2 hours ago, BannerGuard said:

An AT-AT has 4 armor and 40 HT you can get to 19 after crafting the frame (Reinforced Construction x4 +15) but the still leaves you 21 HT short. 21/4 is about 5 reinforced frames and we are out of hard points because 5 reinforced frames take two HP each =10 so ten hp total max possible hp is twelve. That leaves us two hp left and we still need 4 for the weapons (and that is not counting the bike racks).

Max possible HP would be 21 (10 from basic Walker frame, 3 hp from crafting upgrades and 8 from 2 mods on the Gunship hull)

Also, while the fluff material does show/mention space for speeder bikes, the actual stats in the game do not. I'm actually working on the AT-AT right now.

All Terrain Armored Transport (AT-AT, AoR Core pg. 264)
Crew: 6, Passengers: 0, Enc: 100, H:40, SST:35, Spd: 1, Def: 0/0, A:5, Sensors: Short, Hand: -3, HP: 3, Wpns: 2

Walker Frame: 15 hull, 10 hp, 1 crew, 0 passengers; Crafting Upgrades: Passenger Quarters x5 - Passengers=10, Reinforced Construction x4 - Hull=19, Larger Scope - Crew=2 Passengers=20, Integrated Improvements - Passengers=40, Extra HP - HP=11

Single Ion Coil: 2 HP, HP=9, Speed 1, 8 SST, Def 0/0/0/0, SST mod x3 - SST=20; Crafting Upgrade: Fine Tuned Circuits x3 - SST=23

Gunship Hull: HP=9; 3 Armor, -2 Handling, Armor mods x1 - Armor=4, Increase HP by Sil & double crew x2 - Crew=8, HP=17; Crafting Upgrades: Cargo Pod x3 - Enc.=95, Extra HP - HP=18, Layered Plating - Armor 5, Flies Like a Brick - Handling=-3

Assembly: Crafting Upgrade - Extra HP - HP=19

2 Weapons HP=17

Sensors HP=16

Reinforced Frame x5 - HP=6, Hull=39

Auxiliary Generators x3 - HP=0, SST=35

All Terrain Armored Transport (AT-AT)
Crew: 8, Passengers: 40, Enc: 95, H:39, SST:35, Spd: 1, Def: 0/0, A:5, Sensors: Short, Hand: -3, HP: 0, Wpns: 2

2 higher Crew, 5 fewer Enc, 1 fewer Hull, and 3 fewer HP

The AT-TE has pretty much the same basic stats as the AT-AT (those that really matter for construction) but more weapons. Where the AT-AT falls short by 3 HP, the AT-TE will fall short by 5 HP

All Terrain Explorer Transport (AT-ET, Savage Spirits pg. 56)
Crew: 2, Passengers: 4, Enc: 25, H:15, SS:10, Spd: 1, Def: 0/0, A:1, Sensors: Medium, Hand: +0, HP: 6, Wpns: 0

Walker Frame: 10 hull, 8 hp, 1 crew, 0 passengers; Crafting Upgrades: Integrated Improvements=Crew 2, Passenger Quarters x2=Passengers 4, Reinforced Construction x2=Hull 12, Extra HP - HP=9

Single Ion Coil: 2 HP, HP=7, Speed 1, 6 SST, Def 0/0/0/0, SST mod x1 - SST=9; Crafting Upgrade: Fine Tuned Circuits x1 -SST=10

Basic Hull: HP=7; 1 Armor, -2 Handling, Handling mod - Handling=-1, Crafting Upgrades: 2x Cargo Pod - Enc.=25, Maneuvering Fins x1 - Handling=0, Extra HP - HP=8

Assembly: Crafting Upgrade: Extra HP - HP=9

Sensors HP=8 Upgrade Sensor range mod x1

Reinforced Frame HP=6, Hull=15

All Terrain Scout Transport (AT-ET)
Crew: 2, Passengers: 4, Enc: 25, H:15, SS:10, Spd: 1, Def: 0/0, A:1, Sensors: Medium, Hand: +0, HP: 6, Wpns: 0

Spot on.

