Hey guys,

I've got another event coming up and thought I'd shake things up a bit and try something new. I've have not really used Maro regularly and feel that if I did use him, I did not use him properly.

I always feel that you need to use your heroes abilities otherwise what is the point in even bringing them into the fight, so I decided to go with a 2x3 Oathsworn instead of Death Knights because you got a lot more points wise, the points I also saved from having the Oathsworn instead of the Death Knights allowed me to upgrade the Oathsworn quite considerably, although I am quite apprehensive to run Maro without any upgrades because I feel his potential is wasted, but I also think that he is such an expensive unit points wise that I am scared to invest to much in him and end up getting him killed! Haha...

Reanimates [50] 3x3
Deathcaller [5]
Support Carrion Lancer [6]
Blighted Vexillum Bearer [3]
Simultaneous Orders [2]
Total Unit Cost: 66

Reanimate Archers [18] 2x1
Combat Ingenuity [6]
Total Unit Cost: 24

Ankaur Maro [40] 1x1
Total Unit Cost: 40

Carrion Lancers [15] 1x1
Total Unit Cost: 15

Oathsworn Cavalry [46] 2x3
Tempered Steel [3]
Raven Tabards [2]
Column Tactics [4]
Total Unit Cost: 55

Total: 200 Points

My local meta at the moment includes 2 Latari Armies, 2 Waiqar (including myself) and 1 Daqan (if this helps with list building and things to consider). We are getting more players though, which I am excited about and will hopefully see some new players at this upcoming event.

Anyone willing to give me any advice about this build would be greatly appreciated.

I'm not that experienced, but what is your expected output of Maro? Is he likely to ad 5 trays and deal 5 damage? That would on paper be close to the 40p he costs, but the delay of the necromancy compared to having the corresponding units from start might make him worth like 25p?

And yes, I'm salty after loosing when using him

In fact, I'm starting to question if either Waiqar hero is worth their cost. I mean a 2x2 Lancer unit is not that much more expensive than a hero, and then we are talking a whole different level of staying power (36 damage absorbation vs 12/10) and at least matching in damage/mortal strike output.

And as mentiones in my post above, if you think about the delayed deployment aspect of Ankaur's necromancy, it's worth quite less bit of points than having the units from start.

Ardus' feast of crows ability does not do it for me either. If you skip him you can afford to run the larger unit and enabling the upgrades anyway and getting the extra damage absorbation of a larger unit.

I would love to be proven wrong since I like the concept of heroes and I'm a waiqar player, but Waiqar is just not getting the results in tournaments with hero lists from what I see.

So yay for Lancers and nay for heroes, at the moment.

21 hours ago, Maktorius said:

I'm not that experienced, but what is your expected output of Maro?

I'm hoping that he could at least summon 2 trays for the archers and then support the reanimates over the course of the game. I have not really thought about him doing damage unless it is to try and heal himself, which will have me dependant on unstable runes and actually getting surges on the rolls and with no upgrades or re-rolls to help me out, is easier said than done.

15 minutes ago, Maktorius said:

In fact, I'm starting to question if either Waiqar hero is worth their cost.

I play against Latari most of the time and my Waiqar heroes are way more expensive than theirs, even when embedding them which makes me sometimes wonder also.

17 minutes ago, Maktorius said:

Ardus' feast of crows ability does not do it for me either. If you skip him you can afford to run the larger unit and enabling the upgrades anyway and getting the extra damage absorbation of a larger unit.

I would love to be proven wrong since I like the concept of heroes and I'm a waiqar player, but Waiqar is just not getting the results in tournaments with hero lists from what I see.

I actually really dig Feast of Crows, it allowed me access to lingering dead on my 6 tray reanimates and raven standard bearer on my 4 tray archers. I love having Raven-Standard bearer on my archers as it allows you to range attack at initiative 4, which is fast! Allowing me to blight other ranged units before they get a chance to attack my archers or other units, which helped me win a store championship.

I think I just need to try the list out and see what happens. I could always try and lose the carrion lancer or some of the oathsworn if I wanna give Maro some upgrades, but if I'm just going to use him to bring trays back as his primary function and also take him just for his hero ability, do I really need to?

1 hour ago, Zaaik said:

I think I just need to try the list out and see what happens. I could always try and lose the carrion lancer or some of the oathsworn if I wanna give Maro some upgrades, but if I'm just going to use him to bring trays back as his primary function and also take him just for his hero ability, do I really need to?

Last time I played Maro i went with Regenerative Magic and Fortuna's dice to really try to max him for necromancy (before I realized the problem with the necro delay in terms of value). I played vs Uthuk. He managed to do something like 4 damage and raise 3 trays (only single stable runes on the turns I had to necro), then he was intercepted by the (QUICK!!!) enemy due to not having enough units deployed from start to protect him. So even though I outflanked his berzerkerstar with my 2x2 Lancers on my right flank and ended upp eliminating it with 2 lancers (with Ranked discipline) left, my left flank with 3x2 Reanimates (with executioner) and 3x2 Archers was just to soft for the 2x2 rippers, 2x1 threshers and the Big Mac, and could not bring trays back nearly as fast as they were lost. The game ended by elimination with only Ravos left on the field.

I'm confident that if I had run another 2x2 Lancer with ranked discipline instead of Maro, I would have won it (considering the initial flank on the berzerkerstar)

Maro on his lonesome is tricky. Costs so many points. The problem with regenerative magic is on the turns you heal you aren't reviving dudes. I really think you need to use the violent forces fortuna dice combo to make him worth while. You use his ability turn 1 and 2 to give your archers rerolls and then blast away the rest of the game. Otherwise the list looks good. I would try to sneak metered march on the reanimates as being able to dial up the late march and stop just inside range 3 makes that death caller block super good at controlling the battle field and pace of the game.