Per the displacement rules, troopers that are engaged cannot be displaced or moved through. Does this mean that if a melee was taking place directly in front of a speeder, it couldn’t take it’s compulsory move over the melee and would have to take a partial move and take it’s movement in damage?

It seems very counter intuitive that an air speeder would crash because two guys are swinging laser swords at each other on the ground in front of it, but as far as I can find in the rules that’s how it works.

Thanks!

I don’t have the rules in front of me, but we ran into this recently and decided that the speeder goes over not through due to Speeder 1 keyword.

I agree that's how it should work, but Speeder only applies to terrain. And the Repulsor Vehicle Movement Summary refers to moving through units, not over them.

@Big Easy this might be a good one for you compilation of rules that need clarification.

RAW, it seems the speeder is supposed to stop short of the engagement. However, that just doesn't make sense.

Per RRG page 34:

A trooper mini can move through friendly and enemy
trooper minis and repulsor vehicle minis.

I think the intent of the displacement rule you're talking about is to counter the above passage. So trooper "A" can no longer move through trooper "B" if "B" is engaged. Clarification would be good, though.

17 hours ago, player3235696 said:

Per the displacement rules, troopers that are engaged cannot be displaced or moved through. Does this mean that if a melee was taking place directly in front of a speeder, it couldn’t take it’s compulsory move over the melee and would have to take a partial move and take it’s movement in damage?

It seems very counter intuitive that an air speeder would crash because two guys are swinging laser swords at each other on the ground in front of it, but as far as I can find in the rules that’s how it works.

Thanks!

In your example, is there no other possible move for the speeder to end it's compulsory move than on top of an Engaged Trooper mini?

I think that a lot of the questions regarding Speeder movement are due to people not wanting to accept that they may not be able to move their Speeder to a position they want to due to other battlefield circumstances that are already accounted for in the rules. This doesn't mean there is not another legal position for their Speeder to end the compulsory move, just that it isn't where they want to be.

No, what I mean is there is a melee happening directly in front of the speeder, before the bend in the template. Per the displacement rules, the models cannot move through other engaged models. It’s not about landing on engaged models, it’s about not being able to move through them.

1 hour ago, player3235696 said:

No, what I mean is there is a melee happening directly in front of the speeder, before the bend in the template. Per the displacement rules, the models cannot move through other engaged models. It’s not about landing on engaged models, it’s about not being able to move through them.

Repulsor vehicles only displace on final resting position of the compulsory move, so they would move over the melee if it was right infront of it when the speeder started its movement. Under displacment, pg 25. At least thats how I interpret it since they specify different displacement mechanics for ground and repulsor vehicles.

Well, per the displacement rules, trooper units that are engaged cannot be moved through. And on pg. 34, the repulser vehicle movement summary refers to repulsor vehicles moving through units, not over them. I haven’t seen moving over units referred to in the rules, only moving through.

Maybe I’m reading it wrong, but I’m pretty certain that melees cause speeders to crash right now. I don’t think it’s intended to work this way, and probably needs to be clarified.

On 4/3/2018 at 12:50 AM, player3235696 said:

Per the displacement rules, troopers that are engaged cannot be displaced or moved through. Does this mean that if a melee was taking place directly in front of a speeder, it couldn’t take it’s compulsory move over the melee and would have to take a partial move and take it’s movement in damage?

It seems very counter intuitive that an air speeder would crash because two guys are swinging laser swords at each other on the ground in front of it, but as far as I can find in the rules that’s how it works.

Thanks!

If the trooper minis cannot be displaced, then the speeder would not be allowed to end its compulsory movement over them. If there is no valid location (and that seems highly unlikely given the rules for melee cause the troopers to bunch up), then it would have to be a partial move.

Designer Alex Davy has reportedly stated that such a partial move is not intended to trigger the forced damage, as the vehicle is hypothetically capable of passing over the troopers (as opposed to say, terrain of a height that the speeder couldn’t cross it).

I thought that you could end your compulsory movement on troops because that isn't the final place where your model will end it's completed move?

9 minutes ago, Son of Skywalker said:

I thought that you could end your compulsory movement on troops because that isn't the final place where your model will end it's completed move?