All Terrain Personal Transport (AT-PT, EotE Core pg. 252)
Crew: 1, Passengers: 1, Enc: 15, H:6, SS:5, Spd: 2, Def: 0/0, A:3, Sensors: Close, Hand: +0, HP: 1, Wpns: 2

Walker Frame: Elegant Design = 5 Hull, 6 HP, 1 crew, 0 Passengers, Extra HP=HP 7; Crafting Upgrades: Elegant Design, Passenger Quarters x1 - Passengers=1, Reinforced Construction x1 - Hull=6

Single Ion Coil: 2 HP - HP=4, Speed 1; 4 SST; Def 0/0/0/0; 1 Speed mod = speed 2; Crafting Upgrade: Fine Tuned Circuits x1 - SST=5

Basic hull: 1 Armor, -2 Handling; Armor mod x2 - Armor=3, Improve Handling x1 - Handling=-1; Crafting Upgrade 1x Cargo Pod x3 - Enc.=17, Maneuvering Fins x1 - Handling=0

2 weapon -2 HP - HP=2

Basic Sensors 0HP

Final

All Terrain Personal Transport (AT-PT)
Crew: 1, Passengers: 1, Enc: 17, H:6, SS:5, Spd: 2, Def: 0/0, A:3, Sensors: Close, Hand: +0, HP: 2, Wpns: 2

2 higher Enc and 1 higher HP

What if walkers can get the crafting upgrads reinforced construction 3 times and integrated improvements(need fewer passenger quarters to save advantage) twice? Would that solve the hp issue with the AT-AT and AT-TE?

A large part of the problem with the AT-AT is the inability to use the ion turbine engine because it provides shields... so what if there was a ion turbine modification option called no shields... if the ion turbine engine has this modification option the vehicle loses all defense from shields regardless of whatever other upgrades or attachments or modifications it has... the vessel can NEVER have shields... the benefit is it gains 2 add silhouette sst modifications (you still have to mod those separately). Then the at-at could have 15+5x4=35 sst without using any auxiliary generators and it would therefore save 5 hp relative to the current build, which gets the at-te right and without 3 +1hp crafting upgrades it gets the at-at right also add 1 integrated improvements and 1 reinforced construction and one base ar from hull=0 to the Walker frame.

Edit: aught to allow the reinforced shield generators attachment to add shields... but no to shields from engine hull or military grade shield generators attachment. Also the no shields modification should provide +Silhouette sst and add one additional +silhouette modification option because you can't do more than 5 mods total.

4 hours ago, EliasWindrider said:

A large part of the problem with the AT-AT is the inability to use the ion turbine engine because it provides shields... so what if there was a ion turbine modification option called no shields... if the ion turbine engine has this modification option the vehicle loses all defense from shields regardless of whatever other upgrades or attachments or modifications it has... the vessel can NEVER have shields... the benefit is it gains 2 add silhouette sst modifications (you still have to mod those separately). Then the at-at could have 15+5x4=35 sst without using any auxiliary generators and it would therefore save 5 hp relative to the current build, which gets the at-te right and without 3 +1hp crafting upgrades it gets the at-at right also add 1 integrated improvements and 1 reinforced construction and one base ar from hull=0 to the Walker frame.

Edit: aught to allow the reinforced shield generators attachment to add shields... but no to shields from engine hull or military grade shield generators attachment. Also the no shields modification should provide +Silhouette sst and add one additional +silhouette modification option because you can't do more than 5 mods total.

This sounds like an all around better option, personally.

1 hour ago, Jareth Valar said:

This sounds like an all around better option, personally.

Thanks

37 minutes ago, EliasWindrider said:

Thanks

Of course, that's what the thread is for. 🙂

Redone with the changes you mentioned above. Thoughts?

All Terrain Armored Transport (AT-AT, AoR Core pg. 264)
Crew: 5, Passengers: 40, Enc: 100, H:40, SST:35, Spd: 1, Def: 0/0, A:5, Sensors: Short, Hand: -3, HP: 3, Wpns: 2

Walker Frame: 15 hull, 10 hp, 1 crew, 0 passengers; Crafting Upgrades: Passenger Quarters x5 - Passengers=10, Reinforced Construction x5 - Hull=20, Larger Scope - Crew=2 Passengers=20, Integrated Improvements - Passengers=40, Integrated Improvements - Crew=1

Ion Turbine Engine : 3 HP, HP=7, Speed 1, 15 SST, Def 1/0/0/0; Crafting Upgrade: No Shields mod, SST mod x5 - SST=35

Gunship Hull: HP=7; 2 Armor (3 base -1 from Walker frame), -2 Handling, Armor mods x1 - Armor=3, Increase HP by Sil & double crew x2 - Crew=4, HP=15; Crafting Upgrades: Cargo Pod x3 - Enc.=95, Layered Plating x2 - Armor 5, Flies Like a Brick - Handling=-3

Assembly: Crafting Upgrade - Extra HP - HP=16

2 Weapons HP=14

Sensors HP=13

Mothership Docking clamp HP=13

Reinforced Frame x5 - HP=3, Hull=40

All Terrain Armored Transport (AT-AT)
Crew: 4, Passengers: 40, Enc: 95, H:40, SST:35, Spd: 1, Def: 0/0, A:5, Sensors: Short, Hand: -3, HP: 3, Wpns: 2

1 fewer Crew (This doesn't bother me as the 5th crew member is just a Loadmaster), 5 fewer Enc

AT-TE with the above mentioned changes.

