Interesting video! The more things change, the more they stay the same...

Lucky for me, I was not really on the internet in 1999 (did not owned a computer) so I didn’t really experienced the division between fans... unlike today...

2 hours ago, Red Castle said:

Interesting video! The more things change, the more they stay the same...

Lucky for me, I was not really on the internet in 1999 (did not owned a computer) so I didn’t really experienced the division between fans... unlike today...

I did go through it, and I'd say the reaction today is much worse because of the prevalence of social media, and the accessibility of fans to the creators. You also didn't have NEARLY the sort of politics getting involved, which is a major driving factor now. While there was certainly some raised eyebrows over depictions of characters like Jar-Jar and the Nemoidians, you also didn't have the polarization — his has gotten EXTREMELY nasty — you're seeing over female characters such as Rey, and which we also see now in other franchises (IE backlash to Captain Marvel, or the "Girl Power" moment in Endgame).

3 hours ago, Ambaryerno said:

I did go through it, and I'd say the reaction today is much worse because of the prevalence of social media, and the accessibility of fans to the creators. You also didn't have NEARLY the sort of politics getting involved, which is a major driving factor now. While there was certainly some raised eyebrows over depictions of characters like Jar-Jar and the Nemoidians, you also didn't have the polarization — his has gotten EXTREMELY nasty — you're seeing over female characters such as Rey, and which we also see now in other franchises (IE backlash to Captain Marvel, or the "Girl Power" moment in Endgame).

Wait, there was backlash to the film's coolest moment?

6 hours ago, Captain Lackwit said:

Wait, there was backlash to the film's coolest moment?

Yes. There's a LOT of people ranting on social media how "Unrealistic" it was.

11 hours ago, Ambaryerno said:

I did go through it, and I'd say the reaction today is much worse because of the prevalence of social media, and the accessibility of fans to the creators. You also didn't have NEARLY the sort of politics getting involved, which is a major driving factor now. While there was certainly some raised eyebrows over depictions of characters like Jar-Jar and the Nemoidians, you also didn't have the polarization — his has gotten EXTREMELY nasty — you're seeing over female characters such as Rey, and which we also see now in other franchises (IE backlash to Captain Marvel, or the "Girl Power" moment in Endgame).

Easy access to the internet, more specifically to the social media, definetly help people to share their point of view and find other people that share it, be it positive or negative. Like I said, I was 18 years old when Episode 1 was released and didn't have access to the internet, and I'm sure I was far from being alone in this position in 1999. Fast forward to today, and it's hard to find someone that doesn't have access to the internet and social media. For better or worst. Add to that the anonymat that comes with it and things can get out of control pretty fast.

I think that what doesn't help is, like you said, the polarization of opinions. It seems that nowdays, you can't just like or dislike something. You must either hate it with all your guts or think that it's the better thing that ever came out. Which is of course not true for most, but now people tend to generalize when comes the time to speak of their opinion and create camps; you are either with us or against us. If you hate something, you must destroy it and nobody should be allowed to like it, and vice versa.

After watching this video, I decided to take a quick lookat other videos from the same youtuber and found this other gem:

5 hours ago, Ambaryerno said:

Yes. There's a LOT of people ranting on social media how "Unrealistic" it was.

That's stupid. These are all badass chicks getting their specific moment to really, really shine. They've all done really cool stuff before, what's wrong with it now? Guh.

38 minutes ago, Captain Lackwit said:

That's stupid. These are all badass chicks getting their specific moment to really, really shine. They've all done really cool stuff before, what's wrong with it now? Guh.

While I agree that it is stupid, as @Ambaryerno has more or less pointed out the boards and social media pages surrounding newer film's and other media have become proxy battlefields between heavily polarized social and political ideologies. A bunch of head up their asses, fingers in their ears, "anything that doesn't look like what I want it to is evil" fools railing against anyone that either don't tow their line from their "side" or present anything that conflicts with what they believe. People can do really awesome and/or awful things. Sex, gender, race, etc. honestly have no appreciable bearing on that outside of the societal mold that said awesome/awful people break away from or take advantage of.

14 hours ago, Captain Lackwit said:

Wait, there was backlash to the film's coolest moment?

I mean, if it isn't clear that there seems to be a fairly consistent... philosophy behind a lot of this in various geek fandoms, then you have been blessedly ignorant.

One of my favorite parts about the What We Left Behind documentary was the cast reading various fan letters about how DS9 was ruining Star Trek.

Interesting videos, particularly the 1999 one. I was using the internet back then but not visiting those types of sites, so missed all the online controversies. The comment about Jar Jar being a type of Shakespearean fool whose presence provides a satirical commentary almost makes me want to re-watch The Phantom Menace so I can study the character from a fresh perspective. Almost.

Oh hi 2015, how have you been?

I think the comparison between reactions to the tpm and tlj is flawed. Mostly because I like one and not the other and therefore everyone else is wrong by default.

