to say that I really like the Homing Missile idea. I mentioned it when I recorded our podcast last night.

What are the thoughts on a rebel version of this? Craken has a good ability for a wing leader role and initiative 5. I only have 4, but I still think they could do some work with concussion missiles

7 hours ago, Roller of blanks said:

What are the thoughts on a rebel version of this? Craken has a good ability for a wing leader role and initiative 5. I only have 4, but I still think they could do some work with concussion missiles

You will see in my original post, in teeny tiny letters at the bottom I did mention that I think the rebel version would be better. It was my scummy way of not focussing on the better rebel version.

Rebel ships are cheaper, and Craken gives better initiative and better ability than what scum has.

Z's and Y's are the only scum ships I have in numbers to run a wing, so the three scum Epic squads I've run have included a wing of 3 Z-95s. I tried out a Binayre Pirate leading two Black Sun Soldiers, all with Cluster Missiles. The nice thing was my wing of Z's could move first to grab locks and block other wings - a lot of the scenarios start the players close enough that having those initial locks isn't as hard as standard play.

I'm really liking Cluster Missiles on Z-95s. Range control isn't so important - you move close enough to get a lock, and they land in range 1 or 2, so you can still use your ordnance. With Concussion Missiles, you better hope they didn't land at range 1 or you'll wish you had a focus for defense instead of a lock. Cluster Missiles also bump up the attack profile of these ships considerably. Kind of dependent on luck for that bonus attack, but they have been doing work so far.