All Terrain Tactical Enforcer (AT-TE, Forged in Battle pg. 57)
Crew: 8, Passengers: 20, Enc: 40, H:40, SST:35, Spd: 1, Def: 0/0, A:4, Sensors: Short, Hand: -2, HP: 2, Wpns: 5

Walker Frame: 15 hull, 10 hp, 1 crew, 0 passengers; Crafting Upgrades: Passenger Quarters x5 - Passengers=10, Reinforced Construction x5 - Hull=20, Larger Scope - Crew=2 Passengers=20, Extra HP - HP=11

Ion Turbine Engine : 3 HP, HP=8, Speed 1, 15 SST, Def 1/0/0/0; Crafting Upgrade: No Shields mod, SST mod x5 - SST=35

Gunship Hull: HP=8; 2 Armor (3 base -1 from Walker frame), -2 Handling, Armor mods x1 - Armor=3, Increase HP by Sil & double crew x2 - Crew=4, HP=16; Crafting Upgrades: Cargo Pod x1 - Enc.=35, Layered Plating x1 - Armor 4, Extra HP - HP=17

Assembly: Crafting Upgrade - Extra HP - HP=18

5 Weapons HP=13

Mothership Docking clamp HP=13

Sensors HP=12

Reinforced Frame x5 - HP=2, Hull=40

All Terrain Armored Transport (AT-AT)
Crew: 8, Passengers: 20, Enc: 35, H:40, SST:35, Spd: 1, Def: 0/0, A:4, Sensors: Short, Hand: -2, HP: 2, Wpns: 5

5 fewer Enc, Given the range and relative size of the mass driver cannon (since I can't find if there are stats elsewhere) I think it would be an oversized weapon. Not sure how to add the Dynamic Actuator Pistons.

6 hours ago, Jareth Valar said:

AT-TE with the above mentioned changes.

All Terrain Tactical Enforcer (AT-TE, Forged in Battle pg. 57)
Crew: 8, Passengers: 20, Enc: 40, H:40, SST:35, Spd: 1, Def: 0/0, A:4, Sensors: Short, Hand: -2, HP: 2, Wpns: 5

Walker Frame: 15 hull, 10 hp, 1 crew, 0 passengers; Crafting Upgrades: Passenger Quarters x5 - Passengers=10, Reinforced Construction x5 - Hull=20, Larger Scope - Crew=2 Passengers=20, Extra HP - HP=11

Ion Turbine Engine : 3 HP, HP=8, Speed 1, 15 SST, Def 1/0/0/0; Crafting Upgrade: No Shields mod, SST mod x5 - SST=35

Gunship Hull: HP=8; 2 Armor (3 base -1 from Walker frame), -2 Handling, Armor mods x1 - Armor=3, Increase HP by Sil & double crew x2 - Crew=4, HP=16; Crafting Upgrades: Cargo Pod x1 - Enc.=35, Layered Plating x1 - Armor 4, Extra HP - HP=17

Assembly: Crafting Upgrade - Extra HP - HP=18

5 Weapons HP=13

Sensors HP=12

Reinforced Frame x5 - HP=2, Hull=40

All Terrain Armored Transport (AT-AT)
Crew: 8, Passengers: 20, Enc: 35, H:40, SST:35, Spd: 1, Def: 0/0, A:4, Sensors: Short, Hand: -2, HP: 2, Wpns: 5

5 fewer Enc, Given the range and relative size of the mass driver cannon (since I can't find if there are stats elsewhere) I think it would be an oversized weapon. Not sure how to add the Dynamic Actuator Pistons.

Don't forget the mothership docking clamp so it can be carried by a laat/c, at-at probably needs one too.

4 hours ago, EliasWindrider said:

Don't forget the mothership docking clamp so it can be carried by a laat/c, at-at probably needs one too.

Doht!. Don't know how I forgot that, especially since the AT-TE was one of the main reasons for it. Fixed now.

You mentioned earlier about the names for those being up for suggestion. Suggestion then: Mothership Docking Clamp=Modular Docking Clamp and the Modular Pod Docking Clamp=Modular Dock Housing? Housing to me always brought to mind something that..well... houses something. Just a thought.

