FORCE ABILITY QUESTION

Here's a question about 1E. Does a character have to start the game with a Force Power in order to learn to use the Force? Or, can he become a Jedi later on, after the game starts?

In 2E, the answer is that a character first has to become Force Sensitive (a concept introduced in 2E), and then he can be trained in the use of the Force, even after character generation.

But, in 1E, it's not as clear.

First off, 1E uses attribute dice for Force Powers. You can put up to 3D in Force Powers (3 powers at 1D each, one power at 3D, or one power at 2D with a second power at 1D). For every D put into Force Powers, that's one less D that can be put into the character's six attributes.

It's not specifically spelled out, I don't think, but the feeling I get from RAW is that Force Powers--at least one of them--must be pre-conceived in 1E Star Wars when the character is generated.

I mean, is it fair that a character who starts the game with two Force Powers, 1D in each, has 2D less in attributes, while another character who did not start with Force Powers, acquires them during the game and doesn't experience the attribute penalty?

Then, the combat argument is, "Well, a character that starts with 1D in Force Powers and then grows his Force Powers after the game starts is not penalized in attribute dice (he only suffered the 1D set back at character creation)."

Thoughts?

A Force sensitive character only starts with a Force power if he or she has at least one die in one of the three Force Skills. Starting Force users can buy one die in each Force skill to start, and some templates start with one die each in one or more Force skills. These characters begin play with one power for each Force Skill they have a die in, and for each additional pip they raise each Force skill in from that point on, they learn one additional Force power that uses that skill. If all the character has is Force Sensitive, then that character doesn’t start with any powers.

I don't believe the concept of Force Sensitivity is included in 1E, is it? I think that's a concept that started in 2E.

19 hours ago, player3412539 said:

I don't believe the concept of Force Sensitivity is included in 1E, is it? I think that's a concept that started in 2E.

Yes, it is included.

Can you tell me a page number? The 2E character and template sheets have a check box for Force Sensitivity, but that's missing in 1E.

26 minutes ago, player3412539 said:

Can you tell me a page number? The 2E character and template sheets have a check box for Force Sensitivity, but that's missing in 1E.

Not without my book.

I don't see it in 1E. I'm pretty sure that it's a detail for the 2E game.

I don't have the book in front of me either, but I believe the concept in 1E is that anyone can be taught in the ways of the force during play. Thematically, this concept fits with the original films (ANH, in particular), and even if you look at Luke's stats in the 1E Sourcebook, I'm pretty sure he has the full 18D in his 'normal' attributes in addition to his Force attributes (but please, correct me if I'm wrong). Also, this fits with the concept of the Force being around everyone and everything, binding all things together... it just takes training and focus to be able to 'tap' into the Force. This was, of course, before the whole midi-cholorian pseudo-scientific crap was introduced in the prequels (not that I feel strongly about it or anything).

The concept of being 'Force Sensitive' was not introduced until 2E as I recall, which was also a roundabout way for starting characters to begin with 2 Force points instead of just 1 (as most of my players at the time tried to meta-game it!).

Anyway, I for one prefer the 1E/original concept, in that even the Smuggler or Bounty Hunter can learn the ways of the Force if he has a teacher... but that's also the catch in the OT setting, because the Jedi are virtually non-existent and teachers in the ways of the Force are extremely rare at best. Entire campaigns could be run just trying to find one who would teach the PCs.

I'm also a big fan of the idea of the Force not being the sole purview of the Jedi and the Sith (much alluded to in TLJ by Luke, actually)... the galaxy is huge, and the Force everywhere, so there could be myriad other forms of Force users to come across. In my games, if someone wants to be a Force user, I don't even have them take 'powers'... if they want to try to use the Force to do something, I just have them describe what they're trying to do, figure out if it fits close to existing uses as seen in the movies, determine which Force attribute(s) apply, and roll for it. If needed, I may look up a force 'power' as a guideline, but to me the Force is more organic and less "spell-casting" in nature.

Anyway, that's just my $0.02 on the issue as it relates to the 1E RPG, which I still run as my favorite SW RPG of all time. :-)

1 hour ago, Rampstrike said:

I don't have the book in front of me either, but I believe the concept in 1E is that anyone can be taught in the ways of the force during play. Thematically, this concept fits with the original films (ANH, in particular), and even if you look at Luke's stats in the 1E Sourcebook, I'm pretty sure he has the full 18D in his 'normal' attributes in addition to his Force attributes (but please, correct me if I'm wrong). Also, this fits with the concept of the Force being around everyone and everything, binding all things together... it just takes training and focus to be able to 'tap' into the Force. This was, of course, before the whole midi-cholorian pseudo-scientific crap was introduced in the prequels (not that I feel strongly about it or anything).

The concept of being 'Force Sensitive' was not introduced until 2E as I recall, which was also a roundabout way for starting characters to begin with 2 Force points instead of just 1 (as most of my players at the time tried to meta-game it!).

Anyway, I for one prefer the 1E/original concept, in that even the Smuggler or Bounty Hunter can learn the ways of the Force if he has a teacher... but that's also the catch in the OT setting, because the Jedi are virtually non-existent and teachers in the ways of the Force are extremely rare at best. Entire campaigns could be run just trying to find one who would teach the PCs.

I'm also a big fan of the idea of the Force not being the sole purview of the Jedi and the Sith (much alluded to in TLJ by Luke, actually)... the galaxy is huge, and the Force everywhere, so there could be myriad other forms of Force users to come across. In my games, if someone wants to be a Force user, I don't even have them take 'powers'... if they want to try to use the Force to do something, I just have them describe what they're trying to do, figure out if it fits close to existing uses as seen in the movies, determine which Force attribute(s) apply, and roll for it. If needed, I may look up a force 'power' as a guideline, but to me the Force is more organic and less "spell-casting" in nature.

Anyway, that's just my $0.02 on the issue as it relates to the 1E RPG, which I still run as my favorite SW RPG of all time. :-)

I thought you might have answered my question for me, but I checked the 1E Sourcebook.

Luke's stats are

STR 3D

DEX 3D

PER 2D+1

KNO 2D

MEC 4D

TEC 3D

Looks like Luke started with one Force Skill at 1D and took the hit to stats, but has since gained a +1 improvement to stats.

He has the same stats in GG1 (1E versions).

This leads me to believe that characters who want to start using The Force must have at least one Force Skill at the time of character generation, even if the character doesn't realize that they have the power. Like Rey in TFA. She thought her abilities were natural.

I just had a chance to re-read the Force section in the 1E book, and from what I can tell, you're right. Thanks for clearing that up! 😏

What's interesting is both Leia and Obi-wan have 18D in their stats, according to the Sourcebook. So does Yoda and Vader.

I would say that Ben, Yoda, and Vader maybe replenished any attribute depletion that they may have had as characters in their long careers... except, there are no rules for improving attributes in basic core rulebook 1E. What a character has at the time of character creation is what he has during his entire life.

So, Ben, Yoda, and Vader started with 18D and grew strong in the Force later.

It is interesting that the biggest hero in the galaxy, Luke Skywalker, doesn't have 18D in his attributes. He has 17D +1.

Maybe the authors docked him two pips because he's a young, 19 year old farmboy? But, the counter argument to that is that Leia is a 19 year old Senatorial, and she's got all her dice.