But it can be. If the bikes do not use a move action, they would stay righ on top of these troopers. And when these troopers are in an engagement, they cannot be displaced.

Following the RRG the bikes would have to do a partical move and recieve damage because of this. If Alex already said this was not intended, i guess will be fixed in the next RRG or FAQ and should be played as it was indended (but this is up to the TO or the players).

8 hours ago, Derrault said:

If the trooper minis cannot be displaced, then the speeder would not be allowed to end its compulsory movement over them. If there is no valid location (and that seems highly unlikely given the rules for melee cause the troopers to bunch up), then it would have to be a partial move.

Designer Alex Davy has reportedly stated that such a partial move is not intended to trigger the forced damage, as the vehicle is hypothetically capable of passing over the troopers (as opposed to say, terrain of a height that the speeder couldn’t cross it).

Again, it’s not about displacement, the speeder can’t move over them at all. Even if it has a spot to land that is clear of models. I’ll take a picture illustrating tomorrow at the game store, it doesn’t seem that hard to set up.

But if the dev says is not intended to force the damage, then that makes perfect sense. That’s good enough clarification for me.

28 minutes ago, player3235696 said:

Again, it’s not about displacement, the speeder can’t move over them at all. Even if it has a spot to land that is clear of models. I’ll take a picture illustrating tomorrow at the game store, it doesn’t seem that hard to set up.

But if the dev says is not intended to force the damage, then that makes perfect sense. That’s good enough clarification for me.

Speeders (repulsor vehicles) can always pass through troopers.

The only situation under consideration is when a speeder has a compulsory move that would force them to end their movement overlapping a trooper mini.

Normally this is the one scenario in which a repulsor vehicle would displace (ground vehicles displace by moving through), but the engagement rules for melee indicate that engaged troopers aren’t displaceable.

So the repulsor must stop short, not because they can’t fly over, they absolutely could on another move, but because they can’t displace. Same as if the repulsor end move wanted to overlap a vehicle, can’t happen. Flyover? Sure. End? No.

According to the displacement rules on pg. 25, nothing passes through engaged troopers. Does repulsor vehicle movement override that? I didn’t see anything indicating that.

4 minutes ago, player3235696 said:

According to the displacement rules on pg. 25, nothing passes through engaged troopers. Does repulsor vehicle movement override that? I didn’t see anything indicating that.

RRG pg 45:

Repulsor vehicles can move through troopers and vehicles. Only repulsor vehicles can move through ground vehicles.

That’s interesting, displacement contains the statement that they can’t be moved through, but the engaged entry does not.

This is the refrencing rule that is being discussed:

PG25

When a repulsor vehicle mini’s final movement position would overlap one or more trooper minis during a compulsory move, those minis are displaced.

• Trooper units that are engaged cannot be moved through or displaced

The line @azavander quoted is exactly why I would like to see an FAQ. I really don't think the intent is that engagements effectively create impassable terrain for repulsor vehicles. But as of now, that is how it reads.

The wording has been that where the rules say something cannot be done is that they took precident, so real question would be would this result in a crash since the movement is stopped short in the same way as hitting a building.

2 hours ago, syrath said:

The wording has been that where the rules say something cannot be done is that they took precident, so real question would be would this result in a crash since the movement is stopped short in the same way as hitting a building.

Right, isn’t that precisely what OP’s question was?

20 hours ago, azavander said:

This is the refrencing rule that is being discussed:

PG25

When a repulsor vehicle mini’s final movement position would overlap one or more trooper minis during a compulsory move, those minis are displaced.

• Trooper units that are engaged cannot be moved through or displaced

This rule takes precedent thanks to the golden rules. Cannot is absolute. So nothing is moving over or through engaged units.

14 hours ago, syrath said:

The wording has been that where the rules say something cannot be done is that they took precident, so real question would be would this result in a crash since the movement is stopped short in the same way as hitting a building.

I don't think there is an official answer to this. I know my TO talked to Alex about it and he said vehicles that need to end movement early because of terrain will not suffer damage. And by terrain, I mean stuff you can legally fly over, but cannot balance the mini upon, like a barricade. You just end the movement early and act like you completed the move.

It's not official, but it's better than nothing. RAW still states it suffers damage, regardless of the reason.