All Terrain Riot Control Transport (AT-RCT, Far Horizons pg. 53)
Crew: 2, Passengers: 0, Enc: 10, H:8, SST:8, Spd: 2, Def: 0/0, A:3, Sensors: Close, Hand: +0, HP: 2, Wpns: 3

Walker Frame: 10 hull, 8 hp, 1 crew, 0 passengers; Crafting Upgrades: Integrated Improvements=Crew 2

Single Ion Coil: 2 HP, HP=6, Speed 1, 6 SST, Def 0/0/0/0; Speed +1 mod Speed=2; Crafting Upgrade: Fine Tuned Circuits x2 -SST=8

Basic Hull: HP=6; 0 Armor, -2 Handling, Armor mod x2 - Armor=2, Handling mod - Handling=-1, Crafting Upgrades: 1x Cargo Pod - Enc.=15, Maneuvering Fins x1 - Handling=0, Layered Plating - Armor=3

Basic Sensors HP=6

Weapons x3 HP=3

All Terrain Riot Control Transport (AT-ET)
Crew: 2, Passengers: 0, Enc: 15, H:10, SST:8, Spd: 2, Def: 0/0, A:3, Sensors: Close, Hand: +0, HP: 3, Wpns: 3

Enc was going to be either 5 higher or 5 lower, Hull is 2 higher, HP is 1 higher

7 hours ago, Jareth Valar said:

All Terrain Riot Control Transport (AT-RCT, Far Horizons pg. 53)
Crew: 2, Passengers: 0, Enc: 10, H:8, SST:8, Spd: 2, Def: 0/0, A:3, Sensors: Close, Hand: +0, HP: 2, Wpns: 3

Walker Frame: 10 hull, 8 hp, 1 crew, 0 passengers; Crafting Upgrades: Integrated Improvements=Crew 2

Single Ion Coil: 2 HP, HP=6, Speed 1, 6 SST, Def 0/0/0/0; Speed +1 mod Speed=2; Crafting Upgrade: Fine Tuned Circuits x2 -SST=8

Basic Hull: HP=6; 0 Armor, -2 Handling, Armor mod x2 - Armor=2, Handling mod - Handling=-1, Crafting Upgrades: 1x Cargo Pod - Enc.=15, Maneuvering Fins x1 - Handling=0, Layered Plating - Armor=3

Basic Sensors HP=6

Weapons x3 HP=3

All Terrain Riot Control Transport (AT-ET)
Crew: 2, Passengers: 0, Enc: 15, H:10, SST:8, Spd: 2, Def: 0/0, A:3, Sensors: Close, Hand: +0, HP: 3, Wpns: 3

Enc was going to be either 5 higher or 5 lower, Hull is 2 higher, HP is 1 higher

Hmm, it seems like it's close but quite right... there almost needs to be a bipedal or fast or light walker frame. Where that would be opposed to a heavy walker.

Light Walker and Heavy Walker Frames sound good.

Plus, maybe Light and Heavy Ground Vehicle Frames to cover tracked and wheeled vehicles? Not sure how they fit in, but we do have examples of tracked vehicles (Sandcrawlers come to mind).

47 minutes ago, salamar_dree said:

Light Walker and Heavy Walker Frames sound good.

Plus, maybe Light and Heavy Ground Vehicle Frames to cover tracked and wheeled vehicles? Not sure how they fit in, but we do have examples of tracked vehicles (Sandcrawlers come to mind).

And T-4bs, not sure how cannon they were even in legends.

At the moment I'm of the opinion that the light and heavy Walker frames could be refluff to handle wheeled and tracked vehicles... maybe call the frame classes ground vehicles which includes walkers, tracked and wheeled vehicles. Wheeled shout be faster tracked and walkers are all terrain... not sure what the mechanic behind all terrain should be.

I admit to this being an uniformed opinion/gut feeling and I'm willing to be convinced of a game mechanical need to distinguish between wheeled/tracked vs. walker.

7 minutes ago, EliasWindrider said:

At the moment I'm of the opinion that the light and heavy Walker frames could be refluff to handle wheeled and tracked vehicles... maybe call the frame classes ground vehicles which includes walkers, tracked and wheeled vehicles. Wheeled shout be faster tracked and walkers are all terrain... not sure what the mechanic behind all terrain should be.

I admit to this being an uniformed opinion/gut feeling and I'm willing to be convinced of a game mechanical need to distinguish between wheeled/tracked vs. walker.

Actually, I was just logging back on the say the same thing. I feel that adding a light and heavy to the walker is a good choice but adding light and heavy ground craft to what we already have might be a bit too much.