Partly, however, TPM didn’t assassinate any characters, there was no backstory to overwrite. There hadn’t just been a bunch of moderately cool cliffhangers in the previous film that had just been thrown aside for someone else’s creative vision.

Spot on about fan reaction though. People don’t change

I was 15 when tpm came, and to this date the first, overwhelming emotion I associate with the prequels is "WE GET MORE STARWARS!". I like to think I was among the first Darth jar jar conspiracy theorists on the Lucasfilm forum, even though deep down we all knew it was far fetched. I hardly even considered the flaws the movies had, it was irrelevant.

This feeling stuck with me all through tlj, and I just appreciate the fact that this childish glee still makes me completely ignore the nerd rage. Nobody can mess with the joy I get from Star Wars.

5 hours ago, Estarriol said:

Partly, however, TPM didn’t assassinate any characters, there was no backstory to overwrite.

Midichlorians and young Anakin would like to have a word with you...

Yeah, let's not downplay the impact of turning "By the time I met him, he was already the greatest pilot in the galaxy" into, Obi-wan meeting a 8 year old kid who just won a pod racer race.

On 5/15/2019 at 1:19 PM, Captain Lackwit said:

That's stupid. These are all badass chicks getting their specific moment to really, really shine. They've all done really cool stuff before, what's wrong with it now? Guh.

Just for clarity, are you referring to the moment when all the women stop fighting and go to the same place to pose for the camera, or the fighting that they do afterward?

4 hours ago, TopHatGorilla said:

Just for clarity, are you referring to the moment when all the women stop fighting and go to the same place to pose for the camera, or the fighting that they do afterward?

Both. It's cool.

15 hours ago, TopHatGorilla said:

Just for clarity, are you referring to the moment when all the women stop fighting and go to the same place to pose for the camera, or the fighting that they do afterward?

And if it had been Hulk, Stark, Black Panther, Thor and Cap, NO ONE WOULD HAVE COMPLAINED.

It's entirely about a bunch of shrunken-******** dudebros having a panic attack over having even the smallest drop of estrogen in their male power fantasy (and I'm saying this AS a guy).

I honestly think that the pose broke up the pacing and removed a good bit of tension from the situation, and that just showing the sequence after that would have been better. Thanks for the answer, though.

The whole movie had pacing issues. That one bit of fanservice wasn't the biggest offense.

12 hours ago, Sithborg said:

The whole movie had pacing issues. That one bit of fanservice wasn't the biggest offense. 

I never said it was the worst offense, or that the rest of the movie had no pacing issues. So you seem to agree that having characters stand still for the camera in the middle of a race to the finish takes away from the urgency of the race.

On 5/19/2019 at 9:25 AM, Ambaryerno said:

And if it had been Hulk, Stark, Black Panther, Thor and Cap, NO ONE WOULD HAVE COMPLAINED.

It's entirely about a bunch of shrunken-******** dudebros having a panic attack over having even the smallest drop of estrogen in their male power fantasy (and I'm saying this AS a guy).

Possibly. It was a bit forced with the pose, but I think the scene would have overall been better had it been Nebula with the gauntlet since she could have used the help getting to the van, whereas I just can't see anything ever being a threat to Captain Marvel especially not when she just took out a large ship by herself all of 5 seconds ago.

So are the clone wars better over age?

My answer No, they are not. Now that doesn't mean I don't want to see the ships and factions in X-wing, Armada, Empire@War. I'd say put them in and let us play. But as far as having to own those movies and see them again, I can go without.

So did the new movies bring back Star Wars?

Define bring back? I'm sorry but the low point that the franchise was left in after episode 3 the franchise has yet to leave it. I'd use to say TFA was slightly better, but in hindsight that is not the case. Granted this is all subjective opinion but as I said before, after watching episode 9 it is going to have the same lingering feeling as I just watched episode 3.

Did the new movies ruin Star Wars?

Well if the Holiday special didn't ruin it then nothing will. To be fair the movies outside of the OT are just meh. It is mostly fluff padding that really you lose nothing for not knowing they exist. They are almost like all of the legends books. If you didn't read them you didn't miss out on anything. I heard about the Yuzahhn Vong through the 3rd party source material but never read any of those books. So in a way the prequels and the disneyverse is just like those books that no longer matter to the canon.

I will say, the cartoon definitely made the Clone Wars better. And with legends. the various other media was good as well. I love Shatterpoint and Dark Rendevous.

On 5/20/2019 at 8:24 AM, TopHatGorilla said:

So you seem to agree that having characters stand still for the camera in the middle of a race to the finish takes away from the urgency of the race.

On 5/23/2019 at 6:17 PM, Animewarsdude said:

It was a bit forced with the pose

Remember, it's a type of art, so the emotions the director/writer wants us to feel is more important than what might actually happen in reality (in our opinions). Of course, it's a fine line to walk because sacrificing too much of the realism for the sake of the message results in plot holes. The Women of Marvel moment was in no way a plot hole, so although some might argue that it jarred their sense of pacing, others (like my wife and I) were swept away by the emotions that shot portrayed.