This is from the last round of 1.0 store tournaments, so bear with me. I just can't stop thinking about it and wondered what you guys thought.

My list was:

Wes with VI, Flight-assist, and the retrofit+S fouls

Wedge with a EPT I can't remember, flight assist, and retrofit+S foils

Poe with Intensity, BB-8, Autothrusters, and Black one.

Game one: Win. 0-100

This game was against a guy flying 5 rookies with flight assist and the fix cards. I'd played it before and knew how to beat it, so I had no trouble. I split his formation with rocks so the ge became separate duels, between one of my ships and one or two rookies.

Wedge beat the enemy rookie pretty quickly, so he came to support poe, and my advantage just snowballed. Wes was pretty damaged but not killed, so I kept points.

Game 2:Win. ?-?

This was JJ, a great friend of mine who flys... creative lists. He brought 5 syck interceptors, with assorted cannons.

I don't remember much about this game, but I know I nuked the HLC carriers pretty quick, and I know I won.

Game 3: loss. 100-0(or 25, I can't remember)

This game was against a guy named Jeff, who I still have yet to beat. He flew 4x B-wings with the add-a-evade card and (I think) tractor beam.

I ended up jousting them, despite my efforts to avoid a joust, and Poe got nuked. From there on he just chased down the rest of the list.

Game 4: Win. 100-29ish

My opponent brought supertanky assaj Ventress, with party bus lite and nashta pup. The game went well from the beginning. He tried a variety of illict upgrade gimmicks, but I called them all and burned down bossk. The turn after, the nashta pup nashta popped, and I chased down assaj. Wedge flew off the board though :(.

game 5: Win: 30-50ish-70ish

this guy had a five ship list consisting of two rookies, two A wings w/ crack shot and snap shot, and AP-5.

I had a plan at the start, and it worked. I set up a range 2 engagement and Took a X wing off the board, for little damage in return. I handled the ensuing knife fight pretty well, the As never got to use snap shot, and I was able to outfly him until time, when he had one or two A wing remaining.

Game 6: Top Table!

my opponent was flying basic Nymiranda. We dogfight for a few turns, and I've killed nym, but wes and wedge are at 3 and 2 hull, respectively. My dumb **** flies wedge off the board with a carelessly use of flight assist astromech. At this point, this turn, I could have won the game, but because I used my action for a barrel roll instead of flight assist(which I definitely could have used to get arc)I had no focus, which ended up killing wes when miranda shot at him at range one. From there on, I spend thirty minutes evading all of Miranda's shots with poe, and miranda regaling every shot. The last turn I put a damaged engine on her, but couldn't kill her, meaning I lost on points.

I got fourth place at the top table.

there was another player who lost his first game, putting him in a lower bracket, giving him high-margin wins, which netted him 2nd place.

is that normal? It's just a genuine question, and I need to get it off my mind because I can't stop thinking about it

2 hours ago, Roller of blanks said:

I got fourth place at the top table.

there was another player who lost his first game, putting him in a lower bracket, giving him high-margin wins, which netted him 2nd place.

is that normal? It's just a genuine question, and I need to get it off my mind because I can't stop thinking about it

If you are talking about 6 rounds of swiss with no cut then yes it is very normal. Depending on the size of the event, there can be more than one "top table" with the winner playing for first and the loser plummeting down the ranks. Heck, if there are 65+ players you can go undefeated and still place second.

People who purposefully lose the first round with the plan to get the rest good wins are using a strategy called "submarining" - dive round 1 to resurface later in the event.

Yeah, i've run into this tactic a few times, especially at team tournaments. Apparently, it's all part of "the meta." It's just not a part that is frequently discussed, particularly as most folk feel it pretty unsporting. You were indeed robbed, "from a certain point of view." But you gotta let it go, don't center on a few bad apples, and play your own game, right?

1 hour ago, Kleeg005 said:

Yeah, i've run into this tactic a few times, especially at team tournaments. Apparently, it's all part of "the meta." It's just not a part that is frequently discussed, particularly as most folk feel it pretty unsporting. You were indeed robbed, "from a certain point of view." But you gotta let it go, don't center on a few bad apples, and play your own game, right?

Thanks. I needed that

Man, I regret that I never got to play around with B-Wings with Thrust Corrector. I'd have gone Linked Battery, for a reroll on my primary attacks. The math on them as a swarm works out really well.

//

4th place as 4-2 (losses to B-Wings and NymRanda, right?) doesn't seem too bad.

As to submarining in general... strikes me as it shouldn't matter too much after a few rounds... Consider: someone who lost the first round but won the next 2 would be the same 2-1 as someone who won 2 and lost the 3rd game, so should be equal for pairings, right?

6 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

As to submarining in general... strikes me as it shouldn't matter too much after a few rounds... Consider: someone who lost the first round but won the next 2 would be the same 2-1 as someone who won 2 and lost the 3rd game, so should be equal for pairings, right?

Theoretically, you'd have a much easier time building MoV. If you throw your first game by just a little, say 27-54, then stomp your next few "easier" opponents 100-0....

It is only submarining if it is done on purpose. Otherwise, it is just how the cookie crumbles without a top cut.

20 hours ago, DarkHorse said:

It is only submarining if it is done on purpose. Otherwise, it is just how the cookie crumbles without a top cut.

I feel like I've heard the term used otherwise. "Oh, I got a bad beat early, but submarined my way back into the cut."

Happens when there's no cut, my friend. Similar situation, made a poor choice that cost the final table game, but MOV put me 6th, despite being 5-1. Oh well

It doesn't sound like it.

The Win/Loss ratio is the primary determination for victory, but if you are tied for wins, then the Margin Of Victory (MOV) score is used.

So it looks like you had a series of really tough challenging bouts that were close, which would drop your MOV score.

I actually lost out on a prize bracket one month because my MOV was 1 point less than the player above me.