Making the walker frame(s) basic ground craft, to me, seems the better choice. Perhaps, like your suggestion with the engines, allow for a choice to remove the legs in replacement for wheels/treads. Perhaps just an option for a difference in a statistic or too perhaps? Not sure as to what at the moment, but for some reason it just seems more appropriate. Just me thoughts.

Either way, I'll keep plugging away at what I can. After walkers, I might try bikes/swoops or maybe land/air speeders. Suggestions?

Also, there are submersibles. I know there is the aquatic attachment, but should there be an option to to do so during creation? Personally I think it could just be an option for speeders, allowing their maximum ceiling to be used for maximum depth (with a different maximum obviously). Maybe a HP or 2 in the components section?

Maybe 1 HP to make it a submersible only (modifying the altitude to depth) and 2 HP or 3 HP to allow it to so both? Don't know if there is anything currently in fluff that does both really.

Thoughts?

All Terrain Anti-Aircraft (AT-AA, Stay on Target pg. 49)
Crew: 3, Passengers: 2, Enc: 25, H:20, SST:18, Spd: 1, Def: 0/0, A:4, Sensors: Medium, Hand: -2, HP: 0, Wpns: 1

Walker Frame: 15 hull, 10 hp, 1 crew, 0 passengers; Crafting Upgrades: Reinforced Construction x1 - Hull=16, Larger Scope - Crew=2 Passengers=0, Crew Quarters x1 - Crew=3, Passenger Quarters x1 - Passengers=2

Single Ion Coil : 2 HP, HP=8, Speed 1, 8 SST, Def 0/0/0/0; SST mod x2 - SST=16, Crafting Upgrade: Fine-Tunes Circuits x2 - SST=18

Basic Hull: HP=8; 0 Armor (1 base -1 from Walker frame), -2 Handling, Armor mods x2 - Armor=2 , Crafting Upgrades: Cargo Pod x1 - Enc.=35, Layered Plating x2 - Armor 4

1 Weapons HP=7

Sensors HP=6 Increase Sensor Range mod x1

Reinforced Frame x1 - HP=4, Hull=20

All Terrain Anti-Aircraft (AT-AA)
Crew: 3, Passengers: 2, Enc: 35, H:20, SST:18, Spd: 1, Def: 0/0, A:4, Sensors: Medium, Hand: -2, HP: 4, Wpns: 1

10 higher Enc, 4 higher HP

Elias, question that is a little beyond the scope of this document, but wanting your input (and others of course!)

Production models. We are constructing all of the ships/vehicles as if they are one off vehicles. How would you handle production? Obviously it would "lock out" any additional modifications that are left undone thus forcing aftermarket attachments, but any thoughts on how to go from there?

Just asking because if a player does all of the hard work and comes up with a very good design and tries to market it, what would the final "actual" vehicle/ship look like?

Just a thought exercise for me. The money from selling a design would of course be an issue...or not depending on your game, but definitely a curiosity.

40 minutes ago, Jareth Valar said:

Actually, I was just logging back on the say the same thing. I feel that adding a light and heavy to the walker is a good choice but adding light and heavy ground craft to what we already have might be a bit too much.

Making the walker frame(s) basic ground craft, to me, seems the better choice. Perhaps, like your suggestion with the engines, allow for a choice to remove the legs in replacement for wheels/treads. Perhaps just an option for a difference in a statistic or too perhaps? Not sure as to what at the moment, but for some reason it just seems more appropriate. Just me thoughts.

Either way, I'll keep plugging away at what I can. After walkers, I might try bikes/swoops or maybe land/air speeders. Suggestions?

For THIS step there was an athletic walker... crazy fast for a walker... and wheeled and tracked. For the NEXT step landspeeders and swoops/speeder bikes.

18 minutes ago, Jareth Valar said:

Elias, question that is a little beyond the scope of this document, but wanting your input (and others of course!)

Production models. We are constructing all of the ships/vehicles as if they are one off vehicles. How would you handle production? Obviously it would "lock out" any additional modifications that are left undone thus forcing aftermarket attachments, but any thoughts on how to go from there?

Just asking because if a player does all of the hard work and comes up with a very good design and tries to market it, what would the final "actual" vehicle/ship look like?

Just a thought exercise for me. The money from selling a design would of course be an issue...or not depending on your game, but definitely a curiosity.

I disagree that it's beyond the scope of the document, would think that there should be a two triumph "mass production ready" crafting upgrade on assembly, that sets the difficulty at the standard difficulty (not reduced by schematic) of each component, and simple success with no threat or despair is needed to duplicate it one of the components, the only thing advantageor triumph can be used for during mass production is lessons learned... and it just there to increase likelihood of success.